Q3 with 43mm APO f2

[lik]

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Haha!

1. so am I

2. so do I

3. I had one opportunity to ask him a couple of questions. So I agree! 
🙋🏻‍♂️

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The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[jaapv]

51 minutes ago, lik said:

Thanks for this explanation!

From a pragmatic point of view I would say:

Absolutely, however the result for the photographer is the same, isn't it? Thus I would dare to say, that this doesn't matter to the MTF results either because they show just results which in principle should be visible as well. 

Agree absolutely, also my experience over the years. 

Thx again!

If the cause is field curvature it will be very difficult to spot on a three dimensional subject. 

[bobtodrick]

Okay…I was one of the naysayers concerning this camera.

I will take 10 lashes with a wet noodle!

[Le Chef]

30 minutes ago, bobtodrick said:

I will take 10 lashes with a wet noodle!

Pick your sauce!

[duoenboge]

vor einer Stunde schrieb algrove:

I am first on the list and I could care less about the MTF curves for a Leica APO lens. Peter Karbe knows what he's doing.

As far as I know, Peter Karbe is no longer the chief lens developer at Leica. I am sure Leica will have already provided a top lens for this camera.

 

[mhasman]

Wonder how long until Q43M... another year+?

[frankchn]

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14 minutes ago, mhasman said:

Wonder how long until Q43M... another year+?

I don't think there is going to be one (or a standard Q3M or a SL3-M) until Sony decides to make a IMX455 sensor variant (IMX455BLK?) that is both monochrome and has PDAF pixels. Either that or Leica drops PDAF from those cameras, but I think that is even more unlikely.

[mhasman]

9 minutes ago, frankchn said:

...until Sony decides to make a IMX455 sensor variant (IMX455BLK?) that is both monochrome and has PDAF pixels. 

I believe it was not always Sony. What was another company name making monochrome sensors for Leica form beginning?

[frankchn]

9 minutes ago, mhasman said:

I believe it was not always Sony. What was another company name making monochrome sensors for Leica form beginning?

Maybe, but they would have to integrate a different sensor from another manufacturer, and that is a lot of engineering effort for a low volume product.

For the M11M they could just order a different sensor variant from Sony and it is almost a drop-in replacement (same pinouts, same sensor output method, etc...).

Edited September 24, 2024 by frankchn

[mhasman]

Why not just M11M sensor? It might be already discussed and explained, sorry if I am missing it...

[Kwokaun]

1 minute ago, mhasman said:

Why not just M11M sensor? It might be already discussed and explained, sorry if I am missing it...

No phase detect auto focus on sensor.

[PeterBoyadjian]

My wife is going to leave me on the 26th......I'll leave it at that. 

Hopefully this 43 will be a true APO lens. 

I've been using a 28,50 and 75 with my SL3 for events. Running a single Q343 would be interesting and fun. 

[Squad]

10 hours ago, lik said:

Could you expand on that for a generalist in technical details? 

To me it was always THE indicator for the percentage of micro contrast in lines/mm over the frame no matter what FL it is. 

How could this be different due to FL in a Frame, Siemens star or whatever? 

Thx in advance!

If you frame it like this you can compare everything, but the question is if it makes sense. Telephoto lenses are usually sharper, so there’s nothing to see here. But it’s still an impressive chart for the 43mm!

[Squad]

10 hours ago, lik said:

 

Edited September 24, 2024 by Squad
Double post

[JTLeica]

13 hours ago, LocalHero1953 said:

You may not. I may not (though I'd like it).

But it's the wider market that counts, not us expert photographers. If the M hair shirt brigade complain about the absence of IS, then you can be sure the Q brigade will.

Oh I don’t disagree is needs to be in the camera and would be a very weird omission. Almost impossible not to be there. Just having come back from Dartmoor using the m and apo lenses in quite dark conditions I am happy to say I have a lot of sharp shots. Makes you get a little creative and find some ‘rest spots’ for the camera 

[jaapv]

6 hours ago, frankchn said:

I don't think there is going to be one (or a standard Q3M or a SL3-M) until Sony decides to make a IMX455 sensor variant (IMX455BLK?) that is both monochrome and has PDAF pixels. Either that or Leica drops PDAF from those cameras, but I think that is even more unlikely.

Making a monochrome sensor is the easiest thing in the world. They only have to replace the Bayer filter by plain glass on a regular sensor. The main problem is scheduling a small production run for a special order. 

[40mm f/2]

11 hours ago, jaapv said:

You cannot even compare across brands. There a different methods to determine MTF. The other problem is that they are measured/calculated in the film/sensor plane only. So if they fall off towards the corners you may well be seeing a curved focal plane instead of a falloff in resolution/contrast, which often makes shorter focal lengths score “worse” . The best way to compare lenses is using OTF graphs. And then, both lenses will be a hybrid design, meaning that the final digital corrections are incorporated in the optical design. 
But still the 43 mm curves are quite good giving an indication that it is an excellent lens. The only thing you cannot say that it is better or worse than the 28. The proof will be in the results. There is far more to lens quality than numbers. 

MTF is what more or less all lens manufactures publish and mostly not measured but calculated graphs are published. So even the parameters  are somewhat different between brands it gives a good evaluation of the optical behavior of a lens but of course it is not the only descriptor of lens quality.  Field curvature is quite noticeable if it is strong enough also in 3d subjects especially when focused close to infinity. The field curvature of the “28mm” lens of the Leica Q was the main reason I sold that camera. To reduce the effect field curvature one could focus not in the center but somewhere in middle field and stop down to increase DOF but that strategy means one does not use the optimum center performance.  Another way to get around field curvature is focus bracketing/stacking,  a feature which is missing in all Leica cameras. That works well for subjects relatively close and don’t move but does not help at infinity.  I think a lens with less field curvature is a better lens if one is interested in the performance across the entire image and not only at the center.

There is one technology which would completely eliminates spherical aberrations and field curvature and promises equal performance across the entire field:  spherical or curved sensors and Sony has developed that technology far enough that it could be ready for manufacturing. The main issue is that to get optimal results the lens and sensor curvature have to fit but that would be not a problem with a fixed lens camera (like a Q)

 

[jaapv]

Zeiss measures, Leica calculates. 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica Q

[jaapv]

1 hour ago, 40mm f/2 said:

MTF is what more or less all lens manufactures publish and mostly not measured but calculated graphs are published. So even the parameters  are somewhat different between brands it gives a good evaluation of the optical behavior of a lens but of course it is not the only descriptor of lens quality.  Field curvature is quite noticeable if it is strong enough also in 3d subjects especially when focused close to infinity. The field curvature of the “28mm” lens of the Leica Q was the main reason I sold that camera. To reduce the effect field curvature one could focus not in the center but somewhere in middle field and stop down to increase DOF but that strategy means one does not use the optimum center performance.  Another way to get around field curvature is focus bracketing/stacking,  a feature which is missing in all Leica cameras. That works well for subjects relatively close and don’t move but does not help at infinity.  I think a lens with less field curvature is a better lens if one is interested in the performance across the entire image and not only at the center.

There is one technology which would completely eliminates spherical aberrations and field curvature and promises equal performance across the entire field:  spherical or curved sensors and Sony has developed that technology far enough that it could be ready for manufacturing. The main issue is that to get optimal results the lens and sensor curvature have to fit but that would be not a problem with a fixed lens camera (like a Q)

 

Presuming that one can produce individually curved silicon wafers to accommodate complicated curved planes of focus.  And what will happen to the OOF rendering? 

[UliWer]

vor 11 Minuten schrieb jaapv:

Zeiss measures, Leica calculates. 

Yes, so they say.

Though when I tried to read Mr. Nasse‘s explanation about MTF-graphs, I found so much calculation in it that I gave up:

https://lenspire.zeiss.com/photo/app/uploads/2018/04/Article-MTF-2008-EN.pdf