Kodak rumors true? Film M camera ... future?

[cesc]

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Hi everyone,

I just read the news about Kodak potentially stopping film production, and it got me thinking about what this might mean for us who still shoot with film cameras — especially the Leica Film M bodies.

I shoot and print a lot in the darkroom, so Kodak’s films (basically  Tri-X and HC-110)  have always been a big part of my process. I know there are other film stocks out there, but Kodak has been such a cornerstone that it feels like a pretty big shift if they really pull the plug.

How do you all see this affecting the use and value of film M cameras? Do you think we’ll just adapt with other stocks (Ilford, Foma, etc.), or would this change the long-term viability of shooting and developing film at home?

Curious to hear what others think — especially those who also spend a lot of time in the darkroom. I am really fan with Tri-X and ROdinal. Should I look for another combination soon??

[nitroplait]

You read a false rumor. 

[colonel]

Yes, this fake news

[George Collier]

I was concerned about this too, a couple of years ago, not because of reading something, just how hard it is sometimes to get Tri-x, which I've used starting in the late 50's (I was 10) when they dropped the "safety factor" and raised the ASA to 400. I've been using FP4 since the 70's, when I want something finer, but Tri-x has always been it for me, no matter the developer. A couple of years ago, after trying many developers, I switched to Rodinal for everything.

So what to do about Tri-x - what if they discontinue it? So I decided to compare HP5 with Trix, not by side by side comparison, but just shooting both for a while and see how I feel (I scan everything with an Epson 850). After a few months of this, I just stopped buying Tri-x and didn't miss it. (although it still feels funny). It's cheaper too, not that that matters.

[sometimesmaybe]

2 hours ago, cesc said:

Do you think we’ll just adapt with other stocks (Ilford, Foma, etc.), or would this change the long-term viability of shooting and developing film at home?

there are lots of options in terms of BNW emulsions and developers. 

but things might be very different in the colour film space. kodak basically dominates here. Fuji seems to have given up and mainly makes instax. there are some new players coming through... Harman / Ilford, Orwo and Lucky (and even LLL is looking into making their own emulsion) 

[frame-it]

if only people searched the forum...

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/423635-kodak-may-cease-operations-soon/

[bobtodrick]

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First, fake news.

Second, as a dealer Kodak accounts for less than 20% of our B&W film sales (we stock Ilford, Adox, Fomapan, Rollei, Ferrania and others).  If Kodak were gone it wouldn't affect M value in the least.

[Don Flynn]

2 hours ago, George Collier said:

I was concerned about this too, a couple of years ago, not because of reading something, just how hard it is sometimes to get Tri-x, which I've used starting in the late 50's (I was 10) when they dropped the "safety factor" and raised the ASA to 400. I've been using FP4 since the 70's, when I want something finer, but Tri-x has always been it for me, no matter the developer. A couple of years ago, after trying many developers, I switched to Rodinal for everything.

So what to do about Tri-x - what if they discontinue it? So I decided to compare HP5 with Trix, not by side by side comparison, but just shooting both for a while and see how I feel (I scan everything with an Epson 850). After a few months of this, I just stopped buying Tri-x and didn't miss it. (although it still feels funny). It's cheaper too, not that that matters.

Price of HP 400 went up but worst case if Kodak did go under I'm good with it. I actually keep meaning to try Kentmere 400 but it's only a $1.00 cheaper than Tri X at B&H and since I buy 10 packs when I need it I'm sticking with Tri X 

[jakontil]

Even if kodak stops, i would live as i mainly shoot with BW ilford, now i feel the options even more widespread..i wouldnt worry

[Jipster]

3 minutes ago, jakontil said:

Even if kodak stops, i would live as i mainly shoot with BW ilford, now i feel the options even more widespread..i wouldnt worry

There is no truth to these rumors. Made up. Kodak is actually doing well, it just did not hit all its targets. It just invested in additional film production last year.

[adan]

Kodak filed a legally-required regulatory statement concerning their debt and income balance.

Similar to the filing Leica was required to make in 2004. "If there are no changes, we may run out of money soon." Changes were made - Leica survives, as will Kodak.

Just a part of keeping stockholders/investors informed.

...........

It does surprise me sometimes how many folks who can apparently afford very expensive cameras occasionally seem so woefully uninformed about standard business practices and regulations.

I mean, I am definitely not an MBA - but I do have a general idea of what is involved.

[spero pa]

I will can highly recommend a first class Black and White film manufacturing company that has been around for about 145 years - I have been a loyal customer for many decades “ILFORD” !!!. I have my own Darkroom and produced many Exhibition and Camera Club Monochrome mounted prints.  TRY ILFORD B/W DELTA RANGE + all of the other product choices Films papers /chemistry etc I’ve have never been disappointed, M3 enthusiast Spero PA

[250swb]

11 hours ago, cesc said:

 

How do you all see this affecting the use and value of film M cameras? Do you think we’ll just adapt with other stocks (Ilford, Foma, etc.), or would this change the long-term viability of shooting and developing film at home?

 

I haven't used Kodak B&W film for decades, and I still manage to fill my fridge with film. Even if Kodak shutting down was real news there would be a bewildering supply of film available in every film format, and Ilford will still make you a box of custom sized sheet film if you want. It is true that demand often exceeds supply because manufacturers are making less film than before, but faced with that it's an opportunity to try something new for a change, and given you develop your film at home you should be hard wired to enjoy new challenges and  experimentation.

As to the value of Leica M cameras and the supply of film Leica themselves are helping out with their 'Monopan 50' film (Adox HR-50 in disguise) so maybe give that a try and find out if the world still revolves around Kodak at all. 

[Doc Henry]

Hi All , read this . https://www.digitalcameraworld.com/cameras/film-cameras/kodak-shares-surprising-statistics-on-the-rise-of-film-as-factory-reopens-after-shutdown

False rumors are going strong these days.

It's logical for a business to stop when more and more young people are using film photography.

Best

Henry

[Bliz]

19 hours ago, cesc said:

I know there are other film stocks out there, but Kodak has been such a cornerstone that it feels like a pretty big shift if they really pull the plug.

I have been shooting b&w film for a few years, I yet have to shoot a single roll of kodak b&w film. The real problem if kodak dies is in color film.

 

@adan "It does surprise me sometimes how many folks who can apparently afford very expensive cameras occasionally seem so woefully uninformed about standard business practices and regulations."

Why? I work in healthcare, I'm clueless about business regulations. I can still buy a Leica, at least a used one lol.

Edited September 1 by Bliz

[adan]

3 hours ago, Bliz said:

Why? I work in healthcare, I'm clueless about business regulations.

A fair question (and thanks for your work in the field of medicine).

My responses would be:

- Why would working in health care prevent learning something about business (or anything else) as well?

Short version: there is no such thing as "too much" knowledge.

Longer: As it happens, my first job out of college was also in health care. I was hired as a technical photographer at a teaching hospital's A/V department. As part of my duties, I had to run a weekly audio-visual lecture series, by MDs, for MDs and students. As a start, that required learning to operate the auditorium gear for pictures and sound and videos. It also required being present during the lectures - and rather than read a book or otherwise use that time, I listened to the lectures, and learned something about medicine as well. That made me better able to communicate with the MDs - in their own jargon - about the medical subjects I had to photograph at other times. The docs were really pleased that I now understood what they were talking about, and could "ask the right questions" when it came to photographing surgeries (before, during and after); tools; radiological images (X-ray, ultrasound, nuclear-isotope) And so on. I began to get "outside work" from them ($$), in preparing their "publish or perish" articles for medical journals. When the A/V department boss quit for a different job, my knowledge above and beyond my basic training (photography) made me a shoe-in to take over his management position (more $$).

(The $$ as such were not that significant, but the resumé and portfolio enhancements got me into graduate school and thence into ever-more-creative jobs.)

Not a Leica picture (thus posted small), but made with my "Leica-M training-wheels" at the time; Canon AT-1 and 24mm lens.

Pediatric kidney surgery, 1981.

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As to your "Why?"

 - Because not paying attention to the world, in all its various conditions and influences (including global economies and their regulations), can lead to unpleasant (or worse) surprises. It is like walking into a busy street with one's nose pressed to a smartphone.

Any institution can fail financially - even governments can go bankrupt.

And back on topic...

I remember the poor member here who was still shooting Kodachrome long after both the film and processing had been discontinued (and announced as a Kodak business decision), and was shocked - shocked - to find out that all the color pictures he had made over the previous 12 months would never be anything but unprocessed film (or at best very poor B&W negatives).

He was (apparently) clueless about business also.