Is 35mm APO overkill with film?

[Jeff S]

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One could argue that paying extra for the close focus ability of the 35 APO Summicron M is overkill for film users, as most will never use the original Visoflex.

Jeff

[Stuart Richardson]

I mean, the 35mm APO would be overkill on any body to me, due to cost alone. I felt the same with the 50mm apo. I bought the 50mm APO lanthar and prefer that to the 50mm 1.4 asph that I was using before. This is all relative, and will depend on your sense of value, your wealth and the kinds of photography you do. 

[JTLeica]

5 minutes ago, Stuart Richardson said:

I mean, the 35mm APO would be overkill on any body to me, due to cost alone. I felt the same with the 50mm apo. I bought the 50mm APO lanthar and prefer that to the 50mm 1.4 asph that I was using before. This is all relative, and will depend on your sense of value, your wealth and the kinds of photography you do. 

So I am lucky now to have both APO Lanthars and APO Summicrons.

The 50 APO L and APO Cron are so close in resolution / detail, the Cron it better with purple fringing, and the Lanthar is higher contrast, but thats preference really.

However the 35 APO Cron, is miles better than the 35 APO Lanthar. In every way. So the 35 APO Cron could be looked at as good value compared to the 50, not to mention the close focus and newer design.

[Stuart Richardson]

Don't get me wrong. I would love one, but it is just hard for me to get over the 8500 dollar price tag, especially when the APO Lanthar is less than a thousand dollars, and from what I had read, very close in quality. I wonder if you got a bad copy? Looking at the MTF, the Leica has a decent amount more contrast in the center of the frame wide open, but it looks very close to the voigtlander towards the edges. The Leica seems to be sharper but fall off a bit in the edges, while the voigtlander seems to be a bit more even across the frame, without reaching the same level of snap as the Leica in the center. I have the 35mm APO SL lens, which is even a bit better than both in terms of technical performance and it is truly staggering, so I get the impulse to get one of these lenses. But I was able to buy that as a demo for less than 4000 dollars, whereas I cannot see any 35mm APO M versions for less than 7000. But again, that is just my personal pain point. Most people would think it ludicrous to spend even 1000 dollars on a lens, let alone 4000.

[otto.f]

7 hours ago, lct said:

In that sense, i find my Summicron 50/2 apo somewhat overkilled compared to my v1, v4 and v5, reason why i don't use it much on digital and i guess i would do the same on film. As for the 35/2 apo, i suspect it would be the same as i like my v1, v4 and asph v2 a lot. I have no experience with the 35/2 apo though TBH but my experience with the 50/2 apo is not encouraging i must say. Matter of taste anyway. YMMV.

Could be but this tells me nothing; I was never attracted seriously to the 50 APO because of lack of surplusvalue over other 50’s for that price. That is totally different with the 35 APO which covers and outruns a lot of 35’s. You can’t generalize from 50 over other lenses just because of the APO thing. 

[lct]

Just explaining why i'm not tempted but i own very good apo lenses actually, rather mediocre ones too so i don't generalize at all. Give me a 35/2 apo the size of a 35/2 v4 and i could possibly reconsider.

[JTLeica]

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12 hours ago, Stuart Richardson said:

Don't get me wrong. I would love one, but it is just hard for me to get over the 8500 dollar price tag, especially when the APO Lanthar is less than a thousand dollars, and from what I had read, very close in quality. I wonder if you got a bad copy? Looking at the MTF, the Leica has a decent amount more contrast in the center of the frame wide open, but it looks very close to the voigtlander towards the edges. The Leica seems to be sharper but fall off a bit in the edges, while the voigtlander seems to be a bit more even across the frame, without reaching the same level of snap as the Leica in the center. I have the 35mm APO SL lens, which is even a bit better than both in terms of technical performance and it is truly staggering, so I get the impulse to get one of these lenses. But I was able to buy that as a demo for less than 4000 dollars, whereas I cannot see any 35mm APO M versions for less than 7000. But again, that is just my personal pain point. Most people would think it ludicrous to spend even 1000 dollars on a lens, let alone 4000.

In the uk it’s £7100 new and it’s such a new lens that they sell used for 6200 plus, but I managed to talk a well known dealer down on their used one and got it for £5600 which is a relatively good price. To be honest I shouldn’t have bought it as it’s too much for me to spend too, especially after spending out on an entire SL3 setup. 
 

I don’t think the Voigt is a bad cop, it’s still sharp in the corners ish wide open, and razor sharp stopped down. I have never paid huge attention to MTF chart as some are theoretical v Leica being measured.

I’ll post a shot tomorrow with the 35 M Apo showing very little fall off at all at f2. 

I have the SL35 and will compare one day. I’ve gone apo crazy but I got the SL lenses cheap, I found a ‘broken’ 75mm apo SL for £1100 that apparently had a ‘lens communication error’ received it and worked perfectly 😂

[Jon Warwick]

On 8/29/2024 at 3:32 PM, JTLeica said:

So I am lucky now to have both APO Lanthars and APO Summicrons.

…..

However the 35 APO Cron, is miles better than the 35 APO Lanthar. In every way. So the 35 APO Cron could be looked at as good value compared to the 50, not to mention the close focus and newer design.

I have the APO Lanthars (both 35 and 50), and have extensively tried the M 35 APO Summicron. Personally I saw very little difference in resolution between the Voitglander and Leica 35s, if anything I preferred the edges a bit more on the Voigtlander 35mm. Rendering also seemed very similar, albeit I thought the bokeh smoother on the Leica APO 35mm. The Voigtlander is a very long lens though, even versus its 50mm sibling, and made worse with the lens hood, and for me that’s a clear negative for rangefinder use vs the Leica equivalent. But image quality wise, esp resolution, I thought the 35mm lenses were really similar on M11 / M11M / M10M that I’ve tried it on. Curious what aspects of the Voitglander vs Leica 35mm APOs you like / dislike? 

[JTLeica]

22 hours ago, Jon Warwick said:

I have the APO Lanthars (both 35 and 50), and have extensively tried the M 35 APO Summicron. Personally I saw very little difference in resolution between the Voitglander and Leica 35s, if anything I preferred the edges a bit more on the Voigtlander 35mm. Rendering also seemed very similar, albeit I thought the bokeh smoother on the Leica APO 35mm. The Voigtlander is a very long lens though, even versus its 50mm sibling, and made worse with the lens hood, and for me that’s a clear negative for rangefinder use vs the Leica equivalent. But image quality wise, esp resolution, I thought the 35mm lenses were really similar on M11 / M11M / M10M that I’ve tried it on. Curious what aspects of the Voitglander vs Leica 35mm APOs you like / dislike? 

I dont dislike anything about them really. I think they are fantastic lenses and voigtlander are onto a winner with them. However I dont agree on the 35, the 35 APO Cron is better than the 50 APO Cron, its definitely regarded in terms of resolution the best leica has ever made for the M, the 50 APO Lanther is the better of the two (35 and 50) too... And the 50 APO Cron is better than the Lanthar, just, so I definitely dont think the Voigt is particularly close to the APO Cron. Only what I have seen and read though.

Edited August 31, 2024 by JTLeica

[BWColor]

I question if the differences which separates Voigtlander and Leica APO lenses will be the determining factor that makes your/my images impactful.  I’m certain that Leica is overall the optically better APO lens..especially in 35mm.  The difference in size might be the more important consideration.

[Mahesh]

On 8/30/2024 at 8:19 AM, JTLeica said:

In the uk it’s £7100 new and it’s such a new lens that they sell used for 6200 plus, but I managed to talk a well known dealer down on their used one and got it for £5600 which is a relatively good price. To be honest I shouldn’t have bought it as it’s too much for me to spend too, especially after spending out on an entire SL3 setup. 
 

I don’t think the Voigt is a bad cop, it’s still sharp in the corners ish wide open, and razor sharp stopped down. I have never paid huge attention to MTF chart as some are theoretical v Leica being measured.

I’ll post a shot tomorrow with the 35 M Apo showing very little fall off at all at f2. 

I have the SL35 and will compare one day. I’ve gone apo crazy but I got the SL lenses cheap, I found a ‘broken’ 75mm apo SL for £1100 that apparently had a ‘lens communication error’ received it and worked perfectly 😂

Was that Wex? I had bargained too and almost got it but then thought it was still expensive for what it was (is)

[JTLeica]

2 hours ago, Mahesh said:

Was that Wex? I had bargained too and almost got it but then thought it was still expensive for what it was (is)

Yeah it was. I gave them a call and they did a little deal. But eh, it’s extremely expensive regardless. But in 5 years it’ll be selling new for 10 no doubt