Barnack Identification

[ssmith]

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I have in my possession a Barnack Leica which was passed down to me by a deceased relative and has been sitting in a drawer for some time.  He was a German anthropologist who was active in the 40’s and 50s’ and I assume he used the camera in his fieldwork for recording specimens etc.  The camera appears to be in very nice condition with the shutter and slow-speed settings working but it is the advanced features (flash-sync and slow-speed shutter) coupled with a 5-digit serial number which has me confused as to its pedigree.  Perhaps someone here can tell me what model this is and if it is truly a “Leica” and not a clone of some sort.

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[romanus53]

Looks like a true Leica, modified by Leitz at least in the 1950ies. The number identifies it as Model I (A) with fixed lens. Later it was upgraded with rangefinder, long speeds and flash-sync, lens modified to screw-mount and coated - I think the glas-block is still the original one as I can't see a serial number, it should be a little bis shorter than later ones.

[Anbaric]

A camera like this is generally called a IIIa syn or IIIa sync, to indicate that in its current state it has the general features of a IIIa, plus IIIf-style flash sync. There are lots of examples of these factory conversions in this thread (it was a common service offered by Leitz):

Edited November 10, 2023 by Anbaric

[spydrxx]

Welcome to the forum. It appears to be a nice specimen. While the forum doesn't do valuations, I suggest you get a user manual (www.butkus.org), some film, and enjoy using it. IMHO Barnacks are great film cameras.

[ssmith]

Thanks to all for the info – this is exactly what I was looking for and it appears that one can disappear down the "Rabbit Hole" figuring out all the possible permutations of the factory modifications.  It is my intent to put some film through it and see what it is capable of.  In this day and age of mass production It is hard to figure the cost effectiveness of having your existing camera rebuilt to a new specification vs just trading it in and buying the new updated model.  I wouldn’t be surprised if my relative bought the camera new in the 30’s and had it upgraded as he progressed in his career.  It just highlights how hand-crafted these cameras were for their time.

Not only did I get the camera but it came with a leather accessory case with four additional lenses and just about every Leica accessory you could want (lens hoods, filters, macro lenses, copy stand etc).  This “kit” will keep me busy for some time.

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[romanus53]

At least some items of your kit can make you rich 😉 some desirable parts for collectors.

[LocalHero1953]

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What a wonderful collection, from family connection, and as a 'snapshot' of what was (I assume) a practical camera kit of the era used for another profession: I hope you're not going to break it up. And I'm glad you are going to use it. As long as there's no deterioration in the lenses (and it is often repairable), such cameras can take images that compare with most film cameras today. 

Edited November 10, 2023 by LocalHero1953

[alan mcfall]

Can you show a photo of the outside top of the leather combination case? If it is a Leitz case, it's one I have not seen before. Perhaps custom made.

The serial numbers for the 105 Elmar and 73 Hektor would be interesting.

The VEHIG is typically mounted on a larger stand, which is not shown here.

A panarama bracket is shown, is the rotating head in one of the boxes?

The "torpedo" finder with parallax correction is not common.

The small chrome rings mounted on the rear windows for the viewfinder and rangefinder may be diopter correction lenses.

A wonderful "kit".

 

Edited November 10, 2023 by alan mcfall
more text

[romualdo]

a snapshot in time - for me it's an Aladdin's cave - would love to see more of the items out of the case & smaller containers

you don't often see those diopters on the rangefinder & viewfinder eyepieces

Edited November 11, 2023 by romualdo

[ssmith]

Hi Alan - 

Looking closely at the case I can find no identifying markings or trademarks on either the case or the locking hardware.  See attached Photos.

The serial No. for the 73mm Hektor lens is 129130.

What you call the 105mm Elmar is actually a 135mm Elmar and interestingly enough its serial number matches that of the camera - 22238.  I am assuming that this may be somewhat unusual?

I do not have any additional hardware for the VEHIG.

What you are calling a panorama head I had assumed was some sort of stereo adapter (as it appears to flop the camera from one side of a tripod mount to the other) but I cannot seem to find it shown in the accessory catalogs that I have looked through.

Steve

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[jerzy]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb ssmith:

What you call the 105mm Elmar is actually a 135mm Elmar and interestingly enough its serial number matches that of the camera - 22238.  I am assuming that this may be somewhat unusual?

it is indeed, it indicates that the camera which was born as IA (fix mounted Elmar ) as converted to interchangeable mount possibly in the second half of 1930, lenses accompanying the camera are carrying camera serial number engraved. 

Do other lenses cary camera number engraved on the Depth of Field scale? could be 5 digit (22238) but could be as well 3 digit (238) - se example below

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Is there as well Elmar 35mm in the set?

Edited November 11, 2023 by jerzy
wrong comment

[jerzy]

vor 10 Stunden schrieb alan mcfall:

The "torpedo" finder with parallax correction is not common.

yes, black one are rare, chrome may be found more often

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[willeica]

2 hours ago, jerzy said:

it is indeed, it indicates that the camera which was born as IA (fix mounted Elmar ) as converted to interchangeable mount possibly in the second half of 1930, lenses accompanying the camera are carrying camera serial number engraved. 

Do other lenses cary camera number engraved on the Depth of Field scale? could be 5 digit (22238) but could be as well 3 digit (238) - se example below

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Is there as well Elmar 35mm in the set?

I agree with Jerzy. This camera was possibly 'upgraded' on at least two occasions- Non Std C and IIIa/f. It also looks like it was repainted at some stage, but the camera would have been originally black. Also chrome dials replaced nickel dials. The Elmar lens would not originally have had a depth of field scale, which came in around SN 40,000. It is a camera that has had an interesting journey and ssmith has acquired a very nice case full of early Leica lenses and accessories. We could have plenty of fun going through all of those items and identifying them. A very nice collection indeed.

 

15 hours ago, ssmith said:

In this day and age of mass production It is hard to figure the cost effectiveness of having your existing camera rebuilt to a new specification vs just trading it in and buying the new updated model. 

People thought differently back then. They had shoes and kettles mended and they did not think of buying a new camera model when it came out if they could have the old one 'upgraded'. Times have changed indeed. However, we have yet to fully deal with the mass of electronic waste lying around the planet. Your ancestor was ahead of his time as regards sustainability. 

William 

[ssmith]

I did a nearly complete inventory of the camera and accessories - here are the results:

• Leica IIIa Sync 35mm Film Vintage Range Finder Camera - Started out as a Fixed Lens Model Ia in 1930 - Modded one or more times Serial No. 22238
• Leitz Elmar 35mm f3.5 L39 Mount No Ser #   Good  Slight Haze
• Leitz Elmar 50mm f3.5 L39 Mount No Ser #    Very Good
• Leitz Hektor 73mm f1.9 L39 Mount Ser # 129130 Very Good w/ Metal Caps & Hood
• Leitz Elmar 105mm f6.3 L39 Mount Ser # 136173 Excellent w/ caps Hood & Case "Mountain Elmar"
• Leitz Elmar 135mm f4.5 L39 Mount Ser # 22238 Good w/ clear plastic front cap & Black Metal End Cap
• ORTVO Leitz Aluminum Screw-in Body Cap
• ELPRO Leitz 1* Screw-in Supplementary Front Lens - Missing
• ELPIK Leitz 2* Screw-in Supplementary Front Lens
• ELPET Leitz 3* Screw-in Supplementary Front Lens
• VIDOM Leitz Black Torpedo Viewfinder w/ Parallax Correction FOV: 5, 7.3, 13.5
• WINKO Leitz Early Black Rt Angle Viewfinder - Large Eyecup
• BEHOO Leitz Universal Clamping Ring & 4 Extensible Legs for Close-ups
• BEKUR Leitz 3 Extension Rings for 50mm Summar-Elmar
• BETAB Leitz 4 Intermediate rods
• BEOOY Leitz 4 Extensible Legs for Summar, Elmar and Hektor lenses
• Leitz Leather Case for Legs
• VEHIG Leitz 5x Ground Glass Focusing Stage
• FIBLA Leitz Right-Angle Camera Bracket
• DRXOO Leitz Reloadable Cassette with Leica Bright Aluminum Outer Case
• DRXOO Leitz Reloadable Cassette
• TYPE 6737 AGFAFIX Mechanical Timer - Shutter Release
• ABCOO Leitz Blade for Cutting Film - with leather sheath
• FISON Leitz Push-On Lens Hood with Rectangular Opening for 50mm 35mm
• FISON Leitz Late Model Lens Hood - Round Opening with clamping Ring for 50mm 35mm
• VALOO Leitz Combination Lens Hood & Aperture Adjusting Ring for 50mm &35mm
• POOEL Leitz Slip-On Polarizing Filter for 50mm & 35mm w/ Box
• #2 Leitz Slip-on Yellow-Green Filter
• Filter No Brand Slip-on Yellow-Green Filter - Color Similar to Leitz
• Filter LIFA "Welchzeichner 2" 35mm dia - in round clear plastic case
• Filter Toth Duto "0" 36mm dia Push-On Clear Filter
• Filter No Brand UV 36mm dia Push-On
• No Brand 1" Extension Ring Labeled "Repro"
• No Brand Step-Down Ring - Slip-On Filter Adapter ??
• SIXTUS Gossen Light Meter
• No Brand 10" Cable Shutter Release
• No Brand ~20 ft Cable Shutter Release
• Duotar Contessa-Nettel Tripod and Screw Adjustable Tripod Head
• Bilora Ball Mount Tripod Head

Attached is a photo of all five lenses with their caps and hoods.

The second photo shows the two accessories which I have not been able to identify.

I should say more about the focusing stage on the right.  On its backside it has the standard M39 screw threads but on the front side there are no female threads of any kind so I’m at a loss to figure out how something would attach to the front unless it was a “press-fit” of some kind although on a second look there appears to be a bayonet flange deep inside which can be discerned in the photo.

Thanks,

Steve

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Edited November 11, 2023 by ssmith

[Guest]

55 minutes ago, ssmith said:

The second photo shows the two access9ries which I have not been able to identify.

The item on the right in this photo is described by Lager (vol III, p. 147) as "ZWTEL (?) focus mount for 5cm 1:3.5 Elmar."

Laney (2nd ed, p. 419) lists the ZWTEL as an accessory to the sliding stage FULDY: "ZWTEL (1948) - Intermediate focusing mount for 50mm Elmar, improved type, focuses to infinity."

Edited November 11, 2023 by Studienkamera
added page number

[alan mcfall]

 

Great listing. The "torpedo" finder is probably not VIDOM. Perhaps VIFUR or another. Can you check the field of view frames again. All known torpedo's have a 35mm field.

The factory repair book may show the updates with dates and codes: first to interchangeable non-standard lenses, then later to IIIa sync features. Updating to non standard lenses that then required a 3 or 5 digit matching number was only available for a very  short time.

The "odd" non-Leitz accessory on the left in the lower photo, may be an aftermarket device to take stereo photos ( an alternative to the FIATE), where the mounted camera is exposed at one position and then again when rotated up and over and down to another position, giving separation. I assume there are no makers marks on it?

[FPangrazi]

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[jc_braconi]

On 11/11/2023 at 12:32 AM, alan mcfall said:

The small chrome rings mounted on the rear windows for the viewfinder and rangefinder may be diopter correction lenses.

A wonderful "kit".

 

Yes indeed
This little lens intrigue me as I never seen them before, looks that are adjustable also as the original lens are inside

[ssmith]

FP -  The Stereo Adapter is exactly as your catalog cut shows.  Attached is a phot of the markings on the piece.  The fact that the accessory case has an exact cut-out for this "Non-Leica" accessory would lead one to believe that the case was in fact custom-made.

JC - Also attached is a photo of the "Diopter Rings" Front & Back but there doesn't appear to be any markings showing their strength which in my opinion would be rather odd.

Alan - My mistake - There is a 3.5 marking at the bottom of the wide-open FOV that escaped my notice.  My original post was noting the Black Etched interior rectangles.

You guys are amazing - many thanks

 

 

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[AlexMogens]

Anthropologists with Leicas was/is definitely a thing. My Leica IIIc belonged to an Israeli Anthropologist, I recently found some Leica gear at the estate sale of a local Anthropologist, and my dad (an Anthropologist) rocked a M3 back in the day. And it makes sense... they were versatile instruments. Precise, sharp, good in the field, but also very adept at copy/reproduction work in archives.