50mm Summilux pre-asph E46 vs 50mm 1.2 Noctilux remake or stick with 50mm Summicron V5

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I currently have the 50mm Summicron V5 (silver chrome) and have lately been smitten by the older Leica lenses and Mandler magic compared to the newer ASPH. lenses.

Currently loving my 35mm Summicron V3, 35mm 1.4 Steel Rim remake and 28mm 5.6 Summaron remake. 😊

I generally shoot people photography in reportage kind of style focusing on mood, composition and light.

Now, I’m considering changing my 50mm Summicron towards either a 50mm Summilux pre-asph E46 or the 1.2 Noctilux remake. 

Will these give a more gentle rendering like the 35Cron V3 and 35SR or I’m a just GAS’ing and already have all the Mandler Magic I can get in the 50Cron V5?

Any thoughts/advice would be greatly appreciated.

Best, Mads

[wda]

Hello Mads,

Whatever you do, keep your Summicron lens. It has proven its worth to you, and that needn't change. If you add another 50 mm lens, your results will not be very much different. If you enjoy people photography,  travel to a new destination and find new subjects of interest to you there. Find new challenges. Get rid of GAS.

[lct]

Cannot tell for the 50/1.2 but the 50/1.4 v3 would give you a more gentle rendering at f/1.4. At f/2 it is slightly sharper than the 50/2 v5 at the centre of the frame but it is also softer at edges and corners. It never gives me a clinical feeling anyway. Otherwise, the 50/1.4 v3 has less flare and focus shift than the 50/2 v5 but i would not expect significant sharpness on edges and corners below f/5.6. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Al Brown said:

Noctilux 50/1.2 remake is a purely character lens, you *must* test one out before deciding, there is a 99% chance you will not like it.

Also if I LOVE the 35mm SR re-make which is quite glowy at f/1.4. 😊

[spydrxx]

GAS can only be relieved by either coming to your senses or making a purchase😁

[darylgo]

50/1.4 v3 or v2 or v1, they're all great.  My 50/1.2 reissue (no longer mine) is the 99% majority Al has stated, otoh the 50/1 is two thumbs up with the caveat that CA becomes difficult in some lighting situations, 24mp is okay, 40 or 60mp it becomes difficult to remove in post.    

[kretsche]

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vor 7 Stunden schrieb mcpallesen:

BI currently have the 50mm Summicron V5 (silver chrome) and have lately been smitten by the older Leica lenses and Mandler magic compared to the newer ASPH. lenses.

Currently loving my 35mm Summicron V3, 35mm 1.4 Steel Rim remake and 28mm 5.6 Summaron remake. 😊

I generally shoot people photography in reportage kind of style focusing on mood, composition and light.

Now, I’m considering changing my 50mm Summicron towards either a 50mm Summilux pre-asph E46 or the 1.2 Noctilux remake. 

Will these give a more gentle rendering like the 35Cron V3 and 35SR or I’m a just GAS’ing and already have all the Mandler Magic I can get in the 50Cron V5?

Any thoughts/advice would be greatly appreciated.

Best, Mads

Maybe that will help you, from page 6…

 

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, kretsche said:

Maybe that will help you, from page 6…

 

Thank you @kretsche

Just looked through the thread. It looks amazing!! So much the look I’m going for. I think this will be my next lens although a crazy price…

Let’s see… the 50mm Summilux pre-asph e46 seems slightly more dreamy but controlled, if that makes sense?

[Guest]

Bump, for further input/advice from 50mm 1.2 Nocti reissue or 50mm Summilux pre-asph E46 owners.

Much appreciated 😊

[didier]

Hello Mads,

I understand your thoughts. I own 7 Leica 50s 🙃 … but neither the pre-asph lux, nor the 1.2 Noct.

It is great to have several Lenses with different footprints and character.

I am considering selling my ‘lux asph 50 standard version (as I got the BC version recently) and buy either the 1,2 or the lux v3.

I have very mixed feelings with the 1,2 Noct : I had the opportunity to spend half an hour with it twice in Wetzlar. Size is great : it is small and handy (compared to the other Nocts).
First time I tested it I was very unhappy with the results. I found the results dull and not interesting; particularly portraits at short distance.

Second time, I loved the results I got, particularly at mid-distance (portraits).

My conclusion is it would not be my everyday Lens but a very specialty Lens. I will probably wait to see how the used market for this lens evolves…

I have a huge regret not buying the ‘lux v3 15 years ago as I had the opportunity to buy a mint silver copy for Eur 900… Given the actual prices I hesitate, but I may take the plunge…

Didier 

 

 

 

[thighslapper]

If you are shooting with a digital M you can emulate all the things you like in processing ..... but you can't easily reverse the baked in aberrations and 'character' of an old lens. 

Of course, if you are shooting film then things are different. 

It always amuses me that Leica has spent a century seeking optical perfection only to find users preferring to stick old inferior optics on their cameras ...... 

[Shubee]

The 50mm 1.2 is the most endearing of the 50mm. Capricious at 1.2, easier to control at 2 (provided you center the subject), delightful and as easy to use as any other 50mm at 2.8. Plus an ideal focusing ring and a round diagram. It's a lens that takes some learning, but it's worth it.

[Keith (M)]

For me the 50mm f1.2 re-issue is proving to be an easier / more pleasant lens to use than the f1 v4 I had previously whilst possessing similar quirks and character.  It has (not yet) displaced my other 50mm's as the go-to choice, it may well do so soon (others are Summilux ASPH, Summicron 5cm Collapsible & ZM C-Sonnar f1.5).  Whether it be at f1.2 or f8, on M11 or M10M, I have been delighted with results.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, didier said:

Hello Mads,

I understand your thoughts. I own 7 Leica 50s 🙃 … but neither the pre-asph lux, nor the 1.2 Noct.

It is great to have several Lenses with different footprints and character.

I am considering selling my ‘lux asph 50 standard version (as I got the BC version recently) and buy either the 1,2 or the lux v3.

I have very mixed feelings with the 1,2 Noct : I had the opportunity to spend half an hour with it twice in Wetzlar. Size is great : it is small and handy (compared to the other Nocts).
First time I tested it I was very unhappy with the results. I found the results dull and not interesting; particularly portraits at short distance.

Second time, I loved the results I got, particularly at mid-distance (portraits).

My conclusion is it would not be my everyday Lens but a very specialty Lens. I will probably wait to see how the used market for this lens evolves…

I have a huge regret not buying the ‘lux v3 15 years ago as I had the opportunity to buy a mint silver copy for Eur 900… Given the actual prices I hesitate, but I may take the plunge…

Didier 

 

 

 

Thanks Didier for the great input. I'm still back and forth, especially with 50mm not being my main FL (35mm is). I took my 50mm Summicron V5 silver chrome out for a spin yesterday on my M10Mono, and must say it also gives fine results. The huge increase in 50Lux pre-asph v3 prices, makes me feel, that it's either sticking to my 50Cron V5 or taking the plunge for the 50Noct 1.2 re-issue. 

I also started reading about the 50mm Summicron V3, which also sounds like a delightful lens - but maybe too close to my 50 V5? Apparently it never ends... 🙂 

[jakontil]

On 12/5/2022 at 12:45 AM, spydrxx said:

GAS can only be relieved by either coming to your senses or making a purchase😁

i end up collecting the 50's

[Aryel]

They have a very different rendering at large apertures. If you are considering replacing your summicron I’d suggest the summilux. If you are looking at a complement then the noctilux maybe as it is more different when compared to your summicron. Only you can decide.

I really like both. One thing to note about the noctilux is that usually reviewers will describe it as a lens that can be very versatile. I strongly disagree with this description. The really long focus throw is great for shooting at large apertures but is a hindrance (for me) when closed down. This is why I suggest to look at it as a complementary lens. 

Have fun deciding, at the end, nothing can beat trying out. They’re both great. 

As a film shooter, the summilux e46 is the most versatile of the two for me. I do not hesitate to take it along when travelling:

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Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

For me the noctilux is more special and whilst I wouldn’t want it as my only 50, I really enjoy using it:

Hope this helps!

[didier]

On 12/9/2022 at 4:39 AM, jakontil said:

i end up collecting the 50's

I also end up getting a lot of 50s☺️

(7 M mount, lux SL, 3 LTM)

Well, I don’t consider myself a real collector, and I must say I don’t collect anything, but I like using different 50s depending on mood and situation !

didier 

[jakontil]

29 minutes ago, didier said:

I also end up getting a lot of 50s☺️

(7 M mount, lux SL, 3 LTM)

Well, I don’t consider myself a real collector, and I must say I don’t collect anything, but I like using different 50s depending on mood and situation !

didier 

exactly, i dont collect lenses too but i just love the results of each of different lenses related to the shooting scenario, hard to pick which is best but i know which is preferred

[leicaoptik]

Nice thread here.

Hi Mads, my answer is that last year, I  pulled the trigger on the Noctilux 50/1.2 remake.

Owning a Lux 50 pre asph. and later the 50 asph. also, I was looking for an even more „character lens“.

The Nocti has more of the drawing painting and blurring than the Lux pre asph. Like others write here, it is an instrument of art that needs a hand to draw with. The results are not always predictable, but one can have that special result no other lens can produce.
Go for it, you will not regret.

The 50Lux pre asph is not that special.

Shot wide open it has a nice unsharp gradient outside the center of the picture, softer than the asph. one. That is what we love in the look of the old lenses. The microcontrast is miles away from that of the asph., objects are not as sharp and the hole picture is soft compared to the asph. which has a harsh unsharp gradient, showing another bokeh.

The Nocti 1.2 combines two lens specialists in one lens: At apertures from 1.2-2.0 it has a drilling swirling unsharp gradient effect around a small sharp center spot with a kind of low micro contrast. The outer zones are unpredictable unsharp, as the resolution of saggital structures differ from the resolution of transversal structures. Light spots are pear-shaped. You can separate objects from the surroundings even in greater distances and produce studio-like effects in case that the background looks like arranged or painted.

The second lens you have is a razor sharp instrument if you use it at apertures smaller than 5.6

I cannot see a significant difference compared to my 50asph if I stop the Nocti down to aperture 8- there it has high micro contrast, never reachable with the 50 pre. asph. 

The near focus distance is 1m as the 50 pre asph. goes to 0.7m

Wishing you a nice decision…

Philip

 

 

 

 

 

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[Guest]

1 hour ago, leicaoptik said:

Nice thread here.

Hi Mads, my answer is that last year, I  pulled the trigger on the Noctilux 50/1.2 remake.

Owning a Lux 50 pre asph. and later the 50 asph. also, I was looking for an even more „character lens“.

The Nocti has more of the drawing painting and blurring than the Lux pre asph. Like others write here, it is an instrument of art that needs a hand to draw with. The results are not always predictable, but one can have that special result no other lens can produce.
Go for it, you will not regret.

The 50Lux pre asph is not that special.

Shot wide open it has a nice unsharp gradient outside the center of the picture, softer than the asph. one. That is what we love in the look of the old lenses. The microcontrast is miles away from that of the asph., objects are not as sharp and the hole picture is soft compared to the asph. which has a harsh unsharp gradient, showing another bokeh.

The Nocti 1.2 combines two lens specialists in one lens: At apertures from 1.2-2.0 it has a drilling swirling unsharp gradient effect around a small sharp center spot with a kind of low micro contrast. The outer zones are unpredictable unsharp, as the resolution of saggital structures differ from the resolution of transversal structures. Light spots are pear-shaped. You can separate objects from the surroundings even in greater distances and produce studio-like effects in case that the background looks like arranged or painted.

The second lens you have is a razor sharp instrument if you use it at apertures smaller than 5.6

I cannot see a significant difference compared to my 50asph if I stop the Nocti down to aperture 8- there it has high micro contrast, never reachable with the 50 pre. asph. 

The near focus distance is 1m as the 50 pre asph. goes to 0.7m

Wishing you a nice decision…

Philip

 

 

 

 

 

Thank you, Philip, for a very nice and detailed description. Great insight 🙏🏻