Looking for something different, M11M or Hasselblad?

[Chris W]

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19 hours ago, macmk said:

 

1. I don't love the 35mm summicron. It's small, which is great, but I kept accidentally changing aperture setting and there is no close distance focusing whatsoever. Fine otherwise.

Rangefinder cameras do not close focus. I love my 35mm Summicron. You probably have to give the system more than a couple of days to get used to the handling. I have never changed my aperture by mistake. I think the M11 is overkill and something in the M10 range would be the sweet spot for me. I had an M240 and found the image quality not that stellar.

I think the M series is a great everyday camera, if you can get on with manual focus and the rangefinder.

I have an X1D2 and it is carryable with the 45p lens, but most of the other Hassy lenses are big and heavy.

[macmk]

11 hours ago, dpitt said:

The same here. I had perfect eyesight when I started using rangefinders. Now, with age I need reading glasses and more and more astigmatism is in play too. In the beginning there was no issue at all, as long as I could read the shutter times on the dial without glasses, no need for any aid. Then, years went by and all of a sudden I realized that my focusing was completely off. Resulting in a shoot where I had a unusual high percentage of missed shots... 

What is important to know is that the RF focusing spot is at a virtual distance of 2m. So your normal reading glasses will not be of much use. They are calculated for 30cm to 1m at best.  Now I use some good computer glasses from years ago. Then, they were perfect for 70cm to 1 m distance with astigmatism correction. Now with time they are perfect for 2m to 5m distance. When I use these, I can use the RF as before, of course with some more difficulty to see the edges. As long as I do not want to use wider than 35mm that does not matter much.

Also, I was a bit afraid you would have this results from a 2 day test period. During that time you want to test every possible use, which does not give much time to get really used to MF and the RF focusing way. Maybe RF are not for you, maybe they could grow on you. First make sure you have glasses that give 100% sharp sight at 2m. You can test this by placing a magazine at 2m distance and try to read as much of the small print as possible.

Once you have that sorted, it would be nice if you could borrow, rent or buy any Leica M for a while. Take as long as you need and build it up from static objects in perfect light to moving subjects indoors in low light... At a certain moment it became second nature for me and now I would not want otherwise for most subjects.

I do have a SL, TL2 and micro four thirds system. All of them newer and more advanced and with higher resolution and ISO performance, but still they are 'second cameras' to my M9 and M8.

Thank you @dpitt for the insightful answer!

I didn't know about the virtual distance for the spot, that's interesting. I could try focusing with my glasses (those work pretty well for 2m+), but I had an issue with not seeing really anything in the viewfinder due to the distance/angle from my eye. Whatever I could catch, was indeed sharp. I already found composing difficult, but maybe that's a challenge to learn how to go around those limitations.

I'm also fully aware that 2 days is not enough to get a good feeling of the rangefinder cameras. One thing I learned is that I don't want it now for my main camera, but I'll definitely keep my eye on the M series in the future. There are a lot of things I did like about it, so I'm sure sooner or later I will go back to try again. I also know that I don't need the latest and greatest version. Maybe M246 with older lenses would be a better fit to fill a niche for me.

Unless Leica will add IBIS in M12 (and maybe some unexpected way to accommodate vision problems), then I will start to think about the new one once again.

 

2 hours ago, Chris W said:

Rangefinder cameras do not close focus. I love my 35mm Summicron. You probably have to give the system more than a couple of days to get used to the handling. I have never changed my aperture by mistake. I think the M11 is overkill and something in the M10 range would be the sweet spot for me. I had an M240 and found the image quality not that stellar.

I think the M series is a great everyday camera, if you can get on with manual focus and the rangefinder.

I have an X1D2 and it is carryable with the 45p lens, but most of the other Hassy lenses are big and heavy.

 

Before I got the camera, I seen that most of the new lenses (28/35mm) are at least able to focus between 30 and 40cm. With 70+ on 35mm it limits any closeups, which is one of the kind of photos I sometimes tend to do. As for handling, yeah I'm sure I can get used to it.

For X2D, I'm looking into either 28p which is super small, or slightly bigger but still not huge 38V. Maybe then something long and heavy for landscapes, but that's already almost beyond Leica M possibilities, so I don't even compare.

I still love the form factor of Leica, that's the main reason I wanted it to work.

Edited March 4 by macmk

[dpitt]

1 hour ago, macmk said:

Before I got the camera, I seen that most of the new lenses (28/35mm) are at least able to focus between 30 and 40cm. With 70+ on 35mm it limits any closeups, which is one of the kind of photos I sometimes tend to do. As for handling, yeah I'm sure I can get used to it.

The close focusing distance only makes sense if you are prepared to use EVF or LV on your M to focus, because the RF system is not made for close focus.

This is one of the reasons that using M lenses on SL or other mirrorless bodies is not that ideal. If it is a vintage M lens, you are far better off using the R equivalent. They were made with the same IQ and have retrofocus + shorter MFD. R lenses are a bit larger and heavier than M lenses, but still very small compared to the SL native lenses. So unless you have an M body to use it natively, buying an R lens makes more sense.

Edited March 4 by dpitt

[macmk]

Thanks to all who gave me some input in this topic!
I just ordered Leica Q3 and will keep it for some time as only camera before figuring out what's next

I'll also keep an eye on used M246/M10M as I'm still curious about both, the rangefinder and mono only. Probably project for the next year.

[S58]

I used both since the days of film, with Leica that use continued into the digital age while Hasselblad was dropped in 2001… Several months ago I purchased an Leica M11P, my only Leica currently and I am more than happy with it. And…. closely following that I saw the Hasselblad 907X CFV 100C was released. I purchased it also with the new 38 2.5. I’ve since added the 55 and 90mm 2.5/lenses. 
I have to say… I love the Leica. But… the Hasselblad is in another stratosphere… What a camera!!!