dpitt Posted October 23, 2023 Share #21 Â Posted October 23, 2023 Advertisement (gone after registration) 14 hours ago, Matlock said: This is all great news but in perspective Canon produced around 1.15 million cameras in a year (obviously none of them film). Do you happen to know how many of these Canon cameras where in there high end range? Let's say >$3000 retail price. Maybe that comparison would make more sense. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 23, 2023 Posted October 23, 2023 Hi dpitt, Take a look here Analog M are a huge success : 5K units in 2023. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Anbaric Posted October 23, 2023 Share #22  Posted October 23, 2023 9 hours ago, nicci78 said: Futureproof M6 is certainly a better buy than futureless M11 😉 I wish film were as futureproof as the cameras, especially if you shoot colour! Kodak seems to be the sole supplier of mainstream colour film. Fuji is either discontinued, indefinitely 'paused', old stock sold at inflated prices, or rebadged Kodak, at least where I live. That just leaves a few experimental films marketed to hipsters (hello Wolfen) and repurposed emulsions, like the aerial and cine-derived stuff. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock Posted October 24, 2023 Share #23 Â Posted October 24, 2023 9 hours ago, dpitt said: Do you happen to know how many of these Canon cameras where in there high end range? Let's say >$3000 retail price. Maybe that comparison would make more sense. I don't have any idea of the figures, I was just trying to indicate the difference in production levels of the various camera makers. Leica has a 1% share of the camera market of around 3.5millian. Film cameras make up around 3% of that 1% total so pretty small. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colonel Posted October 24, 2023 Share #24  Posted October 24, 2023 19 hours ago, nicci78 said: Who cares about Canon ? we are talking about 5K M6-MP vs 11-12K M11-M11 Monochrom. The ratio is incredible  Futureproof M6 is certainly a better buy than futureless M11 😉 It seems many M8s and M9s are working fine, and the M240 was incredibly robust. I don't think an M11 is futureless. Many of the electronic canon and nikon AF film cameras are still in easy circulation. I have a Nikon F something and it works fine. It is true that a purely mechanical camera can be maintained forever (if you can find someone to do it) but for some people, the 60mp sensor on the M11 and its general operation could be a camera for life. In fact a second hand M240 or M10 could be a camera for life. the rest is just GAS ..... 3 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicci78 Posted October 24, 2023 Author Share #25  Posted October 24, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, Matlock said: I don't have any idea of the figures, I was just trying to indicate the difference in production levels of the various camera makers. Leica has a 1% share of the camera market of around 3.5millian. Film cameras make up around 3% of that 1% total so pretty small. What I am trying to say is that film M cameras are more around 10-15% of Leica units than 1%. So it is not 1% of 1% ! If we read around the lines from both interviews we got Q and M are the best selling at around the same level. Way behind SL then almost non existent S. So 30% of the main line up is excellent for analog M. It may appeared that Leica is selling around the same amount of M6/MP than SL2/SL2-S.  They are quite concerned about SL2 slow sales Edited October 24, 2023 by nicci78 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matlock Posted October 24, 2023 Share #26  Posted October 24, 2023 3 minutes ago, nicci78 said: What I am trying to say is that film M cameras are more around 10-15% of Leica units than 1%. So it is not 1% of 1% ! If we read around the lines from both interviews we got Q and M are the best selling at around the same level. Way behind SL then almost non existent S. So 30% of the main line up is excellent for analog M. It may appeared that Leica is selling around the same amount of M6/MP than SL2/SL2-S. M cameras may account for 10-15% of Leica but FILM Ms account for around 3% of Leica production which is quite a different thing. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdjdjdi Posted October 24, 2023 Share #27  Posted October 24, 2023 Advertisement (gone after registration) Who cares until they can make them with any sort of quality control the number could be zero Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldwino Posted October 25, 2023 Share #28  Posted October 25, 2023 17 hours ago, Jdjdjdi said: Who cares until they can make them with any sort of quality control the number could be zero Or at least repair them in a reasonable amount of time. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakontil Posted October 25, 2023 Share #29  Posted October 25, 2023 Amazing what leica has done to prolong its M films longevity, let’s hope films being kept affordable and alive 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
newtoleica Posted October 25, 2023 Share #30  Posted October 25, 2023 11 hours ago, jakontil said: Amazing what leica has done to prolong its M films longevity, let’s hope films being kept affordable and alive I think the affordability bit departed a while ago... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 26, 2023 Share #31  Posted October 26, 2023 5 hours ago, newtoleica said: I think the affordability bit departed a while ago... Color is a bit nuts, but black and white isn't bad. And black and white are the colors of photography anyway* *So says Robert Frank, and who am I to argue? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakontil Posted October 26, 2023 Share #32  Posted October 26, 2023 3 hours ago, logan2z said: Color is a bit nuts, but black and white isn't bad. And black and white are the colors of photography anyway* *So says Robert Frank, and who am I to argue? I love the BW in films, ilford have been doing just fine keeping it affordable and fomapan still exist… that’s all i need in very honest opinion, color is just a bonus Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fotoklaus Posted October 26, 2023 Share #33 Â Posted October 26, 2023 Yes. FP4 is fine, HP5 is fine and i still got some orig. APX 100 and orig. AGFA Rodinal. A wonderful combination. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
newtoleica Posted October 26, 2023 Share #34  Posted October 26, 2023 Kodak films are nuts though. tri-X has more than doubled in the past 5 years. I have a load in my freezer but……. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
logan2z Posted October 26, 2023 Share #35  Posted October 26, 2023 13 minutes ago, newtoleica said: Kodak films are nuts though. tri-X has more than doubled in the past 5 years. That's why I've switched to Ilford HP5+ and FP4+. Besides the price, I prefer the look of HP5+ to Tri-X. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
newtoleica Posted October 26, 2023 Share #36  Posted October 26, 2023 45 minutes ago, logan2z said: That's why I've switched to Ilford HP5+ and FP4+. Besides the price, I prefer the look of HP5+ to Tri-X. Unfortunately I feel the other way on this. Tri-x's high contrast roll off has always been 'my thing'. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borna Posted October 27, 2023 Share #37  Posted October 27, 2023 Very interesting news, however - I have some speculations regarding the future: I am afraid that with the popularity of MP, M-A and M6 and specifically regarding to that they are most likely sold out everywhere that there is a price raise in the horizon. I mean if digital bodies goes for 9-10k, would not surprise me if we will find analog bodies for 7-8k within the future. Just my two cents. But I love that they are pushing analog in 2023. Amazing news Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Prime Posted November 14, 2023 Share #38 Â Posted November 14, 2023 Don't mistake the 'glad they are pushing analogue' for evidence that they care about analogue. They are pushing it because they know people with money to burn will hand over their wallets - nothing more. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hansvons Posted November 15, 2023 Share #39  Posted November 15, 2023 22 hours ago, Mr.Prime said: Don't mistake the 'glad they are pushing analogue' for evidence that they care about analogue. They are pushing it because they know people with money to burn will hand over their wallets - nothing more. This is quite an assumption. Leica was the only camera manufacturer that didn't abandon film for good, nor did it globalise its entire manufacturing. Both would have cut down costs and increased revenues for the stakeholders. They did not. You cannot run a company that sells goods no one needs on greed and quick money. You have to live what you say, stick to it and do so with a long breath. Otherwise, you'll lose authenticity. For a company that sells premium products in a difficult market, losing authenticity is the recipe for a quick death. Leica sponsors exhibitions and supports young and aspiring photographers from diverse backgrounds with diverse stories in their work. Keeping film is one of these measures to keep the zeitgeist and the art crowd around. Without the film Ms (now three models!) Leica would lose a quintessential gene in the brand code. The M6-neu success corroborates that. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bags27 Posted November 15, 2023 Share #40  Posted November 15, 2023 On 10/26/2023 at 4:19 AM, newtoleica said: Kodak films are nuts though. tri-X has more than doubled in the past 5 years. I have a load in my freezer but……. Kodak just actually lowered the prices of some of their 120 color films. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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