Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Hello,

I’ve been really impressed with the beautiful image quality of Light Lens Lab (LLL) lenses. 

However, I wanted to share some feedback from my experience with five of their lenses —feedback that doesn’t quite align with the “high-quality photographic equipment” messaging of LLL or some reviews suggesting Leica/Voigtlander-level build quality.

Here’s what I encountered:

  • LLL 50 mm f/1.2 (1966 vintage): I experienced noticeable play in the focusing mechanism and a distinct clicking sound when turning the focus ring from one direction to the other. I sent it to LLL Canada for repair (at my expense), waited for service in China, and while it was partially improved, the issue wasn’t fully resolved. By comparison, my Leica Noctilux 50mm f/1.2 focuses smoothly and silently.
  • LLL 35 mm 8-element (regular black paint finish): After just mounting and unmounting the lens hood, the black paint began chipping. My older Leica and Voigtlander lenses —some over 60 years old — haven’t shown this issue.
  • LLL 28 mm 9-element: This lens stuck several times and can’t get off the M Body (maybe a LLL mount tolerance issue on that lens) and I was concerned about damaging the rangefinder coupling mechanism on my M. The first replacement LLL sent had a front housing ring that wasn’t glued properly and could rotate freely. Only the third lens I received functions reliably. I covered shipping costs for both faulty lenses.
  • LLL 50 mm Rigid: This one has been flawless and performs beautifully!
  • LLL Z21 (just received): Unfortunately, it has a strong back-focus issue out of factory— at infinity, the rangefinder patch won’t align, making the lens unusable on a rangefinder. I tested it on multiple M bodies, and it’s definitely faulty.

Out of the seven lenses I’ve received (including replacements), five had issues — an error rate of around 71%.

David and the LLL customer service team have always been friendly and responsive, for which I’m grateful. 

Still, the cumulative effort — time, money, and frustration — has taken a toll on my confidence in their product’s quality, reliability, and longevity. In many countries, there’s also no local distributor or service partner, which makes the situation more difficult.

I want to highlight something important: I truly value the distinct, beautiful rendering of these lenses — otherwise, I wouldn’t have continued buying them. They’re also more affordable than Leica lenses, and aimed at comparable price performance levels to Voigtlander. But when prices range from €700 to €2,100 for a LLL lens, customers rightfully expect matching build quality.

Adding to the challenge, I haven’t received any personal response to my recent Z21 complaint/warranty issue for almost  two weeks from LLL — only an automated reply:

“Hello, Dear valued customer,
There will be a delay in our email replies as we are away from our desk... However, we will still receive your messages and reply to you as soon as possible. We apologize for the inconvenience caused and thank you for understanding and supporting our research and development.”

My Z21 is unusable and just sitting on the shelf, and I hope LLL will react to my emails and get back to me soon and provide a solution for the defective lens.

I sincerely hope LLL can address these quality control issues in their small-batch production and more important, improve the responsiveness of their service. Other manufacturers do experience occasional hiccups, sure — but they often have local support and are easier to reach.

Thank you for reading, and I’d be happy to stay in touch and provide updates.

Best regards,

Guenther

Edited by GG007GG
Language
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

They could but also they don't have to fix anything because you keep coming back to them.

- I've bought 3 Leica items new (lenses and camera). 0% defect rate.  

- I've bought 4 Voigtlander lenses new - 0% defects. 

- I've bought one Zeiss lens - 0 defect 

I could tell you exactly where those items were manufactured. I could post a photo of the manufacturing facilities. I could also give you a full breakdown of the company's organizational chart. 

Can you tell me any of those things about Light Lens Lab? Other than it's in China somewhere? I'm actually quite shocked that they replied to you at all. So I guess that's good for them, but I'm not surprised you're having so many issues. Making clones of other people's lenses isn't an easy thing to do, and when they're selling them to you cheap, that means there are going to be problems. I would rather get a Voigtlander for the same price. 

If you're willing to put up with the defects, then they really have no motivation to fix anything. I guess they have refund policies? Do they honor them? I have no idea. 

Honestly I find it quite perplexing why do many intelligent people just accept what this "company" says about themselves when non of it can really be verified. They claim they make highly crafted products in small batches to control their high quality. And here you are. Nearly all the lenses you bought from them had problems. And the last one God knows if you're just going to use it as a doorstop. If they never respond, what would you do? Who to contact? 

For all we know all these china lenses are all the same people making them, in the same warehouse somewhere all next to each other, all owned by the same family ripping off other people's designs and just inventing a different story for each brand. 

I'm sure the LLL fans and defenders will come soon and say I'm nuts. But who are you defending? Mr. Zhou? Who is that? You're defending ghosts. 

I don't have to tell you about what you're dealing with because the proof is in what you just said happened to you with their product. 

My advice is: Give your business to someone else and stop buying this product. As for your lens now that doesn't work (yet another one) I wish you luck. Maybe sell it to a Fuji guy. 

Not only is Light Lens Lab not registered as a company anywhere (otherwise you would know who to sue), but I don't think Light Lens Lab is even registered as a brand name. You could come up with a product tomorrow and call it Light Lens Lab. What will they do? Sue you? To sue you would have to disclosed all your information. You think they'll do that?

In other words, who are you buying this from? Do you even really know?

Who do you think is making these "Mandler" branded lenses?

Edited by sinquerer
  • Like 6
Link to post
Share on other sites

On 7/13/2025 at 1:06 AM, sinquerer said:

They could but also they don't have to fix anything because you keep coming back to them.

- I've bought 3 Leica items new (lenses and camera). 0% defect rate.  

- I've bought 4 Voigtlander lenses new - 0% defects. 

- I've bought one Zeiss lens - 0 defect 

I could tell you exactly where those items were manufactured. I could post a photo of the manufacturing facilities. I could also give you a full breakdown of the company's organizational chart. 

Can you tell me any of those things about Light Lens Lab? Other than it's in China somewhere? I'm actually quite shocked that they replied to you at all. So I guess that's good for them, but I'm not surprised you're having so many issues. Making clones of other people's lenses isn't an easy thing to do, and when they're selling them to you cheap, that means there are going to be problems. I would rather get a Voigtlander for the same price. 

If you're willing to put up with the defects, then they really have no motivation to fix anything. I guess they have refund policies? Do they honor them? I have no idea. 

Honestly I find it quite perplexing why do many intelligent people just accept what this "company" says about themselves when non of it can really be verified. They claim they make highly crafted products in small batches to control their high quality. And here you are. Nearly all the lenses you bought from them had problems. And the last one God knows if you're just going to use it as a doorstop. If they never respond, what would you do? Who to contact? 

For all we know all these china lenses are all the same people making them, in the same warehouse somewhere all next to each other, all owned by the same family ripping off other people's designs and just inventing a different story for each brand. 

I'm sure the LLL fans and defenders will come soon and say I'm nuts. But who are you defending? Mr. Zhou? Who is that? You're defending ghosts. 

I don't have to tell you about what you're dealing with because the proof is in what you just said happened to you with their product. 

My advice is: Give your business to someone else and stop buying this product. As for your lens now that doesn't work (yet another one) I wish you luck. Maybe sell it to a Fuji guy. 

Not only is Light Lens Lab not registered as a company anywhere (otherwise you would know who to sue), but I don't think Light Lens Lab is even registered as a brand name. You could come up with a product tomorrow and call it Light Lens Lab. What will they do? Sue you? To sue you would have to disclosed all your information. You think they'll do that?

In other words, who are you buying this from? Do you even really know?

Who do you think is making these "Mandler" branded lenses?

Interesting.. please spill more information about them.. i love their lenses, have the elcan and 8E..

specifically the 8E, the experience when mounting it not as smooth as the elcan.. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Ok, I have the LLL Elcan 50mm and the LLL Rigid 50mm, I bought from LLL because 50mm is not a focal length I use very often and I did not want to spend Leica prices to have such a FL in my kit, ( even though in recent years I did own both the 50mm Leica Summilux and Summicron lenses but returned them because I didn't like their size and weight on my M bodies ).........So LLL fulfills a niche for me that's mostly around their pricing, the lenses I bought from them have had no adverse issues and I am fine with them, but there's a part of me that says I should have gone with Voigtlander choices rather than LLL, for some of the OP's reasons I guess. I do prefer the build quality of Voigtlander's lenses overall and I do like their ever expanding range of new designs...............BUT again, if I could afford to do so I would go with Leica lenses for my M's every time even for FL's that I use rarely, but the wallet reminds me that now and again I do have to eat so I have to be somewhat financially rational in some choices. 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Since I started with Leica in the 1960s I have a nostalgic spot for the Summicron designs of that time - really enjoy using them. But when I bought my own Summicron 50 & 35 it was 1969, and I got the then new ver 3 50 & ver 2 35. Both gave me great results for 4 decades, but I always wished I'd gotten the previous designs - not for results, but because they were the ones I had wanted. After retirement I expanded my Leica collection, and did add clean examples of both the Rigid and 8E - but the 8E was the M3 version.

Anyway, the LLL 8e immediately appealed to me, since Leica wasn't making new ones. I finally bought one hand have been fully satisfied. When I hear about their Rigid I got an early one, and really liked the closer focus than the 1 m original (I have 2 originals and a DR). The LLL rigid did have noticeable focus error, so I had DAG calibrate it, and it's been great since then.

They check all the right boxes for me. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

On 7/12/2025 at 6:46 PM, GG007GG said:
  • LLL 35 mm 8-element (regular black paint finish): After just mounting and unmounting the lens hood, the black paint began chipping. My older Leica and Voigtlander lenses —some over 60 years old — haven’t shown this issue...

Your Leica and Voigtlander lenses will have been given a Black-Chrome finish; not Black-Paint. The B-Chr lenses are made using aluminium which has been anodised black rather than painted. This anodisation process was introduced by Leica (sometime in the 1960's?) on their black-finish lenses - and bodies - specifically because the B'Paint finish will 'brass-up' over time.  Anodising aluminium offers a much, MUCH more durable end-product in comparison to painted brass.

Incidentally these early Black-Paint M-items are, nowadays, sought-after by collectors and users alike (and priced accordingly).

Strange as it may seem this tendency for 'brassing' is one of the main attractions - and chief selling points - of certain examples of Leica's modern cameras and lenses which have been given the old-fashioned Black-Paint-Over-Brass-Body finish.

It might well be that LLL have used a thinner / less durable paint formulation - which will 'wear' relatively quickly - as they have found that buyers like the brassing look and, indeed, 'Black Paint with Brassing' is one of their regular - and popular - finish options.

There are even some members here who have deliberately artificially 'aged' their cameras, by sanding-down various edges etc., to give them this 'well-used' look.

Philip.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Over the last 3-4 years, I have acquired the following LLL lens:

8e in bare brass

8e in stainless steel

8e collapsible

SP2 in bare brass

Elcan in black paint

I feel I am kind of qualified to assess the quality of the product and the service, legitimacy of the company.

I think the products are mostly fine. There always is a case when the product doesn't live up to the standard. I personally encountered a couple of incidents such as focus shift, focus slightly out of spec, etc. But most of the time, it was resolved quickly in a couple of weeks. The N.A. rep David Chen lives somewhere in Scarborough, Ontario. I can't say anything good or bad personally about him. But I think he is doing a OK job.

However, at current price point, I wouldn't buy any LLL lenses. I think they are worth no more than 60-70% of what they are asking for.

If you can, go to China, get a hefty discount from Ali, Taobao, Temu. What they are selling at North America or Europe price is outrageous. David Chen said once that the owner Mr. Zhou is very strict about the discount and he doesn't allow any retailers to discount the lenses without his permission. But, nobody listens to him, and discount is offered under the table.

I once got contact with a seller on eBay, and then I walked into his apartment in Shanghai and paid half of the advertised price for Elcan. Like it or not, this is how business is done in China.

Don't pay the full price, and don't believe the no-discount BS.

Edited by Elliot Harper
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Any product in commerce is worth what people are willing to pay, and what equivalent items competitors are offering. LLL may be much cheaper in China, but most of us have no reliable channel except our local importers. There aren't many competitors offering the same physical designs - maybe equivalent FL and images, but not the same look and feel, except used old Leica lenses in whatever condition. The LLL prices seem reasonable given those conditions as long as the build quality is acceptable.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I can add my experience...

I've owned three LLL lenses (Nearly five, but one was returned to the seller and I cancelled my pre-order for the 28mm)

Lens one was a black 8e, which was totally ok mechanically and optically.  Focus was spot on and the results great.

Lens two was a silver finish Elcan, which developed a problem with the aperture ring (became really stiff and notchy) and was repaired under the warranty.  I sold it on as soon as I got it back fixed.

Lens three was a black finish Elcan, which had problems with the focus being out at wide aperture/close distance.  I returned it for repair under the warranty and it was still out when I received it back some two months later.  I returned it again through the original vendor Shotenkobo in Japan, and they managed to get it replaced for another copy which they tested for me on an M body to check for errors in the focus calibration.  I was relieved to receive a good copy at last but in the mean time had paid for a pre-order of the 9e 28mm and so cancelled it as I'd lost faith.

The experience had also cost me over £100 in shipping to and fro, which was annoying.

Before buying the black 8e I bought a used one from a reputable London dealer which turned out to have an issue with the front of the lens being loose laterally.  I returned it for a refund.

I do like the Elcan though.  Nice size for a 50mm and I love the character of the images it makes.

I also bought a WEISU 35mm optical viewfinder copy in black, which was good.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • 1 month later...

Bought the 50mm 8E and the 50mm/1.2 1966. So far, no issues: cosmetically, mechanically and optically.

Waiting for Elcan as there is, supposedly, a production delay due to some Film Project. Sounds like they are launching a film emulsion soon. 

By the way, the prices on eBay and AliExpress are now, generally, higher than the MSRP on their corporate website. Looks like the market is hotter than the supply. I did not see anything in Temu and TaoBao seems like it's only in Chinese.

Edited by arthury
Link to post
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, arthury said:

...Waiting for Elcan as there is, supposedly, a production delay due to some Film Project. Sounds like they are launching a film emulsion soon...

This is the latest news which they sent to me a fortnight ago;

https://lightlenslab.com/blogs/upcoming-project/film-project-update-iv-finishing-and-packaging?se_activity_id=152581996778&syclid=d2u4t3hqanpc73cjc690&utm_campaign=Film+Project+IV%3A+Finishing+and+Packaging_152581996778&utm_medium=email&utm_source=shopify_email

Philip.

Link to post
Share on other sites

26 minutes ago, pippy said:

Thanks!

Not sure how large is the film market at this time in history. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I’ve got the LLL 35 eight element in glossy paint, HCB edition. 
 

I really like it. It seems well built with neat paintwork and so forth. 
 

If it has any faults, they’ve yet to present themselves - other than those inherent in replicating a lens that was produced before I was born, such as flare, ghosting etc. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...