Leica m3 top plate paint experiment.

[Radost]

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I have the pleasure of knowing one of the best vintage car painters in the world. He is an expert in everything from paint to chrome. He also have access to vast amount of paint and paint stripping chemicals. I have seen him do miracles with stripping chrome, rechroming and laying coats of paint.. 

Plan is to strip the chrome to brass and try different stuff to match the M/A.

The only thing I need is a little help removing all the glass from the top plate. Any help appreciated.. 

Edited February 7, 2024 by Radost

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[250swb]

I guess you haven't got the top plate off yet, when you do how the glass is fitted in place becomes self evident and it's easy to remove from the clips. Be careful, removing chrome and then the nickel plating from the thin brass top plate is usually done by reversing the polarity of the plating baths, but the current used is much much less than would be used for de-chroming a car bumper (which I don't think anybody would attempt outside a special facility with safety requirements in place). Get the current wrong and you start to eat into the brass. Good luck.

[Radost]

5 minutes ago, 250swb said:

I guess you haven't got the top plate off yet, when you do how the glass is fitted in place becomes self evident and it's easy to remove from the clips. Be careful, removing chrome and then the nickel plating from the thin brass top plate is usually done by reversing the polarity of the plating baths, but the current used is much much less than would be used for de-chroming a car bumper (which I don't think anybody would attempt outside a special facility with safety requirements in place). Get the current wrong and you start to eat into the brass. Good luck.

Thank You for the info. While he has not seen the plate “ I have not purchased the camera yet but will do next week” he said an acid bath should do. Taking the plate is easy. From the pictures it looks that the glas is held by bend metal. Just need a little help doing it properly 

Edited February 7, 2024 by Radost

[Anbaric]

If the finish is the main thing you are interested in, and you haven't bought the camera yet, why not buy one that already has it? The M4-2 and early M4-P have brass tops plated with 'black chrome' (not paint), just like the M-A. Seems a shame to experiment on an M3, which has a fine satin silver chrome finish nicer than anything that is made today, in an attempt to approximate this (unless its finish is already too scruffy to care about).

[andybarton]

There are plenty of M3 top plates around if you want to experiment on one without affecting the whole camera. If it works, swap the repainted one for the existing one and then sell that one on.

The serial number wouldn't match, though.

[Radost]

5 hours ago, Anbaric said:

If the finish is the main thing you are interested in, and you haven't bought the camera yet, why not buy one that already has it? The M4-2 and early M4-P have brass tops plated with 'black chrome' (not paint), just like the M-A. Seems a shame to experiment on an M3, which has a fine satin silver chrome finish nicer than anything that is made today, in an attempt to approximate this (unless its finish is already too scruffy to care about).

The camera I am buying is not in a good shape cosmetically. Also the idea is to possibly provide a painting service that is based here in the united states and take a very short time. 

[Radost]

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3 hours ago, andybarton said:

There are plenty of M3 top plates around if you want to experiment on one without affecting the whole camera. If it works, swap the repainted one for the existing one and then sell that one on.

The serial number wouldn't match, though.

Some of those plates cost as much as a parts camera.

[Radost]

Another question:

Can I put a M2 top plate on a m3 camera?

I like the magnification of the m3 for 50mm SUmilux but the cleaner look of m2.

[Radost]

Or can I put m3 viewfinder on a M2 body?

 

[Anbaric]

29 minutes ago, Radost said:

Or can I put m3 viewfinder on a M2 body?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuoKNZjr8_U

[250swb]

5 hours ago, Radost said:

Another question:

Can I put a M2 top plate on a m3 camera?

I like the magnification of the m3 for 50mm SUmilux but the cleaner look of m2.

I somehow think you are out of your depth.

[Radost]

Just now, 250swb said:

I somehow think you are out of your depth.

Not me personally if they don’t fit. Have them modded.

[Anbaric]

Some systems are more amenable to modding than Leica:

https://www.lego.com/en-gb/product/retro-camera-31147

(I totally want one of these now!)

[250swb]

1 minute ago, Radost said:

Not me personally if they don’t fit. Have them modded.

If not you personally why are you saying somebody else takes the hit, it's your idea isn't it?

No, it doesn't work, so now backtrack and think why painting services start to get complicated. You have a camera in pieces ready for a paint job or a re-chrome, and most customers would rightly think that given their camera has never been opened for fifty years or more a CLA should be part of this 'service'. Otherwise it's like sending your car to the garage to top up the engine oil and then to another garage to check the tyre pressures.

So maybe you say 'no servicing included' but you are back to the intrinsic value of having the camera 're-painted in the USA' if it's only a cosmetic job. It does nobody any good least of all the gullible people taken in when this 'service' hits eBay resellers. Have a crap camera, have it repainted in the USA, yeah! Wouldn't that be a profound turnaround in expectations? But this is where the world is, nobody cares about anybody else and the costs of doing stuff, it's all about 'I can do it cheaper' rather than 'I can do it properly'.

[earleygallery]

6 hours ago, Radost said:

Another question:

Can I put a M2 top plate on a m3 camera?

I like the magnification of the m3 for 50mm SUmilux but the cleaner look of m2.

If you look at an M2 and an M3 the differences (and reasons why they aren't interchangeable) should be obvious.

You could try the repaint process on some cheap faulty camera first, just in case!

[Radost]

2 hours ago, 250swb said:

If not you personally why are you saying somebody else takes the hit, it's your idea isn't it?

No, it doesn't work, so now backtrack and think why painting services start to get complicated. You have a camera in pieces ready for a paint job or a re-chrome, and most customers would rightly think that given their camera has never been opened for fifty years or more a CLA should be part of this 'service'. Otherwise it's like sending your car to the garage to top up the engine oil and then to another garage to check the tyre pressures.

So maybe you say 'no servicing included' but you are back to the intrinsic value of having the camera 're-painted in the USA' if it's only a cosmetic job. It does nobody any good least of all the gullible people taken in when this 'service' hits eBay resellers. Have a crap camera, have it repainted in the USA, yeah! Wouldn't that be a profound turnaround in expectations? But this is where the world is, nobody cares about anybody else and the costs of doing stuff, it's all about 'I can do it cheaper' rather than 'I can do it properly'.

I am personally going to experiment on my own camera. Not asking for other people to experiment. But if it works i can offer the service. 

As I mentioned above it will be done properly by one of the best vintage car painters in the world. We had dinner with Jon Kosmoski where I picked his brain about it. I have friends in town with black M4 M4.2 M5 M6 M6ttl M7 and MP. We will get all the cameras together and brainstorm a good solution. 

If I do that I would not take the whole camera. The customer have to take the top and bottom plate off and send it to me. I have removed top plates before and it is not hard at all. 

And if it does not work out I will have some dark cameras. I would never should chrome.

Edited February 8, 2024 by Radost

[Radost]

I personally will never shoot chrome cameras and paying for a good pain job is very expansive and takes forever.

Edited February 8, 2024 by Radost

[Radost]

2 hours ago, earleygallery said:

If you look at an M2 and an M3 the differences (and reasons why they aren't interchangeable) should be obvious.

You could try the repaint process on some cheap faulty camera first, just in case!

What is the obvious differences?

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[earleygallery]

17 hours ago, Radost said:

What is the obvious differences?

Frame counter design/mechanism?

[Anbaric]

You will sometimes find M3s with M2 or later finders, probably because the M3 finder is unique, no longer available, and may be affected by issues like prism separation that are difficult for the average technician to fix (though a few can), making replacing the whole thing as a unit a simpler alternative. I don't think I've come across the reverse, an M2 with an M3 finder, probably because hardly anyone would want that combination or have the parts available to make one (though all sorts of odd things do turn up from time to time). I don't know if there's any particular technical reason that would make it more difficult to do it this way round. Of course, 'technically possible' isn't the same thing as 'great idea'.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9nazm3_OXac