my sad M11 story - an electronic grave

[Jan1985]

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After I purchased the M11 last year I was really happy to own one. It was a great feeling back then to work with this nice tool. And for 8.500€ I thought I have a perfect tool made in Wetzlar.

But just 2 months later the sad story began. After a shooting I tried to charge my M11 but it didnt‘t work. I tried to power on the camera but always the red small LED light on the back was on. Even after I put off the battery and in it was the same. So I send it to Wetzlar. 4 days later they told me that the whole mainboard is damaged and they need to exchange it completely. 2 weeks later I got my M11 back and it worked very well for next weeks.

But 4 weeks ago my Visoflex 2 stopped working on the M11. It was powered on but the screen remained dark. I switched on and off the camera and also took off and on the Visoflex. But nothing changed. So I sent it to Leica again. 2 weeks later they told that another circuit board failed and they also have to replace it. So now i have to wait until the end of March until I get it back. And I told them that I need it faster because I also use it for commercial work.

To be honest I am a bit disappointed. I never had such problems with any Leica camera before. One possibility is that I have a so called „monday“ brand with quality issues just for this piece. the other option is that Leica has some real problems with one supplier of electronic components or with the whole construction of this extremely expensive camera. That is not what Leica is known for with its quality promise. 

My hope was that they replace the whole camera with a new unit because I still have guarantee. But maybe it‘s not worth to make a customer happy.

Does anyone have identical issues with the M11?

Edited March 6, 2023 by Jan1985

[Qlan]

Sorry to hear about your issues. I also have my share of them: mostly freezes/lock ups (still happening with 1.6.1), rarely overexposure (hopefully fixed with 1.6.1), sometimes red light of death, etc, and more recently the mechanical shutter doesn't go past 1s... In the process of exchanging my second M11...

[DenverSteve]

I would tell the authorized dealer you purchased it from that you need a loaner while yours is being repaired, a second time.  Others have done so.  I know it’s frustrating to be one of the few that have had multiple issues but, it will be resolved and, hopefully, you’ll love the camera.

[thatkatmat]

See if you can exchange it for an M10-R...Never have I had a single issue. Sorry about what you are going through. Happened to me years ago with a Canon 1DmkIII. 

I guess now we both know to never buy a newly developed body from any maker until the first couple firmware updates.

Edited March 7, 2023 by thatkatmat

[Siriusone59]

I cannot for the life of me understand why Leica is so hellbent on destroying their own brand with the crap they've been pushing on the public lately.  It makes no sense whatsoever.  They've made some errors that could be corrected and many have but overall I can see people avoiding the brand based on the recent experiences of those published here and on other sites.  There is a problem that I hope they address soon before this gets beyond the scope of typical damage control. I would definitely think twice before purchasing any new Leica product.

[LeicaR10]

Thatkatmat,  I second your post #6.  I had the M11, swapped back to the M10-R.  Most reliable M camera that I have owned to date.  Might well be the last M camera I own as well.  Just my thoughts.  r/ Mark

Edited March 7, 2023 by LeicaR10

[Harout62]

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I would ask them for a new Camera , it is crazy that you should have to live with that Lemon 

[lct]

6 hours ago, Jan1985 said:

[...] So I sent it to Leica again. 2 weeks later they told that another circuit board failed and they also have to replace it. So now i have to wait until the end of March until I get it back. And I told them that I need it faster because I also use it for commercial work.

Contrary to what is sometimes advised on internet forums, i would not deal this kind of matter directly with the manufacturer as it will tend to repair the body, which will take some time necessarily, let alone that you did not pay to get a repaired body. Depending on your local laws, you should be entitled to require a refund or a replacement and to ask this the only person with whom you have a contract and a legal warranty i.e. the vendor.

[LocalHero1953]

4 hours ago, lct said:

Contrary to what is sometimes advised on internet forums, i would not deal this kind of matter directly with the manufacturer as it will tend to repair the body, which will take some time necessarily, let alone that you did not pay to get a repaired body. Depending on your local laws, you should be entitled to require a refund or a replacement and to ask this the only person with whom you have a contract and a legal warranty i.e. the vendor.

The OP is in Germany, so I am also curious about the response of the vendor.

[WvE]

Sorry to hear about your frustration. It's starting to grow on me that the M11 electronics are too complex or just inferior (admittedly, I don't have the statistics). That said, back in the day my M9 arrived dead on arrival. In any event, if I were in the market for an M11, I would be very hesitant before spending that kind of money. 

[jaapv]

2 hours ago, Al Brown said:

If the camera was not acquired in EU online (in which case there are 14 days to refund), the vendors by law here do NOT offer a refund or exchange (unlike USA) but send the camera to Leica instead as a warranty issue, no exceptions. So if OP (from Germany) sends it himself instead of the vendor it will only speed up the process - the procedure OP did was absolutely correct. In SUPER RARE occasions the EU vendor would, at their discretion, exchange the camera for another one. It mostly depends how good one is with the vendor (and how much money one leaves there).

Leica regularly supplies loaners as a courtesy. It is not an issue a dealer would normally deal with. 

[cboy]

I feel for you OP. Something that's not small change becoming a paperweight is depressing.Id feel gutted if it happened to me. Hopefully warranty will get you a new unit. I would never try to charge my camera via USB C. There's always a risk of a voltage spike ( especially in places/ countries with unreliable power) passing through the main board of ones camera and frying it. Not saying that's the reason behind all failures and or even the OP situation but for me it's not worth taking a risk. I not yet lazy as to not remove the battery and plug into a charging dock. Ymmv

[chris7273]

10 minutes ago, cboy said:

I would never try to charge my camera via USB C.

I think that this possibility was thought for charging with a powerbank. 

[jaapv]

28 minutes ago, cboy said:

I feel for you OP. Something that's not small change becoming a paperweight is depressing.Id feel gutted if it happened to me. Hopefully warranty will get you a new unit. I would never try to charge my camera via USB C. There's always a risk of a voltage spike ( especially in places/ countries with unreliable power) passing through the main board of ones camera and frying it. Not saying that's the reason behind all failures and or even the OP situation but for me it's not worth taking a risk. I not yet lazy as to not remove the battery and plug into a charging dock. Ymmv

I run both my HiFi and computing systems through a big 240-240 V transformer. I live close to a huge industrial area. After Shell generated a 400V+ spike through the mains which blew up the computers and X-ray machines in my practice I learnt my lesson.  Surge protectors everywhere. 

[geotrupede]

sorry for the terrible experience. in my case the M11 has been good, even if not treated gently the system has worked. there have been bugs and odd things here and there but mostly ok.

the visoflex however is the second unit as the first refused to work reliably. the newer one seems ok, sometimes it does not work but in/out/on/off and it goes. 

the new FW would appear to have resolved the issue or so I hope. 

Thinking back to my previous leica digitals...

M8, shutter fault (remember that?) and IR filters and coffee screen (remember that?)

M9, faulty lens reader, corroded sensor.

MM, corroded sensor

SL, faulty motherboard corrupting JPGs

M11, so far few bugs but nothing major, apart the VISO

SL2S, all works fine!

So, it would appear that the ONLY ever digital leica I had with no issues was the SL2S to date...

M11 not too bad as issue was with VISO.

all others some major problem at some stage.

G>

 

Edited March 7, 2023 by geotrupede
SL not SL2...

[Photoworks]

1 hour ago, geotrupede said:

M11, so far few bugs but nothing major, apart the VISO

I had the same issue, it was driving me insane, i went to the store to get another.

turns out a bit of contacts cleaning on camera and EVF solved it for me, never gave me an issue in months since then.

[Antonio Russell]

Sorry to hear about your problems with the M11. My camera also froze on me after a few weeks light use. It was completely bricked. I was able to persuade Leica Spain to provide a replacement camera but it was not easy. The replacement has, on the whole, been good although I did have a scare a few days ago turning on the camera to find a frozen display that was luckily resolved by cycling the power. I guess the big fear at the back of my mind is what happens when the camera is out of warranty.... did I just invest in a very expensive paperweight? How long will Leica stand behind these cameras? Thankfully the image quality is superb and hopefully things will be OK but it is a worry.

[Tomas Eriksson]

What USB-c charger are you using? Thinking that either you have a wonky usb-c charger and/or that the m11 might not have good enough surge protection or voltage regulating circuitry.

[skahde]

vor 20 Stunden schrieb Al Brown:

If the camera was not acquired in EU online (in which case there are 14 days to refund), the vendors by law here do NOT offer a refund or exchange (unlike USA) but send the camera to Leica instead as a warranty issue, no exceptions. 

The exception is two failed attempts to repair the camera (§440 BGB), at this point the dealer can no longer deny a refund. 

Edited March 8, 2023 by skahde

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[skahde]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb Al Brown:

45 days have to pass from the purchase and then yes.

Close but not exactly correct: It's either two attempts to rectify the problem or up to 6 weeks after the seller gets the opportunity to do something about it. Not both combined. But I'm not a lawyer and can't give any definitive recommendation about the actual case. 

Edited March 8, 2023 by skahde