Leica M EV1: The first M with EVF instead of Rangefinder

[Dazzajl]

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8 minutes ago, hroark said:

Do you think we could call it an (expensive) Fuji X-E5 that only support manual focus?  /s

We could. But it lacks the IBIS, the smaller form factor, the jpeg processing options, third party lens support, accurate exif data, tilting screen and it will really piss people off  

[Chito]

IBIS is probably impossible on an M mount.. you'd need a larger image circle so you can move the sensor to compensate.

[Kiwimac]

I can see it selling well to those who’s eyes can’t manage the optical system in a proper M. 
 

I’m neither for it or against it at this point. Although the lenses are larger, the X2D is now effectively direct competition for this without being a great deal larger in the body. 

[mujk]

33 minutes ago, FrozenInTime said:

Found an image of the camera without lens

So it's the same roller as before. The drawing in the manual has not managed to show it correctly.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited Thursday at 07:48 PM by mujk

[Dazzajl]

5 minutes ago, Chito said:

So from what I gather it's just an M11 without the rangefinder and an integrated visoflex right?  No advantages whatsoever? 

It’s a nicer EVF than the viso offers and it doesn’t ruin the ‘most gorgeous camera to shoot with’ aesthetic like a barnacle. The value of that advantage is clearly very personal. 

[lct]

7 minutes ago, Chito said:

So from what I gather it's just an M11 without the rangefinder and an integrated visoflex right?  No advantages whatsoever? 

At least one, apparently, the built-in EVF has more resolution than the Visoflex 2.

[SrMi]

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12 minutes ago, Chito said:

So from what I gather it's just an M11 without the rangefinder and an integrated visoflex right?  No advantages whatsoever? 

The advantage is clear for those who use M11 mostly with Visoflex or LCD. I am grateful for the choice.

[NZDavid]

From the Leica PR: "In 2006, Leica transported the soul of the analogue M-Camera to the digital age with the M8..." 

Ah, soul! I'm glad a technology company still uses this word.

Looks like a very logical and smooth integration of new technology with time-proven good design, and I am sure it will prove useful for some. At first glance, I don't need all that technology (smartphone integration, for example), although I can see it's a modern necessity, so a bit complex (and pricey) for me. Quite happy with the M10 or I'd consider a Q.

In many ways, a Q with interchangeable AF lenses seems a logical next move for Leica.

A question: M is for Meßsucher (rangefinder) so should the M-EV1 really continue to have M in its name?

[BWColor]

40 minutes ago, algrove said:

Well, with the EV1 selling for US$1700 more than a 44x33 sensor camera with AF and 10 stop IBIS plus a 1TB internal memory versus 64GB, I can understand your non-enthusiasm.

And the X2Dii with an XCDv lens is a joy to use in manual focus mode.  It is a joy to use and so far my favorite lens is the 38v, which makes this a fairly compact camera, but it is cross shopped with an SL-3 and not a small ‘M’ body camera.  Also, at least the newest lenses are modern APO designs with slight compromise to reduce lens size.  Lens size quickly outstrips what is available with the ‘M’.  My 21mm Super Elmar is quite small compared to the Hasselblad 25mm f/2.5 XCD v lens.

 

[BWColor]

16 minutes ago, lct said:

At least one, apparently, the built-in EVF has more resolution than the Visoflex 2.

True, but the Visoflex 2 will rotate 90 degrees, which is a feature that I use on the street.

[IkarusJohn]

41 minutes ago, Tobers said:

If you just want to use your M lenses, stick them on a Sony body with an adapter.

And there we have the clearest and best reason for Leica making the EV-1.

[rustyrus]

What a joke Leica- 

 

You slapped the VisoFlex inside and called it good. So much for innovation!!!!!!!!! REally reall really really disappointed 

 

You revolutionzed manual focus cameras, can we have some of that effort back? What an absolute joke! This lazy release is legitimately has me questioning any further investment into the eco-system. Please tell me this is just an early April fools and you are going to update firmware tomorrow with some actual new MF aids that is helpful. Good Lord 

Edited Thursday at 08:13 PM by rustyrus

[adan]

18 minutes ago, Chito said:

So from what I gather it's just an M11 without the rangefinder and an integrated visoflex right?  No advantages whatsoever? 

Just taking prices from a well-known Leica dealer...

M11-P plus Visoflex 2: £8000 + £640 = £8640

M EV1: £6840 - with less bulk and weight, and higher-resolution EVF.

 

[lct]

8 minutes ago, BWColor said:

True, but the Visoflex 2 will rotate 90 degrees, which is a feature that I use on the street.

Interesting feature for macro, too, but the MEV1 is not supposed to replace the M11 that will keep selling well hopefully.

[Olaf_ZG]

Don’t understand all those (very) negative reactions… what did you all expect? A x2d2 packed in a m body?

it is a m-ev, a M with an evf. It will be great in use with wide/tele lenses, wide open, fast lenses.

it is expensive. True. So is the m11 already.

Many people will enjoy this camera. You’re such a tough public…

Edited Thursday at 08:21 PM by Olaf_ZG

[mujk]

6 minutes ago, IkarusJohn said:

And there we have the clearest and best reason for Leica making the EV-1.

Well, the EV-1 doesn't really seem to compete with any of the Sony models when it comes to features or price. The SL-3 and e.g. A7RV are much more similar.

[hroark]

40 minutes ago, Chito said:

IBIS is probably impossible on an M mount.. you'd need a larger image circle so you can move the sensor to compensate.

I'm not sure it's the image circle that needs to be bigger; it's usually the sensor that needs to be bigger (and since this sensor is in cameras that have IBIS, the sensor is probably already sized).   With that said, I suspect you are still correct to keep to the M form-factor IBIS may not be possible.  The sensor-to-flange distance on M cameras is 28mm (maybe 27.8mm).  I think the total camera is only about 39mm thick, leaving little room behind the sensor for the needed electronics, the LCD screen, and the IBIS mechanism.

[IkarusJohn]

2 minutes ago, mujk said:

Well, the EV-1 doesn't really seem to compete with any of the Sony models when it comes to features or price. The SL-3 and e.g. A7RV are much more similar.

Okay, so having used M lenses on Sonys (a NEX and the A7r) I really wanted an EVF based M.  For a start, the A7r is a Sony with buttons everywhere and the worst menu system on the market.  I bought my M9 for the very reason that I didn’t want a camera like this.  I’m a photographer, not a play station user.  Worse, the Sony sensors were not optimised for M lenses - fine in the middle of the image or with telecentric lenses, not so much for the rest.

Sony’s cameras are fantastic with the best lenses from Zeiss etc, I’m sure, but this is a Leica camera, not a Sony.  If you base your system on the fabulous M lenses, a Sony isn’t the solution.

The T camera was an improvement on the Sonys, but with the EVF mounted, it isn’t much smaller than an M camera.  And, it's APS-C, which means my 28 Summaron becomes effectively 42mm.  To get close to my preferred wide, I need to use my 21 Summilux, which is not ideal for what is supposed to be a small camera.  I used to use my Distagon 15/2.8 on my NEX, and it was fun, but not quite good enough …

Then along came the SL, which is perfect … except it is quite big and quite heavy with a whole lot of stuff you don’t need if all you want to do is use your M lenses (I’ve travelled extensively with this camera, including multi-day tramping, with my pack, food and the 24-90 & 90-280 zooms).  The L mount is vastly superior to the aged M mount, but pointless if you’re just using M lenses.  Don’t get me wrong, I use my 24-90 zoom and adapted R and other lenses on my SL.  We’re discussing the M EV-1, right?

So, if you like the M11, then this another variant on that (along with daft ideas like the M11-M and the M11-D).  Nothing more. It has an EVF. If you don’t want an EVF, then that’s fine, buy an M11-P.  But, if you want an M camera with an EVF, this is just what the doctor ordered, and nothing more.

[Chito]

16 minutes ago, hroark said:

I'm not sure it's the image circle that needs to be bigger; it's usually the sensor that needs to be bigger (and since this sensor is in cameras that have IBIS, the sensor is probably already sized).   With that said, I suspect you are still correct to keep to the M form-factor IBIS may not be possible.  The sensor-to-flange distance on M cameras is 28mm (maybe 27.8mm).  I think the total camera is only about 39mm thick, leaving little room behind the sensor for the needed electronics, the LCD screen, and the IBIS mechanism.

As I understand it, in IBIS the sensor moves to compensate for camera shake.    So a larger image circle is needed since the sensor might drift out of the image projected by the lens.    

So in order for an M camera to have IBIS the sensor should be smaller than full frame.

Edited Thursday at 08:48 PM by Chito

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Hallo,

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[Paulus]

vor 6 Stunden schrieb Ne314satel:

It'll definitely be a commercial failure. I can still focus on the screen with the M11, but without a rangefinder, it'll just be an outdated 30-year-old (or even 50-year-old) thing—no autofocus, no Ibis, etc. This camera was definitely made by designers, not photographers.

I believe this was one of the things on which  Erwin Puts disagreed with Leica…and his parting.