Sl3: can it be set up to close the shutter when turned off and changing lenses?

[jaapv]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

10 minutes ago, Virob said:

The difference is the presence/absence of the sensor shaker function

This.

[SrMi]

I believe that most cameras use ultrasonic cleaning that vibrates the glass covering the sensor.

IIRC, Leica claimed that the thin cover glass precludes it from adding ultrasonic cleaning.

SL3's in-camera sensor cleaning seems different. It rattles and shakes the camera like no other and requires restarting. I assume it uses IBIS to shake the sensor.

[ccalberti1953]

39 minutes ago, Virob said:

I came to L mount from Olympus m4/3. With the Olympus OMD, I almost never had to clean the sensor and it was a bit of a shock moving to the SL2. The difference is the presence/absence of the sensor shaker function. My conclusion is the Olympus implementation of this feature is very effective.

for those with both the SL2 and SL3, is there a noticeable difference in the amount of sensor cleaning required?

Yes, for reasons I have mentioned.  I tried to use my SL2 for wildlife/BIF and ended up sending the camera to Leica to clean the sensor after several lens changes in sketchy weather and high winds. 

[jaapv]

Sending the camera in for a 5 minute DIY job? Or even two puffs with a blower bulb? And even then, nearly every camera store will do it whilst you wait.

[ccalberti1953]

3 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Sending the camera in for a 5 minute DIY job? Or even two puffs with a blower bulb? And even then, nearly every camera store will do it whilst you wait.

You should be the advisor to the Leica Store in Washington DC, which advised I send the camera to Leica for service, which Leica did at no cost to me. This is a well-known issue within the Leica community.

[jaapv]

Well, it is something that they did it at no cost.

But how is one going to send the camera in when photographing in the middle of Africa, or Tibet, or Antarctica? Or in the middle of a wedding assignment? I think that this is simple maintenance that every camera owner should be able to do himself. You don't make an appointment with your Dental Hygienist each time you need to brush your teeth?

[SrMi]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

1 hour ago, jaapv said:

Well, it is something that they did it at no cost.

But how is one going to send the camera in when photographing in the middle of Africa, or Tibet, or Antarctica? Or in the middle of a wedding assignment? I think that this is simple maintenance that every camera owner should be able to do himself. You don't make an appointment with your Dental Hygienist each time you need to brush your teeth?

+1

I regularly have to clean the sensor while traveling. Using Nitecore's Blowerbay is most often sufficient (touchless).

[FlashGordonPhotography]

I will have to agree that learning to properly clean a sensor is trivial and everyone should know how to do it. I have a small kit in my travel case that's always there for any travel I do and something a bit more substantial at home. My travel kit includes a Gittos Rocket blower, an Artic Butterfly and some swabs/fluid. A sesnor clean on location takes a couple of minutes. Nothing more.

A few notes:

1. I've taken a pair of R5's to Africa. They did have to be cleaned. But not as often as the Sony's I took on the previous trip. I am convinced the shutter did help, especially with pollen. Both systems also had sensor vibration. The R5's were one of the best systems I've used in this regard. But not perfect.

2. I'm not seeing the SL3 being worse or better than the SL2. And I didn't find the SL2 that bad. On a trip across the Great Sandy Desert (that's its actual name), I think I used a blower 3-4 times in 6 weeks and didn't need a sensor swab at all. I've done 1 swab clean of my SL3 but that was my fault (I touched the sensor). Took maybe 2 minutes and I carried on with me Vietnam trip.

3. Having use systems with and without a sensor cover function I am convinced there's a difference. If you haven't then you have no idea. So, please, stop. However, it wouldn't stop me from buying a camera. Sensor cleaning is trivial. So this function is a nice to have and not a must have. It reduces the need to clean it doesn't eliminate it.

4. The SL cameras are the only ones actually with a RATING for dust sealing. IP54. So, I expect that they will actually not get that much dust in the first place with some care on lens changes. Even on the R5 I have a 24-240 for those days where all hell breaks loose. I do wish there was a better option than the Panasonic super zoom for this function. Sigma? Hello?

5. If Leica see no value in this why is it already available in the M system?

Gordon

p.s. As a side note, who the hell is daft enough to travel with a camera and no way to maintain it? I travel for photography a lot and I'm still stunned by the number of photographers who don't have the basics to fix minor issues and move on. Not just learning to clean a sensor. People who turn up with a tripod but no spare plates or an allen key to tighten the legs. A bit of Gaffa tape rolled around a tripod leg or selfie stick. A jewelers screwdriver to screw you lens mount back down. A multitool. A second way to charge camera batteries. And before you say I'm nuts, in the last 12 months I have used every piece of this kit. To repair other photographer's gear.

[SrMi]

7 minutes ago, FlashGordonPhotography said:

3. Having use systems with and without a sensor cover function I am convinced there's a difference. If you haven't then you have no idea. So, please, stop.

Everyone who has used a DSLR has used a camera with a "sensor cover function." 

Sensor cleaning my D850 and D4s was a regular job when traveling.

[jiggyb21]

During the initial SL3 launch I remember at least one or two folks saying the question was asked during the “influencer” Q+A in Wetzlar. The guys in Miami from Red Dot forum summed it up best when they said the reply was one in which the engineers, almost tired and defeated sounding said that the camera was pushed out as fast as possible and they didn’t have time to implement several features that would be expected. I fully anticipate this to come in a future firmware. And based on the replies in this thread it seems clear that the folks who have owned and extensively used camera with and without this feature, see its benefits. So if and when the feature is implemented, it will give all of us, for and against it, the option to use it or not, and that’s a good thing. That said, you should not be afraid to clean your sensor yourself. It’s very easy and very safe to do.

Edited April 21, 2024 by jiggyb21

[LBJ2]

6 hours ago, jiggyb21 said:

During the initial SL3 launch I remember at least one or two folks saying the question was asked during the “influencer” Q+A in Wetzlar. The guys in Miami from Red Dot forum summed it up best when they said the reply was one in which the engineers, almost tired and defeated sounding said that the camera was pushed out as fast as possible and they didn’t have time to implement several features that would be expected. I fully anticipate this to come in a future firmware. And based on the replies in this thread it seems clear that the folks who have owned and extensively used camera with and without this feature, see its benefits. So if and when the feature is implemented, it will give all of us, for and against it, the option to use it or not, and that’s a good thing. That said, you should not be afraid to clean your sensor yourself. It’s very easy and very safe to do.

Hello, where can I hear this comment/discussion from the Red Dot Forum?  "...they said the reply was one in which the engineers, almost tired and defeated sounding said that the camera was pushed out as fast as possible and they didn’t have time to implement several features that would be expected" 

@ccalberti1953

Count me as another one of many across the mirrorless brands who find the ability to close the shutter on any mirrorless camera a significant benefit toward fewer sensor cleanings. I learned to carefully handle Sony's exposed sensor mirrorless cameras that didn't have this feature for years. Then the Sony A1 came along and this feature was added. The result of which has been a significant decrease in the need to clean the that sensor cover glass with a blower, brush or wet cleaning. I also enjoy this feature on my Leica M camera. 

Thankfully manufacturers often include the ability to turn this feature on or off. 

Just like my old Sony cameras I am very careful handling the SL2 's exposed sensor cover glass too. Interestingly, I've never had to clean the SL2 sensor yet 🤞🏼and I am one who checks this regularly and very capable /experienced with multiple tools to wet clean the sensor cover glass when needed.

Hopefully if enough of us send this request to Leica and they are able to HW-wise, they might implement in the SL2/SL3 cameras via a firmware update. 

Edited April 21, 2024 by LBJ2

[jiggyb21]

2 hours ago, LBJ2 said:

Hello, where can I hear this comment/discussion from the Red Dot Forum?   

It can be found at the 45 minutes mark. This comment comes after a previous one earlier in the video where they talked about why the SL3 doesn’t implement the content authenticity. They essentially say that the SL3 had been in design for a long time and if the engineers included and had to test everything they wanted to include, the camera would still be in the design phase. They made it sound like software related features would come later. Think multi shot mode for example. 

[deekay]

Agree with the OP. My A7RV has this while my A7RIV does not. The difference in the field is night and day.

[LocalHero1953]

I'm another one who does not see the need for the shutter to close for lens changing. I would rather see the sensor each time so I can eyeball any gross dust contamination and blow it off. I always found the 'clean lens' routine on the ?M9 ?M240 tedious. If Leica chooses to implement it, then I hope it can be disabled.

I am careless with changing lenses (I put lenses on the bed, and lay the camera (SL2-S) face down on the duvet while swapping lenses at home. While shooting and swapping lenses frequently, I will lay them down in my open backpack without rear end caps. I don't seem to have a big problem with dust. Each time I go out for a session with the camera, a quick blow job (did I really write that?) deals with anything I can see. If I have more time, I will use a loupe, but I can't remember the last time I needed the arctic butterfly or wet cleaning.

 

[ccalberti1953]

1 hour ago, deekay said:

Agree with the OP. My A7RV has this while my A7RIV does not. The difference in the field is night and day.

You can enable this feature if you like in the settings in the R4 as long as you have the updated firmware (I have the R5). I did this for a friend in my area who has the R4. Happy to walk you through it if you like.

[AZN]

18 hours ago, ccalberti1953 said:

You can enable this feature if you like in the settings in the R4 as long as you have the updated firmware (I have the R5). I did this for a friend in my area who has the R4. Happy to walk you through it if you like.

Just spent 10 minutes trying to find some mention about this online – found nothing.

We are talking about the Sony ⍺7RIV (ILCE-7RM4) right?  The only mentions I could find are for the cheaper, lower-spec ⍺7IV (ILCE-7M4) or (obviously) the ⍺7RV (ILCE-7RM5).

???

 

Edited April 24, 2024 by AZN

[ccalberti1953]

8 minutes ago, AZN said:

Just spent 10 minutes trying to find some mention about this online – found nothing.

We are talking about the Sony ⍺7RIV (ILCE-7RM4) right?  The only mentions I could find are for the cheaper, lower-spec ⍺7IV (ILCE-7M4) or (obviously) the ⍺7RV (ILCE-7RM5).

???

 

Yes, the A7R4.  I am Italy through early June with my Leicas; my R5 is back home.  My friend, an instructor with our local camera club, thought as you do about his R4.  I went into his R4 settings, found them identical as mine for these purposes, and changed his settings to enable the shutter close on turning the camera off.  I will be happy to walk through this with you when I have my R5 in hand.  I expect you will find the right path beforehand.

[jaapv]

22 hours ago, LocalHero1953 said:

I'm another one who does not see the need for the shutter to close for lens changing. I would rather see the sensor each time so I can eyeball any gross dust contamination and blow it off. I always found the 'clean lens' routine on the ?M9 ?M240 tedious. If Leica chooses to implement it, then I hope it can be disabled.

I am careless with changing lenses (I put lenses on the bed, and lay the camera (SL2-S) face down on the duvet while swapping lenses at home. While shooting and swapping lenses frequently, I will lay them down in my open backpack without rear end caps. I don't seem to have a big problem with dust. Each time I go out for a session with the camera, a quick blow job (did I really write that?) deals with anything I can see. If I have more time, I will use a loupe, but I can't remember the last time I needed the arctic butterfly or wet cleaning.

 

Same here. I take reasonable care but convenience comes first. The only wet clean I do is once or twice a year to remove haze from the sensor- we do have a bit of heavy industry near and there are Diesel cars of course. 

[DirkZ]

--- deleted ---

Edited April 24, 2024 by DirkZ
wrong context, sorry

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[ccalberti1953]

On 4/20/2024 at 6:08 PM, jaapv said:

Shutter shake set the rest apart from previous Leica cameras. Not the shutter movement marketing.

In a placebo situation about 30%-50% will report a positive result. 

I don't use Leica either for birds and wildlife , it is Panasonic S. However, those don't  cover the sensor either. Despite that I never have dust problems in places like the Kalahari and other dry places. 

As said, dust on the shutter will end up on the sensor sooner rather than later. 

It looks like the SL3 has internalized much of the Panasonic S5II, including the overall size, autofocus system, enhanced video, and sensor setup.  Is the S5II an SL3 equvalent at a steep discount?