Undisciplined Framing Style or Shooting from the Hip Images

[RSH-Photo]

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Shot from the hip. D-Lux 7.

 

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[Ken Abrahams]

17 hours ago, erl said:

I have to confess that I have an inbuilt aversion to 'undisciplined' and 'hip' type shots. That is not to say I don't practice them. I do, or have in the past. For an image grab my attention, it has to 'say' something. Anything, but give me a reason for looking at it. One picture is worth a thousand words could be one of the greatest untruths of the modern era. I see so many images, on this forum and other places, that quite frankly have near zero connection between the image and the given title or description. What I am saying is that sometimes the given description kills the image because there is no obvious link. If you give an image a description, make sure anyone who was not there can clearly see the connection. If you can't find an effective connection, it probably means your image is a failure. A bit of a rant, I know, but I am not apologetic.

When I travelled a lot, mainly in third world countries, I was supremely conscious that many locals don't like being photographed. I developed a technique of shooting from all sorts of positions that feigned anything but what I was really shooting. I practised hard at home to perfect the style. Basically, I simple wanted to document my travels in as an authentic way as possible. The other advantage I exploited was speed. I always shot fast to be discreet, often feigning 'no shot', but in fact had banged of one or two fast ones.

The one thing that stands out in all my shots is the disciplined composition. I do it naturally without thinking about it, mostly. I have a high count of successful (IMO) shots using this general approach. I also have untold losses that I mourn, but console myself that at least no one was offended. A prime rule of mine.

I have scoured my files for evidence of hip or undiscipled pics to add in. A hard task, but I found one shot in Fes of the 'water boy'. I had stalked him over various days, but he did his best to evade. me. Finally, I got him, from the hip, but I only consider it works because of his customer, who has spotted what I am doing, drinking in the background. No caption needed, IMO.

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I am glad you posted an image from the hip regardless of your aversion to the practice Erl. You have been critical in the past on my posts and I hear what you say about pretentious titles. Perhaps you should start post a topic on the subject somewhere else? The qualities your image would have been lost had the man in the hat looked at you. Sometimes if your quick enough you might get the shot in a normal shooting mode however your response here to capturing the scene from the hip was a wise choice.   

Ken 

[erl]

1 hour ago, Ken Abrahams said:

I am glad you posted an image from the hip regardless of your aversion to the practice Erl. You have been critical in the past on my posts and I hear what you say about pretentious titles. Perhaps you should start post a topic on the subject somewhere else? The qualities your image would have been lost had the man in the hat looked at you. Sometimes if your quick enough you might get the shot in a normal shooting mode however your response here to capturing the scene from the hip was a wise choice.   

Ken 

Just to be clear Ken, My comments are directed at all postings, not specifically yours. My comments only ended up in your thread because of the title. I understand your interest in the style and practice of it and I don't recommend you to change. We are each animals of our vision and experience and that remains the moulding or our images. Clearly we both have different styles and intents, that will not change. At least we both know what we like.

[otto.f]

On 6/19/2023 at 3:59 PM, fotografr said:

Many of us

That depends totally on where you are. In most Asian and Central Asian countries people are happy and grateful to be photographed. That's my experience. About everybody shoots with an iPhone nowadays and in the meantime people can think further that there's actually no difference with shooting with a bigger camera.

Personally I don't shoot from the hip because I mainly want to have the 'target' sharp and the rest unsharp, I'm not a f5.6 street shooter.

Edited December 7, 2024 by otto.f

[otto.f]

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Edited December 7, 2024 by otto.f

[fotografr]

5 hours ago, otto.f said:

That depends totally on where you are. In most Asian and Central Asian countries people are happy and grateful to be photographed. That's my experience. About everybody shoots with an iPhone nowadays and in the meantime people can think further that there's actually no difference with shooting with a bigger camera.

Personally I don't shoot from the hip because I mainly want to have the 'target' sharp and the rest unsharp, I'm not a f5.6 street shooter.

Where I live (Midwest US) people are increasingly annoyed by having an actual camera pointed at them without their consent--even though in public spaces it is legal to do so. There seems to be more acceptance when shooting with a phone. It makes no sense.

[Aram Langhans]

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On 6/19/2023 at 10:53 PM, londond said:

Next, using Leica Fotos remote to frame the image

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Ha.  I don't think these people would have been aware if you had pointed a gun at them instead of a camera.  But I like the lower perspective of the hip shot.  It would not  have been as good as shot if you had raised the camera to eye level.

[Ken Abrahams]

On 12/7/2024 at 11:16 AM, erl said:

Just to be clear Ken, My comments are directed at all postings, not specifically yours. My comments only ended up in your thread because of the title. I understand your interest in the style and practice of it and I don't recommend you to change. We are each animals of our vision and experience and that remains the moulding or our images. Clearly we both have different styles and intents, that will not change. At least we both know what we like.

I posted a reply to your last comment Erl stating again that you should post your own thread about "titles" instead of randomly and suspiciously posting in my thread which was also a reply to one of my posts. I think it would be only fair for me to add this boundary as you have been critical previously. Now I find that post has been deleted without any advice to me. Is that of your own doing Erl seeing you are listed as a Moderator? I am only trying to keep things out in the open here Erl, as a member and contributor of this forum. I would hope that you would use your moderating position fairly.  I hope my reply post to you went astray somewhere and its just mistake its gone.  

Regards

Ken    

[erl]

3 hours ago, Ken Abrahams said:

I posted a reply to your last comment Erl stating again that you should post your own thread about "titles" instead of randomly and suspiciously posting in my thread which was also a reply to one of my posts. I think it would be only fair for me to add this boundary as you have been critical previously. Now I find that post has been deleted without any advice to me. Is that of your own doing Erl seeing you are listed as a Moderator? I am only trying to keep things out in the open here Erl, as a member and contributor of this forum. I would hope that you would use your moderating position fairly.  I hope my reply post to you went astray somewhere and its just mistake its gone.  

Regards

Ken    

Ken, I don't understand how you are assessing my posts. I am doing nothing suspiciously, as you say. I was giving a genuine POV on the topic you started. I assumed all comments to be welcome. Because mine, in your opinion, appear negative, should not discount them from consideration. I am fairly confident I do not hold such opinions alone.

As for your allegedly deleted post, I have no knowledge. Certainly not my doing. If you consider any of my actions or posts as unfair, you must report them immediately. The other mods and the admin will fairly deal with it.

[Ken Abrahams]

From the hip 

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[Ken Abrahams]

On 12/7/2024 at 9:38 PM, fotografr said:

Where I live (Midwest US) people are increasingly annoyed by having an actual camera pointed at them without their consent--even though in public spaces it is legal to do so. There seems to be more acceptance when shooting with a phone. It makes no sense.

Yes, when I tell them there are cctv cameras everywhere taking footage or explain the law, some continue with great disrespect to me. When they ask for me to delete the picture I say, "okay I will". Then they wait expecting me to delete the image in front of them but by now they are being disrespectful and discriminatory. I refuse to be the victim and say firmly, "I will delete the image", again (like when I get home at my desk) until they get it that they will have to trust me, inferring to them that I will not tolerate their discriminatory behaviour.  Sometimes I might explain more so and show them the image that it is actually quite flattering. I am sure we all have experienced the good and bad of dealing with some people. I dont wish to get drawn into any discussions these days and avoid any discussion about the law and street photography. I dont believe I have to validate my existence. My friend tells them to go ahead and call the police.

Some time into the future I believe the law will change and street photographers will need a permit of some kind.  

[Ken Abrahams]

On 12/7/2024 at 4:27 PM, otto.f said:

Personally I don't shoot from the hip because I mainly want to have the 'target' sharp and the rest unsharp, I'm not a f5.6 street shooter.

Not wanting to brag or anything but I shoot at 1.4 from the hip with the 35 or 28 M Summilux. Admittedly there are reject shots however there are also some very sharp, in focus images too. My only problem is too much exposure and using good ND filters. The SL2S is good for 1/16000 sec but the SL3 cannot achieve that in A mode and the M10M is also limited. It's probably just as well the SL3 is capped at 1/8000 because of an inherent bug because the rolling shutter will get you anyway. 

Best

Ken 

[fotografr]

17 minutes ago, Ken Abrahams said:

Some time into the future I believe the law will change and street photographers will need a permit of some kind.  

If that happens, cell phone cameras will likely be exempt. There seems to be a common belief that anyone with an interchangable lens camera is a professional and will be selling their images.

[Ken Abrahams]

3 minutes ago, fotografr said:

If that happens, cell phone cameras will likely be exempt. There seems to be a common belief that anyone with an interchangable lens camera is a professional and will be selling their images.

Yes and posting them (images) on the internet too Brent. 

[otto.f]

54 minutes ago, fotografr said:

If that happens, cell phone cameras will likely be exempt. There seems to be a common belief that anyone with an interchangable lens camera is a professional and will be selling their images.

 

50 minutes ago, Ken Abrahams said:

Yes and posting them (images) on the internet too Brent. 

 

Edited December 16, 2024 by otto.f

[Hell]

On 6/21/2023 at 9:56 PM, Mike S said:

 

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I like this picture. Is this Camden? I got a whole bunch of dud shots there this summer!

[Mike S]

12 hours ago, Hell said:

I like this picture. Is this Camden? I got a whole bunch of dud shots there this summer!

Thank you. Same canal, but Paddington basin, just at the back exit from the railway station.

[Taloan]

Am 5.7.2023 um 14:54 schrieb Ken Abrahams:

The low angle works well for this image and the wide 21 SEM lens allows for vertical perspectives to be corrected. It really is a favourite lens and works extremely well with both SL2 and SL2S cameras. I tried using the 35 APO SL from the hip today however it just wont focus where I point it and its too big. I knew it but had to give it a go anyway.  It looks like the M lenses will be around for a long time.    

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Hi Ken, lot of your images seem to have a little posterize/aquarell effect in the backgrounds. Is that coming from the camera/lens or do you add that effect in post?

Edited December 17, 2024 by Taloan

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[Ken Abrahams]

2 hours ago, Taloan said:

Hi Ken, lot of your images seem to have a little posterize/aquarell effect in the backgrounds. Is that coming from the camera/lens or do you add that effect in post?

Yes Taloan, I have my own impressions that are applied to some images. Maybe I could have cleaned this one up a bit more after looking at it now. 

Cheers 

 

[Ken Abrahams]

From the Hip Summilux M 28 1.4 

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