M11-D internal memory fault and freezing

[setuporg]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

So it happened finally — after a trip to New York that filled up the internal memory of my month’s old M11-D, I cannot download the photos from it.

When using the internal memory, I was checking the remaining shots.  The counter finally went under 999 and started to decrease.  At about 500 it suddenly said Full.  I inserted an SD card and continued shooting.  Coming home tried to download.  Only downloaded the SD images and hung on the first internal (with the last number) and never got it.  Image Capture takes a very long time to list the files.  When they begin listing they are shown without previews.  Nothing could be downloaded, IC just shows a rotating progress wheel on the first image.  

Disconnecting and turning off-on results in a freeze almost every time.  I’ve had only a handful freezes before and never repeated ones.  Something is confusing it.

When connecting via FOTOS over WiFi, it takes a long time to prepare the gallery and shows the first few dozen images with thumbnails.  Alas the thumbnails end after about a few dozen and an attempt to download a preview or the DNG either yields Error or just hangs.

The good thing is that the IC listing contains file names, sizes, and dimensions of photos that are correct.

I sense this might be a service trip to NJ at least but wonder what else could be done…

Edited November 14, 2024 by setuporg

[darlesch]

I’m sorry to hear that. I wonder if there’s any computer savvy people that could help you with recovering those files using a separate program perhaps? The priority should be to retrieve those files off internal storage via USB-C cable.

[scott kirkpatrick]

It sounds as if the internal memory is so full that some service routine that is used to extract images no longer has room to move stuff.  A quick and dirty fix might be to erase a few images that you don't need from the internal memory, so that it is not so full, and then try again to extract the rest.

[Photoworks]

55 minutes ago, setuporg said:

Only downloaded the SD images and hung on the first internal (with the last number) and never got it.

Why not take out SD card and try again to connect without it?

56 minutes ago, setuporg said:

Image Capture takes a very long time to list the files.

I assume you are on the mac. I would try using Lightroom import, it is more stable than Image Capture.

If you have an iPad and Capture one you can download the images right into Capture one import with USB-C set to PTP

 

On the regular M11 you can copy images from IN to SD, but I don't know if it is an option on 11-D

[fenykepesz]

vor 46 Minuten schrieb setuporg:

So it happened finally — after a trip to New York that filled up the internal memory of my month’s old M11-D, I cannot download the photos from it.

When using the internal memory, I was checking the remaining shots.  The counter finally went under 999 and started to decrease.  At about 500 it suddenly said Full.  I inserted an SD card and continued shooting.  Coming home tried to download.  Only downloaded the SD images and hung on the first internal (with the last number) and never got it.  Image Capture takes a very long time to list the files.  When they begin listing they are shown without previews.  Nothing could be downloaded, IC just shows a rotating progress wheel on the first image.  

Disconnecting and turning off-on results in a freeze almost every time.  I’ve had only a handful freezes before and never repeated ones.  Something is confusing it.

When connecting via FOTOS over WiFi, it takes a long time to prepare the gallery and shows the first few dozen images with thumbnails.  Alas the thumbnails end after about a few dozen and an attempt to download a preview or the DNG either yields Error or just hangs.

The good thing is that the IC listing contains file names, sizes, and dimensions of photos that are correct.

I sense this might be a service trip to NJ at least but wonder what else could be done…

why don't you use simple PTP to get hold of your files, even if just for this one time only ?

it's perhaps best to use a computer that doesn't usurpate right away with unneccessary 'services' and thumbnails and who knows what - so no windoze and no mac.  perhaps visit a colleague who owns a linux machine and apply a few CLI commands (again, don't use or even disable any of the automated photo software services as Ubuntu and similar windoze-like boxes come with) in a terminal such as ::

1.     mkdir -p /tmp/MTP/ /tmp/DNG/    (create temporary directories)
2.     jmtpfs /tmp/MTP/    (connect vie PTP)
3.     tree /tmp/MTP/ /tmp/DNG/   (shows files)
4.     rsync -axv --remove-source-files /tmp/MTP/ /tmp/DNG/  (reads transfers and removes DNG files)
5.     tree /tmp/MTP/   (should be empty now)
6.     tree /tmp/DNG/   (should show transferred files)
7.     fusermount -u /tmp/MTP/   (detach PTP)

i hope this is potentially helpful.  good luck...

 

[Derbyshire Man]

48 minutes ago, fenykepesz said:

why don't you use simple PTP to get hold of your files, even if just for this one time only ?

it's perhaps best to use a computer that doesn't usurpate right away with unneccessary 'services' and thumbnails and who knows what - so no windoze and no mac.  perhaps visit a colleague who owns a linux machine and apply a few CLI commands (again, don't use or even disable any of the automated photo software services as Ubuntu and similar windoze-like boxes come with) in a terminal such as ::

1.     mkdir -p /tmp/MTP/ /tmp/DNG/    (create temporary directories)
2.     jmtpfs /tmp/MTP/    (connect vie PTP)
3.     tree /tmp/MTP/ /tmp/DNG/   (shows files)
4.     rsync -axv --remove-source-files /tmp/MTP/ /tmp/DNG/  (reads transfers and removes DNG files)
5.     tree /tmp/MTP/   (should be empty now)
6.     tree /tmp/DNG/   (should show transferred files)
7.     fusermount -u /tmp/MTP/   (detach PTP)

i hope this is potentially helpful.  good luck...

 

Interesting! Could you not do this via terminal on Mac?

[Derbyshire Man]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

2 hours ago, setuporg said:

So it happened finally — after a trip to New York that filled up the internal memory of my month’s old M11-D, I cannot download the photos from it.

When using the internal memory, I was checking the remaining shots.  The counter finally went under 999 and started to decrease.  At about 500 it suddenly said Full.  I inserted an SD card and continued shooting.  Coming home tried to download.  Only downloaded the SD images and hung on the first internal (with the last number) and never got it.  Image Capture takes a very long time to list the files.  When they begin listing they are shown without previews.  Nothing could be downloaded, IC just shows a rotating progress wheel on the first image.  

Disconnecting and turning off-on results in a freeze almost every time.  I’ve had only a handful freezes before and never repeated ones.  Something is confusing it.

When connecting via FOTOS over WiFi, it takes a long time to prepare the gallery and shows the first few dozen images with thumbnails.  Alas the thumbnails end after about a few dozen and an attempt to download a preview or the DNG either yields Error or just hangs.

The good thing is that the IC listing contains file names, sizes, and dimensions of photos that are correct.

I sense this might be a service trip to NJ at least but wonder what else could be done…

That is looking very grim!

I can't believe the card was full as suggested by Scott as 256gb divided by 50mb is 5120 images. And you counter was at 500 left anyway.

I wouldn't just take it to NJ, I think I'd drop an email direct to Leica too. I'd also be wanted a brand new one as it is quite possible it isn't a firmware issue and even if it is, you don't want it sent off to Germany for an autopsy at your expense and wait.

My normal practice is to always use the internal memory. I may have just updated my SOP!

Edited November 14, 2024 by Derbyshire Man

[fenykepesz]

vor 6 Minuten schrieb Derbyshire Man:

Interesting! Could you not do this via terminal on Mac?

yes, you are right, @Derbyshire Man, one can do tons of stuff in a terminal, i love my wife's macbook with its built-in terminal i use to transfer files to/fro her laptop.

now, it should deffinitely be possible and easy to search through the camera's data directories once it is USB-PTP-mounted on the mac.  one just needs to know the  relevant directory PATH - which i currently have no clue about (no machine at hand) but it should be easy to find out if one is familiar with CLI/terminal/apple.   this TUI avenue could definitely be a life-saver for situations we just discuss here.  perhaps there is even a GUI approach using a filemanager of some sort.

[setuporg]

4 hours ago, Photoworks said:

Why not take out SD card and try again to connect without it?

I assume you are on the mac. I would try using Lightroom import, it is more stable than Image Capture.

If you have an iPad and Capture one you can download the images right into Capture one import with USB-C set to PTP

On the regular M11 you can copy images from IN to SD, but I don't know if it is an option on 11-D

Tried without the card of course.  Lightroom import stalls just like IC.  Not sure how to copy to a card in the D…

[setuporg]

5 hours ago, scott kirkpatrick said:

It sounds as if the internal memory is so full that some service routine that is used to extract images no longer has room to move stuff.  A quick and dirty fix might be to erase a few images that you don't need from the internal memory, so that it is not so full, and then try again to extract the rest.

I have the same feeling that filling up internal memory is not a good idea…

[Derbyshire Man]

Yep, I think I may move to int=sd until you have a firm diagnosis. I do wonder whether it is an internal memory hardware failure. Sounds a bit odd.

[hdmesa]

It can’t go from 500 remaining shots to full in an instant. That sounds like an internal storage hardware failure.

If you’re on a Mac, try finding someone with a PC so you can get the internal storage to appear as a drive you can access directly.

[Velo-city]

10 hours ago, hdmesa said:

It can’t go from 500 remaining shots to full in an instant. That sounds like an internal storage hardware failure.

If you’re on a Mac, try finding someone with a PC so you can get the internal storage to appear as a drive you can access directly.

If you're on a Mac, and you're able to set the M11D to PTP, then you could try 'Android File Transfer'.  

I use it mainly for Garmin products but I tried it today and it worked with the Leica M11.  USB mode: PTP, and seemingly also must have an SD card present as well (it didn't work for me without one in the camera) you can then connect and see both.  I managed to drag a file off the camera internal with it.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Note: I've added 'not connecting directly to my Mac as storage' to my list of things to be very surprised and disappointed about with the M11.

Edited November 15, 2024 by Velo-city

[Ray Vonn]

21 hours ago, setuporg said:

So it happened finally — after a trip to New York that filled up the internal memory of my month’s old M11-D, I cannot download the photos from it.

When using the internal memory, I was checking the remaining shots.  The counter finally went under 999 and started to decrease.  At about 500 it suddenly said Full.  I inserted an SD card and continued shooting.  Coming home tried to download.  Only downloaded the SD images and hung on the first internal (with the last number) and never got it.  Image Capture takes a very long time to list the files.  When they begin listing they are shown without previews.  Nothing could be downloaded, IC just shows a rotating progress wheel on the first image.  

Disconnecting and turning off-on results in a freeze almost every time.  I’ve had only a handful freezes before and never repeated ones.  Something is confusing it.

When connecting via FOTOS over WiFi, it takes a long time to prepare the gallery and shows the first few dozen images with thumbnails.  Alas the thumbnails end after about a few dozen and an attempt to download a preview or the DNG either yields Error or just hangs.

The good thing is that the IC listing contains file names, sizes, and dimensions of photos that are correct.

I sense this might be a service trip to NJ at least but wonder what else could be done…

That sounds horrific and I’m genuinely sorry, I know how I would feel if I went on a trip to NY, returned and had this issue. There are at least 2 positives so far though 1) none of this user error explanation nonsense in any of the responses which we had in the year after the M11 was released and 2) the files are at least visible so there’s every chance they will eventually be recovered. Best of luck.

[setuporg]

None of the Android connecting apps see anything.  Windows shows an empty folder.  The Image Capture periodically shows the list after a while and sometimes shows empty, in between freezes.  Something went wrong with it…

I’ve taken an extra shot that showed up in FOTOS but trying to delete it per Scott hung and gave me the empty scare.  The files did show up after another freeze/reset that became regular after any such hanging.  Basically they are there but extracting them is a challenge.

Edited November 15, 2024 by setuporg

[Velo-city]

I probably wouldn't take any additional pics to that memory - if it's corrupted then it could potentially make it worse.  

If it was an SD card then at least there would be recovery options you could try yourself, but internal memory - especially one that can't be directly connected to a Mac - leaves pretty minimal options.  Unless the service centre can give you some sort of special button combinations to get you into advanced menus that might allow some extra checks? Maybe they have a way to copy the internal to a memory card? Or maybe they can remote into your computer with it attached?  Failing that not sure how anything could be done without a Leica engineer having it on their desk.

Certainly not wishing to be negative about your predicament but I have to say after just a short time with the M11 I don't trust its firmware or file management at all.  I've had two 'file unreadable' (can't remember the exact wording) on shots since ownership - including one on the latest firmware. In just two weeks I've had more issues and more feeling of instability than any camera I've ever owned, at any price.  

[charlesphoto99]

Always a bummer to lose images. Been there done that. I do think this falls under the 'don't put all of your eggs in one basket' category (been there, done that). In fact I know some pros who swear by switching out smaller size cards vs using large GB cards or internal memory. That way, if the camera gets stolen, bricked, whatever, or if there is a corrupt card, it's only happening to a small portion of the shoot. I think this practice was more common a few years back, when there used to be a lot more issues with cards, and big ones were megabucks (now it seems to just be a Leica problem everyone else has solved). 

Is there an option to save simultaneously to both SD card and internal drive? I would consider that to be the best practice. Kind of like a built in RAID 1. 

[charlesphoto99]

Way back at the beginning of the digital age, I had an external hard drive go wonky and of course didn't have a backup. My wife was able to extract the files I needed via DOS. So you need either an IT pro or it needs to go back to Leica (and I wouldn't expect them to save your files, because extraction can take hours, even days sometimes, which is one reason why file recovery is so $$$. 

[fenykepesz]

vor 1 Stunde schrieb setuporg:

None of the Android connecting apps see anything.  Windows shows an empty folder.  The Image Capture periodically shows the list after a while and sometimes shows empty, in between freezes.  Something went wrong with it…

i know i am repeating myself @setuporg but i suggest you avoid high-level Android/Win/Apple based services altogether and use something barebone for the PTP/MTP data transfer.  that's why i suggested a low-level linux terminal approach with jmtpfs and a simple USB-C cable.  pay attention that no automounter steels you the show.  you may need to contact a linux person (of our age).  typing 'tree' shows you this in my example from this morning :

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

once you are able to see your files you should also be able to copy them (cp -axv ...) and then to remove them.  in general i use 'rsync' for that, for convenience - though in your case i would also go the safe route with 'cp' first and then 'rm'.

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[setuporg]

55 minutes ago, fenykepesz said:

i know i am repeating myself @setuporg but i suggest you avoid high-level Android/Win/Apple based services altogether and use something barebone for the PTP/MTP data transfer.  that's why i suggested a low-level linux terminal approach with jmtpfs and a simple USB-C cable.  pay attention that no automounter steels you the show.  you may need to contact a linux person (of our age).  typing 'tree' shows you this in my example from this morning :

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

once you are able to see your files you should also be able to copy them (cp -axv ...) and then to remove them.  in general i use 'rsync' for that, for convenience - though in your case i would also go the safe route with 'cp' first and then 'rm'.

Thank you my Linux friend!:). I used to be a Linux guy, until recompiling Gentoo endlessly hadn't solved the sleep problem on a Compaq TC1000 writing tablet and I went and bought a MacBook many years ago and never looked back, using it only on the server in the clouds...  Will now get a cheap PC laptop to install Linux and try or find friends nearby.  My hunch is something's wrong at the hardware level because the camera freezes after attempts to read files.  It generally requires restarts after showing a file list and failing to read them.  Then it shows empty, and after a while it may show a list of files again.  It's all very up-and-down.