CaptureOne M11-P ICC-Profile settings

[spassig123]

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Hello

Under basic characteristics ICC profile, there are the following specification options for the M11-P:

1) DNG File Neutral,

2) Leica M11 Generic,

3) Leica M11 Pro Standard

Question 1:

What are the difference between the three settings?

What's the best setting?

Question 2:

The two Leica settings are not automatically taken over when importing photos.

Why?

(I use CO 16.3.0.76 and MBP-M1 Sonoma 14.6.1)

Jochen

 

Edited September 6, 2024 by spassig123

[marchyman]

6 hours ago, spassig123 said:

What's the best setting?

Unless you can state some objective measurement the one YOU like best is the best.

 

[hansvons]

20 hours ago, spassig123 said:

What are the difference between the three settings?

What's the best setting?

 

DNG files can store metadata on how a manufacturer or user wants to interpret the demosaicing into RGB. From that perspective, and my various deep dives into C1’s ICC-based raw conversion, I’d say that:

DNG file neutral: no idea where you found that. It’s not in the M11 folder.

The ICC profile Generic in the respective camera folder includes the manufacturer’s metadata. If you want Leica’s intended colours, that's the one to go.

ProStandard is a C1-modified version of Generic that aims to produce more overall vibrancy. Please note that C1 does not distinguish between saturation and vibrancy but created their own Saturation slider, which is a mixture of both. In many cases Generic and ProStandard look almost identical.

In the profile menu under Other, you’ll find the Camera RGB Profile. This profile is basically linear without the manufacturer’s data (as I understand it) but boosting the shadows a bit. When you combine it with Curve/Linear you’ll get a almost perfectly neutral starting point that favours only the shadows a bit. 

For a conservative and convenient workflow, ICC Profile/ProStandard and Curve/Auto is C1’s recommended workflow.

For the folks that want to explore the sensor as raw as it gets, ICC Profiles/Other/Camera RGB and Curve/Linear is the way to go. 

The latter one is particularly useful for negative conversions, but I use it for my SL2-S files, too.

BTW, you can create your own ICC profiles and import them into C1.

Hope that helps.

 

 

Edited September 7, 2024 by hansvons

[spassig123]

vor 11 Minuten schrieb hansvons:

....

DNG file neutral: no idea where you found that.

,,,,

.Thanks for feedback.

First answer, see attachment.

The original settings after import some M11-P pictures.

Jochen

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

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[hansvons]

DNG neutral sits in the Adobe folder. No idea what the DNG standard curve stands for.

Probably C1 isn't recognising your M11-P when you import camera files. You either upgrade to 16.4.x or you set the regular M11 as your default camera (the ... menu in Base Characteristics), if 16.3 includes already the M11. 

[jaapv]

One can certainly create your own profiles, in fact I agree with Hans recommending doing so, but they won't be ICC profiles unless they are registered with ICC (*), which is a major standards setting and registering organisation, nothing more.  DNG has its own profiles, which are registered to ICC but are not ICC profiles.

https://www.color.org/iccprofile.xalter

https://www.color.org/index.xalter

https://www.xrite.com/service-support/color_management_workflow_with_dng_camera_profiles

(*) this is limited to organisations and companies, not individuals.

[spassig123]

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vor 9 Stunden schrieb jaapv:

…One can certainly create your own profiles,…

Thanks for feedback. I will not do this;-)

Jochen

[jaapv]

Why not? It is quite simple. Take one photograph, load into your computer and three clicks later it is done. My great-aunt Priscilla can do it. 

[zeitz]

20 hours ago, spassig123 said:

Thanks for feedback. I will not do this;-)

You are missing the power of a color-managed work flow.  You also need a graphics monitor which can be calibrated too, and not the screen on a MacBook.  Otherwise you are limited by what Apple decided for that general purpose display.

[250swb]

Doesn't it all just start with having your own opinion about what you saw and remember and not a 'profile'? The guy at Leica doesn't know what you saw, the guy at Adobe or that Capture thing doesn't know, so they offer some alternatives 'if you are lucky', otherwise you are under their cosh and they decide what your images look like.

[spassig123]

Hello

I think I have received here, among other things, an answer to my initial question.

I can't find that answer here anymore.

But I find this answer now in the CaptureOne community.

How can that be?

Jochen