billh Posted September 15, 2007 Share #1 Posted September 15, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) The bottom half of this post, http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1021&thread=24836605 I can't tell if this is a camera that will take M lenses or not - but it is interesting, if true. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted September 15, 2007 Posted September 15, 2007 Hi billh, Take a look here Nikon rangefinder?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
marknorton Posted September 16, 2007 Share #2 Posted September 16, 2007 I think the guy's friend has been eating those weird tasting brownies again... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 16, 2007 Share #3 Posted September 16, 2007 And to think April first is more than half a year away.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecaton Posted September 16, 2007 Share #4 Posted September 16, 2007 And to think April first is more than half a year away.... April Fools Day sounds like a perfect timing for an alleged launch Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtZ Posted September 16, 2007 Share #5 Posted September 16, 2007 Ok, ok, I’ve eaten some of those weird tasting brownies cakes… Delicious! Miam, miam... Nikon (Mitsubishi) discovers digital rangefinders (Leica) become a fashion (and expensive) camera and Nikon realizes the Company is losing valuable clients because they prefer using those trendy digital rangefinders. Voigtlander and Zeiss (Cosina, an EPSON company) have nice lenses for rangefinders but Leica is making their life difficult with the 6-bit coding. "Damm it, there’s no other digital rangefinder on the market", they think. Have you noticed that Voigtlanler in the last few months have modified their lenses for the M8?... because at the same time, analog rangefinders have become obsolete and their clients are using now M8s! Nikon (Mitsubishi) and Cosina (EPSON) use Asahi glass (Asahi Glass Co., a Mitsubishi company) and Mitsubishi is a major investor for EPSON. Mitsubishi and EPSON have worked together in the past for many projects, especially in electronics. But they have also worked together for the R-D1s (Nikon electronics, Voigtlander body). A resurrection of a Nikon rangefinder (digital, please!) can only be positive for these two Japanese Giants. Well, maybe the post in DPreview is just intox… but I would think twice before saying it’s “April fools’ day” or “space cookies” vision. A Nikon (or Canon) digital rangefinder would be very positive… I’m sure Leica would be more attentive to our requests. In fact, right now, if we want to shoot with a digital rangefinder… we have no choice other than Leica. Please, Nikon, just do it! (Oops, that’s Nike!) . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtZ Posted September 16, 2007 Share #6 Posted September 16, 2007 Hiya! It's probably because of those weird tasting brownies cakes… but have you realized our M8s have very little value on the second hand market? Who will buy a second hand M8 with all the technical problems of this camera had? Well, not me! I wouldn't take that risk... <grin> . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted September 16, 2007 Share #7 Posted September 16, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) ArtZ, have you ever heard of the value of a used digital camera ? I do not worry at all on how much my M8 depreciates on the user market, albeit until I continue to USE and ENJOY it... even if you want speak about its value... let's talk seriously... is there a used M8 market ? Still too a new camera, nothing similar to be on the market in the seeable future (let us see waht will come frome this strange Nikon news...) ... if M8 shall become a camera with no future... surely its price, in the years, will go down at rocket speed; if it shall have success, shall have "sons" around the same basic concept, shall have competitors on the same field (RF, compact, etc....) its price on the user market can maybe remain in a decent range, even if I think the value shall anyway not be in the range of the classic mech Leicas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisC Posted September 16, 2007 Share #8 Posted September 16, 2007 ......A Nikon (or Canon) digital rangefinder would be very positive… I’m sure Leica would be more attentive to our requests.......... Manuel - I have felt for a long time, since well before the announcement of the M8, that the digital age was a gift for rangefinder development. If Nikon were to produce a digital rangefinder, I'm sure it would be free of some of the 'legacy' features that I dislike on my M8; I would expect a digital Nikon rangefinder to be an exemplary modern camera. This is speculation and guesswork however as I have no trust in the post on DP Review even though it has titbits of plausibility for us to carry on gossip here. But regardless of that particular post, a modern Nikon digital rangefinder seems a pretty good idea for a wide range of photographers, but I can see it being a good stimulus for Leica's modernisation too. ......... Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Photoskeptic Posted September 16, 2007 Share #9 Posted September 16, 2007 I can't see Nikon making a digital rangefinder due to the small market and specific lenses it would take. OTOH, a body with interchangeable backs certainly sounds plausible and even desirable and would be a huge step ahead for Nikon in the digital wars with Canon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtZ Posted September 16, 2007 Share #10 Posted September 16, 2007 ArtZ, have you ever heard of the value of a used digital camera ? I do not worry at all on how much my M8 depreciates on the user market, albeit until I continue to USE and ENJOY it... even if you want speak about its value... let's talk seriously... is there a used M8 market ? Still too a new camera, nothing similar to be on the market in the seeable future (let us see waht will come frome this strange Nikon news...) ... if M8 shall become a camera with no future... surely its price, in the years, will go down at rocket speed; if it shall have success, shall have "sons" around the same basic concept, shall have competitors on the same field (RF, compact, etc....) its price on the user market can maybe remain in a decent range, even if I think the value shall anyway not be in the range of the classic mech Leicas. Luigi, I have spent more than 25K € in Leica equipment since June. True, it's a digital camera but it's the only digital rangefinder which can use the lenses I bought (R-D1 is dead). I think it's normal (considering the prices) to consider the investment. Cars it's an example that everybody understands. Cars are very similar to digital cameras: they depreciate very quickly. You can buy a very cheap car (Korean, for instance) but you know than in a few years you will need to buy a new one. Well, I prefer to buy a more expensive model (German, for instance -never ever buy a French car!) because it will be nicer to drive, more confortable and when I want to sell it, I will get a better price. The problem with the M8 is that if for any reason you get an M8 and after two months use you make up your mind, you cannot sell it because nobody will buy a second hand M8. If I buy a Porsche and, two months later, I decide I want to sell it, I will get most of the money back. (Hey! I'm not selling my M8, I'm very happy with it.) When you take a look on eBay (and even here at the Buy & Sell Section) there're quite a lot of M8 on sale... It's extrange for a completely new camera, isn't it? Manuel - I have felt for a long time, since well before the announcement of the M8, that the digital age was a gift for rangefinder development. If Nikon were to produce a digital rangefinder, I'm sure it would be free of some of the 'legacy' features that I dislike on my M8; I would expect a digital Nikon rangefinder to be an exemplary modern camera. This is speculation and guesswork however as I have no trust in the post on DP Review even though it has titbits of plausibility for us to carry on gossip here. But regardless of that particular post, a modern Nikon digital rangefinder seems a pretty good idea for a wide range of photographers, but I can see it being a good stimulus for Leica's modernisation too. ......... Chris Chris, I don't trust either DP Review. With my post I tried to understand the rangefinder market and if, hypothecally, there's a place for another rangefinder than Leica. IMHO, I would say: YES. I think Nikon is the only company who can do that but in close cooperation with Cosina. I believe (always speculation) if Nikon will produce a rangefinder will be very similar to the M8 for backward compatibility reasons. If Nikon launches a rangefinder which works only with new lenses, it won't work. People using rangefinders now they will not buy new lenses for a new camera, a new standard. Though, they may propose a new lense line with "Auto focus", "Auto aperture", etc, etc, but the camera has to be compatible with older lenses. I think camera manufacturers have understood rangefinders users want simple cameras, not computers. If Nikon launches a new rangefinder will be in this way; otherwise the camera will be just a new P&S. . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artichoke Posted September 16, 2007 Share #11 Posted September 16, 2007 snip When you take a look on eBay (and even here at the Buy & Sell Section) there're quite a lot of M8 on sale... It's extrange for a completely new camera, isn't it? snip . not at least today there are two M8 offerings up on Ebay and one is for new ones from a dealer there are two M8 offerings also on Buy & Sell here that does not seem like "quite a lot" to me Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted September 16, 2007 Share #12 Posted September 16, 2007 If I buy a Porsche and, two months later, I decide I want to sell it, I will get most of the money back. Hey! Tell me how to do that. The moment you drive a new car out of the showroom the first mile will cost you 10 to 15 % of its value -any car. (except perhaps a Morgan - but then they have a two year waiting list) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sean_reid Posted September 17, 2007 Share #13 Posted September 17, 2007 (Cosina, an EPSON company) . Huh? Cheers, Sean Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dfarkas Posted September 17, 2007 Share #14 Posted September 17, 2007 I don't see Nikon getting into the digital rangefinder market. Reading the DPReview post, I'm a bit skeptical...about all of it. Modular F-series D camera for $10k, rangefinder that takes F-mount and M lenses. Just sounds fishy. In addition to being a Leica dealer, we are also Nikon Pro dealers. This is just not consistent with Nikon's brand strategy. If you want a digital rangefinder, I've heard that Leica makes one called the M8. It's supposed to be pretty good. The lenses aren't half bad either. DPR fourms are always good for the occasional chuckle. For good info, I'll stick to the LUF. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roberth Posted September 17, 2007 Share #15 Posted September 17, 2007 I'm not defending the post but why not F mount lenses on an M mount when I can put R mount lenses on my M with an adaptor. An electronic adaptor with AF contacts and live preview mode is a possiblity isn't it? The D3 does live preview doesn't it? with AF via some phase method? why not an M mount camera as well. Take away the shutter mech and you have space for an IR filter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riley Posted September 17, 2007 Share #16 Posted September 17, 2007 the Nikon SP was recreated in 2005 it was sold Japan only for around US$5k a copy you see them on ebay on occasion Nikon Rangefinder SP Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted September 17, 2007 Share #17 Posted September 17, 2007 There is one in the window at Wuestefeld Berlin, Grollmanstr. It looks like a messy M. If a film SP is €5000, how could a digital SP compete with the M8? It will be interesting to see, but I guess that it won't happen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdai Posted September 17, 2007 Share #18 Posted September 17, 2007 The original post on dpreview is completely rubbish. Renesas is a joint venture company between Hitachi and Mitsubishi and only has their R/D in Japan with manufacturing facilities spreading across China, Korea and Singapore. Their UK office is only a European sales branch ... if Nikon needs some help, this guy probably won't come from UK. It's just some shameless Nikon sales reps spreading rumors on dpreview trying to pull the legs of folks buying their competitors' products. Folks from Sony don't know they can build a 24MP chip yet so how can Nikon stuff one into their camera? LOL ... with that 6MP sensor claiming to have a base ISO of 51200, you can declare the perishment of the flash gun industry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpattinson Posted September 17, 2007 Share #19 Posted September 17, 2007 Hiya! It's probably because of those weird tasting brownies cakes… but have you realized our M8s have very little value on the second hand market? Who will buy a second hand M8 with all the technical problems of this camera had? Well, not me! I wouldn't take that risk... <grin> . I think you're wrong there ArtZ - Aperture in London have sold several secondhand M8's. They go for around £2400, which is just a little under the UK tax-ex price. Pretty much exactly the same pricepoint as near-mint secondhand M7's sold at when they initially came out (ie - just under the tax-ex price) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olsen Posted September 17, 2007 Share #20 Posted September 17, 2007 to my knowledge Mitsubishi Heavy Industries owns only own about 12% summing up direct and indirect investments in Nikon. Mitsubishi owns 46% of Nikon's largest shareholder The Master Trust Bank of Japan, Ltd. And so on. At best, Mitsubishi's stake in Seiko Epson Corporation is similar, I would guess. Because this is a typical japanese shareholder structure. - Just to prevent that some american greenmailer financed with junk bonds shall buy out strategic japanese industries. That these inter-ownerships functions a lines of product development is uncertain. Further; that Epson has any stakes in Cosina is beond me. If Nikon were to make a digital rangefinder camera,- I would doubt they would dare, they would face the same problems as Leica - and Cosina regarding techical/economical 'natural laws'. Like sensor size. Full frame? Forget it! Cheaper? Forget that too. This is stuff for day dreamers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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