Help Me to Find My First M Lens

[Sammm]

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Hi All, 

I've always been thinking of getting a digital M Camera and maybe a few M lenses.  However, I haven't done that as I am not sure if I can handle the manual focusing aspect.  I currently have a SL2-S with all of the SL APO Summicron prime lenses, a TL2 with the 18mm  & 35mm TL lenses, and a Q2M.  

What M lens I should get to try out the M lens magic if I have a flexible budget?  I know this is not an investment but preferably a lens that can also hold its value really well.  I am thinking of trying the new M lens on the SL2-S first.  Thanks!

Sam

 

[rtai]

Of all the lenses you listed which one do you use most? I am sure there will be an equivalent in M mount.

[frame-it]

28 minutes ago, Sammm said:

What M lens I should get to try out the M lens magic if I have a flexible budget?  I know this is not an investment but preferably a lens that can also hold its value really well. 

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[Sammm]

1 hour ago, rtai said:

Of all the lenses you listed which one do you use most? I am sure there will be an equivalent in M mount.

Thanks rtai!  I see that you are from San Fran.  I was just there a few days ago.  What a beautiful city!  I use the SL50mm a lot.  I love that focal length.  

1 hour ago, frame-it said:

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Thanks frame-it!  I will keep that in mind.  It seems to fit all my criteria as you had highlighted.

[Jean-Michel]

Well, remember that too many cooks spoils the broth. If you want to try a M lens, any would do, probably try one of the focal length you use most. 

[Jeff S]

14 minutes ago, Sammm said:

Thanks frame-it!  I will keep that in mind.  It seems to fit all my criteria as you had highlighted.

And only $20-$30k these days for a minty copy.

Jeff

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vor 25 Minuten schrieb Sammm:

Thanks rtai!  I see that you are from San Fran.  I was just there a few days ago.  What a beautiful city!  I use the SL50mm a lot.  I love that focal length.  

Thanks frame-it!  I will keep that in mind.  It seems to fit all my criteria as you had highlighted.

Don't forget the guarding bodyguards who get in the way of crucial photographic moments with those over-excited lenses.
By the time you scare them away, the irretrievable motif has long been photographed with my old Canadian Summilux 35mm.😀

[lct]

45 minutes ago, Sammm said:

I use the SL50mm a lot.  I love that focal length. 

Then the M 50/2 apo is made for you.

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[rtai]

If you expect the same level of performance as your SL50 then I second Lct’s recommendation above. Else the current 50mm Summilux ASPH is the price/performance bargain in the M range. 

Edited August 26, 2022 by rtai
Autocorrect error

[Sammm]

Thank you all for your replies!  Very much appreciated!

I didn't know the one recommended by frame-it would cost $20-30K.  I thought it was this one: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/720355-USA/Leica_11663_35mm_f_1_4_Summilux_M_Aspherical.html?sts=hist-pi&pim=Y  I must be wrong then.  Can someone please tell me the differences?

lct's recommendation makes sense as I heard that's a very sharp lens.  However, would it just be like me using the SL 50mm APO Summicron in manual focus?

I am surprised nobody mentioned the 0.95 and 1.20 Noctilux's?

 

[grahamc]

51 minutes ago, Sammm said:

Thank you all for your replies!  Very much appreciated!

I didn't know the one recommended by frame-it would cost $20-30K.  I thought it was this one: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/720355-USA/Leica_11663_35mm_f_1_4_Summilux_M_Aspherical.html?sts=hist-pi&pim=Y  I must be wrong then.  Can someone please tell me the differences?

lct's recommendation makes sense as I heard that's a very sharp lens.  However, would it just be like me using the SL 50mm APO Summicron in manual focus?

I am surprised nobody mentioned the 0.95 and 1.20 Noctilux's?

 

This may be because they are heavy, and best utilised to show of their character at wide-open aperture.  This brings challenges in manual focussing as well as the fact that these lenses might not match the performance of other product lines when stoped down.  Therefore probably not something most would recommend for a first lens or all-rounder lens.   

My vote would be to zone in on the focal length you think you will use most based on your shooting preferences, and then research the various generations of summilux at that focus length.  You will be sure to find a lot of very helpful content on this forum about summilux generations or 'version x vers. version y' threads once you have narrowed down to your focal length.   

[Aryel]

27 minutes ago, grahamc said:

My vote would be to zone in on the focal length you think you will use most based on your shooting preferences, and then research the various generations of summilux at that focus length.  You will be sure to find a lot of very helpful content on this forum about summilux generations or 'version x vers. version y' threads once you have narrowed down to your focal length.   

I fully agree with this, I’d just also consider the summicron and others too. 

Edited August 27, 2022 by Aryel

[RexGig0]

4 hours ago, Sammm said:

lct's recommendation makes sense as I heard that's a very sharp lens.  However, would it just be like me using the SL 50mm APO Summicron in manual focus?

I am surprised nobody mentioned the 0.95 and 1.20 Noctilux's?

 

The 50mm APO M, recommended by lct, is considerably smaller than the 50mm APO SL, but you have realized a good point, in that each APO Summicron 50mm lens approaches optical perfection, in each respective mount. It was quite a feat of engineering, to fit so much optical correction, into the small amount of space, within the APO Summicron-M 50mm ASPH. 

Notably, however, measurable optical correction, and “magic,” mentioned in your first post, are NOT, necessarily the same thing. The artist’s eye perceives the magic, and, it may well be optical imperfection that is perceived as magical.

Personally, “my” 50mm M lens is the Summilux-M 50mm ASPH, due to the “magic” of its optical imperfection, at maximum aperture. Yes, optical imperfection. That distinctive character of the background blur is NOT caused by optical perfection. The APO Summicron-M 50mm ASPH is more perfect, in its optical correction, than the Summilux-M 50mm ASPH. It was images, captured with Summilux-M 50mm ASPH lenses, posted on-line, that lured me to add the Leica M system.

Personally, I like the visual signature of my Summilux-M 50mm ASPH, more than either Noctilux. Of course, the f/0.95 Noctilux can allow another whole stop of light to enter the camera, in low light situations, but, I would have to be willing to tolerate such imperfections as the characteristic field curvature, and the Noctilux’ less-pleasant background blur, as my eyes see it. I would, also, have to be willing to tote the added weight and bulk of the f/0.95 Noctilux. (Research “field curvature,” before buying a Noctilux f/0.95 lens.)

The 50mm Noctilux lenses each have their distinct imperfections. The APO Summicron-M 50mm ASPH is a more perfectly-corrected lens, than either 50mm Noctilux. In the Leica M system, the lens with the “fastest” aperture is not, necessarily, the best-corrected lens in that focal length.`

The Leica Noctilux-M that is most-superbly-corrected, optically, as of this date, is the 75mm. The 75mm Noctilux is better-corrected, optically, than the APO Summicron-M 75mm APO. Such optical perfection is not inexpensive to buy, nor light in weight, when being carried about. I am a retired public servant, so, my best-optically-corrected 75mm lens will, probably, remain my APO Summicron-M 75mm ASPH. Arguably, the 75mm Noctilux is so big, that it is more-suited to being used on SL cameras, with the adapter. Leica provides a tripod foot, in the package, with the 75mm Noctilux-M lens, because the lens is so heavy, one should not mount the tripod to the M camera body..

 

[IkarusJohn]

On 8/26/2022 at 11:43 AM, Sammm said:

Hi All, 

I've always been thinking of getting a digital M Camera and maybe a few M lenses.  However, I haven't done that as I am not sure if I can handle the manual focusing aspect.  I currently have a SL2-S with all of the SL APO Summicron prime lenses, a TL2 with the 18mm  & 35mm TL lenses, and a Q2M.  

What M lens I should get to try out the M lens magic if I have a flexible budget?  I know this is not an investment but preferably a lens that can also hold its value really well.  I am thinking of trying the new M lens on the SL2-S first.  Thanks!

Sam

 

Okay, so let’s see.  You have ALL the SL APO Summicron Primes, and you want to try an M lens …

Well, the designer of those SL APO’s is of the view that they are the best lenses of those focal lengths he’s ever designed.  And he’s very good at this.  Better that the same APO’s of the same focal lengths in M mount.  So, why would you buy them?

If you want to try at least one M lens on your SL2-S, then get something different from what you have.  There are many gems in M mount, without going silly with a 35 Summilux Aspherical (note, this was a hand ground double aspherical lens of which only 4,000 were made, the last in 1994 - hence the stratospheric price).

I also like 50’s.  I have a Summitar from 1948 (it has really wierd bokeh, but has its charms), the Summilux ASPH, the 0.95 Noctilux and the APO Summicron. Not sure which I’d sell, if I had to!  If I was buying just one, I’d probably buy the 50 Summilux ASPH - it’s reasonably priced, and is a lovely lens.  But, as you are going to use it (initially, at least) on your SL2-S, the Noctilux is a great choice.  You don’t have to use it at f/0.95 all the time, and stopped down it is as good as the Summilux ASPH (ref. Erwin Puts).

The nice thing about it is it balances really nicely on the SL (I have the SL(601) which is slightly bigger than your camera), and you get almost no purple fringeing.  Compared to your SL primes, it’s compact, though probably a bit heavier.  Best bit - it’s lovely to use and the images are fabulous.  Have a look at the Noctillux images thread.

You then need to try it on an M camera …

Other gems - the 28 Summilux and the 75 Summilux … 

[lct]

6 hours ago, Sammm said:

lct's recommendation makes sense as I heard that's a very sharp lens.  However, would it just be like me using the SL 50mm APO Summicron in manual focus?

Probably yes. If you want a sharp lens with more character you may wish to choose the current Summilux 50/1.4 asph instead, or a lens with a bit less acutance and more gentleness for portraits the current Summicron 50/2 v5.

[6bit]

Get a Voigtlander to be sure. CV 50/1.5 II

 

 

Edited August 27, 2022 by 6bit

[shirubadanieru]

If you have APOs and want something different definitely go with any pre-asph summicron or summilux. At first it will take you some time to get used to the imperfections, since SL lenses are 'perfect', but give it some time and you might end up selling most of your APO lenses in the end. 

My favorites are:

→ Summicron Rigid 50mm

→ Summicron Collapsible 50mm

→ Summicron 8 elements 35mm

→ Summilux pre-asph V2 35mm & 50mm

[Sammm]

Thank you all for the valuable input!  I've learned a lot from many of you.  I just bought my first M lens.  Anyone wants to know what I bought?

[IkarusJohn]

18 minutes ago, Sammm said:

Thank you all for the valuable input!  I've learned a lot from many of you.  I just bought my first M lens.  Anyone wants to know what I bought?

Go on.  Do tell.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Sammm]

ok.  I bought an used Noctilux 0.95.  However, I haven't got a chance to try it out as I don't have an M body and need an M to L adapter to try it on my SL2-S.  Wish me luck!