I’ve now had 3 x sl2 bodies fail.

[Ken Abrahams]

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This is frightening - My SL2 purchased earlier this year is going okay. From time to time the M adapter L seems to disconnect from lens/cametra and the screen goes black. I jiggle with adapter or clean connectors and it's okay again. Lens detected and eve operational. I purchased two adapters earlier this year when I got the SL2 and SL2S, one adapter seems a little stiff.

I hope we dont see more failed cameras being reported here. I really feel for those having to send their units back to Leica.   

[chris_tribble]

Ken - maybe don't worry too much.  There are very few faults logged in the Poll I put up.

😉

[VespertineD2K]

It’s very concerning indeed, two bodies failed within the space of a week, with a 12 week repair turn around at Leica - doesn’t exactly fill me with confidence in the system going forward. 

[robb]

Knock on wood, but 2 sl2 and 2 sl2-s going strong last 2 years.  Over 100k exposures total.  Using both shutter modes.  Only once had to pop a battery.  

3 bought new, 1 used from Leica Miami.  

That would be great if Leica could lower service time though so more pros could count on these as workhorses… 

I am a happy user of the camera system.

Robb

[thatkatmat]

I too have been shooting this system for a few years (4, I think) and have never had an issue with an SL, SL2 or SL2-S. Sorry for those who have. 

[chris_tribble]

It’s getting things into perspective that’s so often the issue.  I know from decades of evaluation experience that the unhappy respondents are the loudest, and that they tend to be listened to most. In this case the personal experience of disappointed users is real and concerning (I know after seeing “System failure” on the rear screen!), but it also seems to have been amplified so that many are looking at their rock solidly reliable SL systems and are worrying: “will it be me next?”

I’d like to get some kind of account from Leica for why this has happened - but it’s possible they don’t know! A fault in a small batch of shutter mechanisms? An exceptional combination of settings and conditions? Who knows. For now, I’m glad I’ve got an S1r backup, and that my second SL2 is still behaving impeccably. 

Lesson? As in all situations where you depend on kit for your living or reputation, have back up!  What can go wrong, will go wrong…

Edited November 1, 2023 by chris_tribble

[VespertineD2K]

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26 minutes ago, chris_tribble said:

It’s getting things into perspective that’s so often the issue.  I know from decades of evaluation experience that the unhappy respondents are the loudest, and that they tend to be listened to most. In this case the personal experience of disappointed users is real and concerning (I know after seeing “System failure” on the rear screen!), but it also seems to have been amplified so that many are looking at their rock solidly reliable SL systems and are worrying: “will it be me next?”

I’d like to get some kind of account from Leica for why this has happened - but it’s possible they don’t know! A fault in a small batch of shutter mechanisms? An exceptional combination of settings and conditions? Who knows. For now, I’m glad I’ve got an S1r backup, and that my second SL2 is still behaving impeccably. 

Lesson? As in all situations where you depend on kit for your living or reputation, have back up!  What can go wrong, will go wrong…

That’s certainly all true, but in ten years of shooting Canon - I had one issue with shutter failure, and Canon’s CPS repair program had the body repaired and back in service within 48hrs. Two failures in a week, with such an astonishingly long repair time simply isn’t up to a professional standard, and as such in my case can’t really be considered a professional tool moving forward, which is unfortunate to say the least. It’s all good and well having a backup, but if one of your cameras goes, you’re back to being in a precarious situation, with an extremely long wait time to be back in possession of a spare body. I’m aware that the technicians in London are being trained on the SL system, but who knows when that will come to fruition in terms of in house repairs. 

With regards to speaking to Leica - I have the gut feeling this ‘could’ somehow be related to SD cards, particularly Lexar 64gb SD cards, where I’ve read similar reports of this happening, and was true also in my case. It seems absurd to think a memory card could cause an apparent hardware system failure, but when it happened to me - constantly changing memory cards to different brands, was the only thing that removed the ‘system error’ message, and would allow me to access the menu (I tried updating firmware to no avail, incase the internal software had somehow corrupted). 
The only other common denominator was the lens used, which I also replaced and have since had no issues using the SL type 106 model. 

It would be great to receive feedback from Leica as to what could be causing this problem, other than generic ‘Shutter Failure’ - which doesn’t really offer much guidance. 

Edited November 1, 2023 by VespertineD2K

[robb]

I feel like the SL has reached the workhorse category in most respects, and even bested canon and Nikon in some others.  

Why so many pros rely on canon and Nikon besides the fast continuous autofocus speed… is the canon professional services and Nikon professional services programs with very fast turn arounds and loaners if things need a longer time to source parts.

These programs used to be free.  Now I pay a couple hundred bucks a year for each but well worth the service (when needed.). It’s funny but I’ve only used it a handful of times in 35 years.  But when you need it, you need it.  Even phase one gets this and has a form of this with their dealers.

I know Leica has other irons in the fire and has their own Q/C demons with finding good workers, strap lugs falling out, etc.  but if Leica charged working pros $500 or so a year for a week’s turnaround on a repair with occasional loaner time, it would up their reputation more than the M11-p content authentication and bring in more pros who A. Don’t want to own 4 bodies, and B. Have to wait 3-4 months for a fix.  

Don’t get me wrong, I welcome the content authentication.  Too bad it has not been announced as available as a firmware add on to previous models.

I’m not sure Leica needs (or wants) to compete head to head with canon or Nikon but add back in a professional services program but happy to suggest the benefits to the company and users.

Robb

[Gavin Cato]

5 hours ago, VespertineD2K said:

t would be great to receive feedback from Leica as to what could be causing this problem, other than generic ‘Shutter Failure’ - which doesn’t really offer much guidance. 

I asked, so many times I lost count. They very - VERY - deliberately avoided answering the question. It was absolutely infuriating.

I have no doubt at all they know exactly what deep rooted issue there is. I just can't believe that I could have 3 out of 4 bodies fail (and i sold the 4th before it did!), which were bought at different times, i.e. not from the same batch at the factory - 2 x SL2 and 2 x SL2-S.

The other reason I was annoyed is I wasn't exactly a small purchaser of the gear. I bought 4 bodies, a 35/2, 50/1.4, 75/2, 90/2, 90-280, a Q2 and I've probably forgotten other bits. 

To spend that much on the gear and receive such shocking support, to be told it's likely you misusing the gear, to avoid answering what the problem is, to have 4 month turnaround on repairs. Honestly just insane. I bought a Q3 recently and after writing that rant I'm surprised I gave the company another cent now.

Anyway I'm done here   

[VespertineD2K]

1 hour ago, Gavin Cato said:

I have no doubt at all they know exactly what deep rooted issue there is. I just can't believe that I could have 3 out of 4 bodies fail (and i sold the 4th before it did!), which were bought at different times, i.e. not from the same batch at the factory - 2 x SL2 and 2 x SL2-S.

Really sorry to hear Gavin, must have been a nightmare for you switching systems. Do you recall any common factor in your situation? I assume not lenses, since it sounds like you mainly shoot primes - SD card brand maybe?

 

[robb]

Well if there is a problem with cards, Leica could just say, we see no problems with xxxxxxx brand / model / etc.

most Leica users would just buy the Leica recommended cards and avoid the others and any trouble.

Robb

[Jeff S]

12 hours ago, robb said:

Don’t get me wrong, I welcome the content authentication.  Too bad it has not been announced as available as a firmware add on to previous models.

 

It requires hardware….

From the press release… “It includes a special chipset for storing digital certificates of the German Federal Printing Office. The state-of-the-art integration guarantees complete verifiability of a picture’s origin.”

Jeff

[Bruno F.]

I recently switch to Leica and got the SL (Typ 601). I didn't use much since I got it, but I liked the body and design so much that I was planning on upgrading to the SL2. After reading about this issue, I'm afraid I can't rely on it professionally. I'm still thinking if I keep the Leica system or if I go back to Sony again.

Edited January 5, 2024 by Bruno F.

[LeicaR10]

Bruno F.,  I have used the SL 601 and SL2 and SL2-S for many professional venues with no issues with the camera or shutter since 2015.  In fact, for me, its the most reliable camera system other than the S camera that I have ever owned or used to include Canon and Nikon.  What causes the issue mentioned previously, who knows.  It could be a range of things that cause the problem.  Yes, Leica knows clearly they have a repair turnaround time problem and working to fix that based on my emails with senior management.  I can only write, my best cameras are the SL system.  For the M system, its the M10s vs M11s.  My choice and preference.  Personally, I don't think you will have an issue with the SL system, but I could be proven wrong.  Last, the SL 601 color and rendering is IMO, superb.  r/ Mark

[hansvons]

7 hours ago, Bruno F. said:

I'm still thinking if I keep the Leica system or if I go back to Sony again.

Go back to Sony. I mean it sincerely, especially if you shoot professionally. That's not because Leica cameras are more unreliable than Sony cameras but because you trust Sony more, which gives you peace of mind. Otherwise, you hadn't asked. 

That said, I have used the SL2-S since it came out on assignments along with my film Ms. It never let me down. Its colours are the best I've ever seen on digital, plus it takes my M lenses without too much vignetting and corner-smearing. But this is a niche use case. If I were a pro shooting daily for clients, e.g. news or weddings, you name it, I would get a pair of Sonys, Canons, or Nikons—better AF, less weight, less costly, and highly reliable.

 

[Stuart Richardson]

I am with Mark...if they were failing at such a disastrous rate, it would be more than just a handful of people posting these threads. This is not to say that the issues that Gavin experienced are not real, only that they seem to be anomalous in comparison to most other users. I am also a professional and have been using the SL2 as my main camera since I bought it used from a friend in 2019 or early 2020. It has been the most reliable Leica I have ever used. I am not using high speed continuous shooting, so I will say that caveat, but I have tens of thousands of frames on it so far and it has never been back to Leica and has had hardly a pixel out of place. It has never locked up for me either, which I cannot say about the M10, M9 or S006, even though those cameras were also overall reliable for me. Again, perhaps that is just my good luck vs Gavin's bad luck, but I do believe there was a poll where it showed that very few people on the forum had had any problems.

Edited January 5, 2024 by Stuart Richardson

[Geoff C. Bassett]

Personally never had an issue with the SL2 or SL2-s since I've owned them for about 3 years.  Every other system I have, Nikon, Sony, Panasonic, have all locked up or required a battery pull at some point. Never Leica for me. 

Edited January 5, 2024 by Geoff C. Bassett

[Bruno F.]

8 hours ago, LeicaR10 said:

Bruno F.,  I have used the SL 601 and SL2 and SL2-S for many professional venues with no issues with the camera or shutter since 2015.  In fact, for me, its the most reliable camera system other than the S camera that I have ever owned or used to include Canon and Nikon.  What causes the issue mentioned previously, who knows.  It could be a range of things that cause the problem.  Yes, Leica knows clearly they have a repair turnaround time problem and working to fix that based on my emails with senior management.  I can only write, my best cameras are the SL system.  For the M system, its the M10s vs M11s.  My choice and preference.  Personally, I don't think you will have an issue with the SL system, but I could be proven wrong.  Last, the SL 601 color and rendering is IMO, superb.  r/ Mark

Yes, they seem pretty reliable. I read the whole thread and some things didn't feel right to me. I'm from Brazil, so support is not even a question for me — it's a risk since the service here will take some time regardless the brand (not ideal, I wish hey had quicker turnaround for professionals). But the fact Leica wasn't clear about what was causing the problem is kind of strange. We could rule out some serial number range or stick to recommended SD cards. People have pointed out being careless with the camera, but the SL is marketed as a weather sealed professional camera. I do care for my cameras, but my understanding is that they are tools after all, and should be reliable in extreme conditions and handling. Although I didn't used much the SL 601, I had to take off the batteries for a couple of times when shooting a personal work when shooting in continuous medium with a high speed Lexar SD — quite strange since the same card didn't have any problems in the same scenario with my A7R IV. In the end, all I can say for now is that I'm more comfortable shooting my commercial work with Sony than Leica (I'm not even addressing AF issues and things like that, which I can manage to work with). Still didn't decide what I will do. Maybe I'll give Leica a try and keep the SL 601 as a backup and get an SL2 as my main camera. Thanks for your reply anyway.

[Bruno F.]

1 hour ago, hansvons said:

Go back to Sony. I mean it sincerely, especially if you shoot professionally. That's not because Leica cameras are more unreliable than Sony cameras but because you trust Sony more, which gives you peace of mind. Otherwise, you hadn't asked. 

Yeah, you got a point. If I decide to try the SL2, I'll keep my Sony as a backup for a while. Kind of a pain, because I would like to keep one system for practicality but can't afford Leica failling on a commercial assignment. That's really upsetting because I'm not loyal to any brand, but the SL OS system and design are on another level, I really wish I could work with them with peace of mind Sony gives me (Nikon before that).

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[Bruno F.]

1 hour ago, Stuart Richardson said:

I am with Mark...if they were failing at such a disastrous rate, it would be more than just a handful of people posting these threads. This is not to say that the issues that Gavin experienced are not real, only that they seem to be anomalous in comparison to most other users. I am also a professional and have been using the SL2 as my main camera since I bought it used from a friend in 2019 or early 2020. It has been the most reliable Leica I have ever used. I am not using high speed continuous shooting, so I will say that caveat, but I have tens of thousands of frames on it so far and it has never been back to Leica and has had hardly a pixel out of place. It has never locked up for me either, which I cannot say about the M10, M9 or S006, even though those cameras were also overall reliable for me. Again, perhaps that is just my good luck vs Gavin's bad luck, but I do believe there was a poll where it showed that very few people on the forum had had any problems.

I understand your point, but the truth is that we don't know the rate this is happening. Not much people are using the system, and fewer are active online in forums and such, maybe it have happened more that we are aware of and people have resolved the issue with Leica directly or the seller they did buy from. The fact is we don't know, that's my point. One thing I can say: the Gavin experience may be bad lucky, but it is a headache and terrifying for someone who is working professionally. 3 of 4 bodies failling, come on… 😕