Two kids.... Q2?

[JoshuaRothman]

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I sold my Q2 a while back to concentrate on the M system. I used the proceeds to buy some very nice M lenses. The Q2 was my main camera for a couple of years, but in the end I concluded that I just loved using M cameras, and I now have three: M10, M10M, M6. Since selling the Q2, I can count on one hand the times I've missed having autofocus.

All that said: my wife and I just had our second kid. Oh boy. Over the weekend, I was out with the family, pushing the baby stroller, wrangling the diaper bag, chasing my five year old as he ran one way while my daughter stayed behind in her stroller, holding on to one child or the other at pretty much all times . . . . Focusing with two hands was very difficult, and as for changing lenses, forget about it. I managed to get some decent photos with the 21 SEM at f/8, but that's it. My pictures were basically grab shots using range focusing. Okay sometimes, hardly ideal as the norm.

It made me miss the Q2. Thanks to the Q3, I could probably afford a used one. (I'm not very tempted by the improvements in the Q3.) I'm thinking that what I'd do is sell one of my Ms, plus the 21 SEM. Maybe I'd sell the M6 or the M10M—not sure which—but the M10 is my main squeeze and I don't really need three M cameras. I've also been streamlining my M lens kit so that all my lenses are pre-ASPH anyway; I'd end up making the Q2 my sole modern lens. I'm aiming to get down to three M lenses—28 Summaron, 35 Steel Rim, 50 Summicron. I could then have the bitingly sharp Q2 lens with its autofocus as my modern setup. There's something appealing about that division of labor. Maybe it makes sense?

But maybe I'm overreacting! Maybe I'll be able to handle two kids and an M. Perhaps I'm just sleep-deprived as a new parent, and giving in to totally senseless GAS. I sold the Q2 before because I was no longer enjoying AF or an EVF. I've since handled many very complicated family vacations with lots of kids and dogs on my Ms. And yet, suddenly, I'm finding myself wishing that I had the Q2 again, because it's the ultimate family camera. A bonus would be that my wife can use it, so maybe I'd finally be in some pictures.....

What should I do? I hate re-buying gear that I've sold, but maybe, in this case, it's justified?

[jaapv]

Use a smartphone for the home shots. A camera like the Q is vast overkill. 

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[JoshuaRothman]

1 minute ago, jaapv said:

Use a smartphone for the home shots. A camera like the Q is vast overkill. 

Not for me..... I really put a lot of effort into my family photography!

[jaapv]

You’d be surprised at the quality. A Q3 is a good amera for the purpose but I would opt for a camera with excellent AF like one of the Sonys, and keep your M gear for more demanding photography. 

[pcgarner]

And as you know, the Qs all allow you to manually focus whenever you want. From what I've read about half of us Qers use manual all the time. So you'd have options.

[bobtodrick]

1 hour ago, JoshuaRothman said:

Not for me..... I really put a lot of effort into my family photography!

Totally agree…people like Sally Mann made a whole career based on family ‘snaps’.

Your kids…your family…the most important part of your life deserves more than pointing your iPhone at them.

I’ve had more than a couple of exhibits and a book published of these.

As to the OP’s dilemma…I’d go for the Q2…it’s an excellent camera for ‘run and gun’ photography.  In the film days I used both M and R cameras…but always carried a CM for family stuff…the Leica equivalent of the Q back then.

[Panda2]

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Your M system seems settled, the Q would confuse it again imo - you can get a new/used GR III/x for those AF moments and leave M for those moments when you have both hands free

[Marc B-C]

Q2 and iPhone 15 Pro Max user here.

Go with the iPhone, download the Halide photo app and you have full manual control and 48mp to play with. Worst case, an iPhone 15 Pro Max would still save you 50% on the cost of a used Q2. I love my Q2 but please believe the Pro Raw shots that come out of the 'phone really are not bad at all. 5x optical Zoom is also pretty good.

[LocalHero1953]

I have absolutely no problem with the image quality from my iPhone 13, as long as I don't try to do too much with them. But as a one handed shoot with a kid in the other hand (grandkid in my case) I find it impossible. That's what I have my Q2 for: one handed shooting with AF, great image quality and a file you can properly work on.

[Qwertynm]

Suggesting someone that is 3 Ms deep into photography to get an iPhone to take pictures  of their kids is a bit insulting, don't you think 😅

Sure, todays phones take great images. If you're into photography tough an iPhone won't scratch that itch. I use my Q3 far more than my R5 for these family snaps although the AF is way better in the R5.

Maybe ask yourself if the factors that led you to sell the Q2 affect you the same today as when they did back then, when you sold the Q2. If that's the case, then there is no reason to buy the Q2 again (imho)

 

[Marc B-C]

18 minutes ago, Qwertynm said:

Suggesting someone that is 3 Ms deep into photography to get an iPhone to take pictures  of their kids is a bit insulting, don't you think 😅

 

Not insulting at all, just an alternative way of looking at an issue. That someone is free to do what they want, but we do not have to agree with their thoughts.

As a corollary, it could be argued that someone with just one Q2 is not that into photography. Also a single sided view.

[JoshuaRothman]

Thanks, everyone, for weighing in on my absurd dilemma!

The iPhone is not the solution for me. I've owned both GR III and GR IIIx in the past. They are awesome cameras, but at the end of the day I need a viewfinder. The same goes for phone cameras, actually. I'm just a viewfinder person.

24 minutes ago, Qwertynm said:

Maybe ask yourself if the factors that led you to sell the Q2 affect you the same today as when they did back then, when you sold the Q2. If that's the case, then there is no reason to buy the Q2 again (imho)

This is probably the key question. The answer is yes and no. Yes, in that I think I will still prefer the M system and the demands it places on me as a photographer, and will be irritated by having to choose between Q and M. No, in that I can more clearly see the particular value of the Q2 even beyond autofocus. For example, having spent awhile without the camera, I can see how nice it would be to have a fast 28mm with a very short MFD. And having given up my modern, ASPH M lenses, the Q2's lens will be more singular in my lineup.

For some reason, this M = vintage, Q2 = modern thing is really pulling me in. I think I'm going to do it!

 

[Qwertynm]

vor 18 Minuten schrieb Marc B-C:

(...) but we do not have to agree with their thoughts.

exactly.

Since I forgot to say this before @JoshuaRothman congrats on the second kid and happy shooting with your new old camera.

[Kim Dahl]

Maybe Q3 is not possible at all? But the flip screen on the Q3 is really good. Low light is way ahead of the Q2. Maybe wait a bit and use a good iPhone in the meantime until Q3 becomes possible? Maybe you will find out what a new iPhone (15Pro Max) in RAW files can really do for family pictures.

It will fit the leica M10 perfectly with your beautiful old lenses. So will Q2/3.

Congratulations on the new little one.

I have all models M9, M-D, M11 and now Q3 and iphone 15 pro max. Everyone is good in their own way. But as others have written - don't underestimate the iPhone 15 and RAW files... I'm just saying

[jaapv]

4 hours ago, Qwertynm said:

Suggesting someone that is 3 Ms deep into photography to get an iPhone to take pictures  of their kids is a bit insulting, don't you think 😅

Sure, todays phones take great images. If you're into photography tough an iPhone won't scratch that itch. I use my Q3 far more than my R5 for these family snaps although the AF is way better in the R5.

Maybe ask yourself if the factors that led you to sell the Q2 affect you the same today as when they did back then, when you sold the Q2. If that's the case, then there is no reason to buy the Q2 again (imho)

 

No I don’t think it is insulting. It is horses for courses. Leica is not a religion. Picking the right tool is not doctrine. 

[nariza7]

As a father to two young ones, I can only use one hand for taking photos and video. Other hand is usually doing a mix of pushing stroller, holding hands with one of the kids, holding something for the kids, etc, so two handed camera operations like manual focus are not possible at times. If I do, the wife will have double duty which is also not ideal aha. My q3 set-and-forget settings do help get the job done usually 

[Miltz]

On 11/2/2023 at 7:37 AM, bobtodrick said:

Totally agree…people like Sally Mann made a whole career based on family ‘snaps’.

Your kids…your family…the most important part of your life deserves more than pointing your iPhone at them.

I’ve had more than a couple of exhibits and a book published of these.

As to the OP’s dilemma…I’d go for the Q2…it’s an excellent camera for ‘run and gun’ photography.  In the film days I used both M and R cameras…but always carried a CM for family stuff…the Leica equivalent of the Q back then.

Unfortunately Sally Mann’s work of her family snaps isn’t exactly a good example as I don’t think most people will be photographing their kids nude, or in intimate situations. 
 

 

[Miltz]

On 11/2/2023 at 6:05 AM, JoshuaRothman said:

I sold my Q2 a while back to concentrate on the M system. I used the proceeds to buy some very nice M lenses. The Q2 was my main camera for a couple of years, but in the end I concluded that I just loved using M cameras, and I now have three: M10, M10M, M6. Since selling the Q2, I can count on one hand the times I've missed having autofocus.

All that said: my wife and I just had our second kid. Oh boy. Over the weekend, I was out with the family, pushing the baby stroller, wrangling the diaper bag, chasing my five year old as he ran one way while my daughter stayed behind in her stroller, holding on to one child or the other at pretty much all times . . . . Focusing with two hands was very difficult, and as for changing lenses, forget about it. I managed to get some decent photos with the 21 SEM at f/8, but that's it. My pictures were basically grab shots using range focusing. Okay sometimes, hardly ideal as the norm.

It made me miss the Q2. Thanks to the Q3, I could probably afford a used one. (I'm not very tempted by the improvements in the Q3.) I'm thinking that what I'd do is sell one of my Ms, plus the 21 SEM. Maybe I'd sell the M6 or the M10M—not sure which—but the M10 is my main squeeze and I don't really need three M cameras. I've also been streamlining my M lens kit so that all my lenses are pre-ASPH anyway; I'd end up making the Q2 my sole modern lens. I'm aiming to get down to three M lenses—28 Summaron, 35 Steel Rim, 50 Summicron. I could then have the bitingly sharp Q2 lens with its autofocus as my modern setup. There's something appealing about that division of labor. Maybe it makes sense?

But maybe I'm overreacting! Maybe I'll be able to handle two kids and an M. Perhaps I'm just sleep-deprived as a new parent, and giving in to totally senseless GAS. I sold the Q2 before because I was no longer enjoying AF or an EVF. I've since handled many very complicated family vacations with lots of kids and dogs on my Ms. And yet, suddenly, I'm finding myself wishing that I had the Q2 again, because it's the ultimate family camera. A bonus would be that my wife can use it, so maybe I'd finally be in some pictures.....

What should I do? I hate re-buying gear that I've sold, but maybe, in this case, it's justified?

Get a GR III… that’s what I would do. I had it, and I think for what you want it’s perfect. 

[bobtodrick]

1 hour ago, Miltz said:

Unfortunately Sally Mann’s work of her family snaps isn’t exactly a good example as I don’t think most people will be photographing their kids nude, or in intimate situations. 
 

 

Well, this is what Time Magazine said in 2021 when they voted her America's Best Photographer:

"Mann recorded a combination of spontaneous and carefully arranged moments of childhood repose and revealingly — sometimes unnervingly — imaginative play. What the outraged critics of her child nudes failed to grant was the patent devotion involved throughout the project and the delighted complicity of her son and daughters in so many of the solemn or playful events. No other collection of family photographs is remotely like it, in both its naked candor and the fervor of its maternal curiosity and care."

Admittedly in this day and age with the misuse of social media her it is seen in a different light.

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[Miltz]

12 minutes ago, bobtodrick said:

Well, this is what Time Magazine said in 2021 when they voted her America's Best Photographer:

"Mann recorded a combination of spontaneous and carefully arranged moments of childhood repose and revealingly — sometimes unnervingly — imaginative play. What the outraged critics of her child nudes failed to grant was the patent devotion involved throughout the project and the delighted complicity of her son and daughters in so many of the solemn or playful events. No other collection of family photographs is remotely like it, in both its naked candor and the fervor of its maternal curiosity and care."

Admittedly in this day and age with the misuse of social media her it is seen in a different light.

Yeah, the OP doesn't seem to be wanting to create a portfolio of their family for us to view, but who knows. I think the GR III is the best option. The thing is weightless and the image quality can't be touched by anything in its weight class and even above. I put its image quality above the original Q in every metric.