Coding/lens detection/IR questions

[GarethC]

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Just need a quick education. As I understand it, coding a lens eliminates the need to correct for vignetting and cyan drift but is most effective for lenses wider than 35mm. Here's my top 10 questions.

 

1. Presumably, vignetting is not an issue for the longer lenses at all, but is cyan drift?

 

2. If I have wider lenses coded and longer lenses uncoded does that mean that I always have to remember to go to the menu to reset lens detection? I have trouble enough remembering my name.

 

3. If the above is correct, would you recommend encoding all lenses, ie have you?

 

4. I have an older 50/2 and VC 15 and 75 that are uncoded, thoughts on coding these? The VC 15 seems to bea no brainer.

 

5. Where does the IR cut filter fit into all this? What if the lens is coded but there is no filter on it? Does that mean that you still get the cyan drift.

 

6. Can somebody point me to the sizes of filters for the lenses noted above.

 

7. I bought my M8 back in May but have not registered it with Leica yet. Am I still eligible for my free filters and as an aside can I still validate the warranty?

 

8. Is there life on Mars?

 

9. What are my hopes of getting those filters before the beginning of October?

 

10. Is there likely to be a firmware update addressing the colour shift making those filters redundant? If so, then surely Leica are on the hook for alot of now unused IR cut filters.

 

Many thanks. I have a feeling that this will raise another 10 questions but hopefully not.

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[Guest guy_mancuso]

Just need a quick education. As I understand it, coding a lens eliminates the need to correct for vignetting and cyan drift but is most effective for lenses wider than 35mm. Here's my top 10 questions.

 

1. Presumably, vignetting is not an issue for the longer lenses at all, but is cyan drift?

 

No from 50mm up there is no cyan drift or vignetting really. 35mm there is s very slight amount but you have to look for it ,I would code everything from 35mm down to the widest lens, have all lenses filterd with IR cuts and just leave ON/IR on in the menu. This is how I work

 

 

2. If I have wider lenses coded and longer lenses uncoded does that mean that I always have to remember to go to the menu to reset lens detection? I have trouble enough remembering my name.

 

No not at all if you have IR cut filters on everything than just leave the IR/ON in themenu option , this way it is tuning the firmware with filters on, coding the long glass 50mm and above is not needed except for EXIF data if you want it

 

3. If the above is correct, would you recommend encoding all lenses, ie have you?

 

Not really and 50mm and above won't make a performance difference. Although I like coded becuase of the EXIF data , I like to know what i shot later on sometimes

 

4. I have an older 50/2 and VC 15 and 75 that are uncoded, thoughts on coding these? The VC 15 seems to bea no brainer.

 

Just code the 15mm for the WATE

 

5. Where does the IR cut filter fit into all this? What if the lens is coded but there is no filter on it? Does that mean that you still get the cyan drift.

 

No you won't get a cyan drift which actually comes from the filter itself on the wides the firmware with the code corrects it. Your using the IR filter to begin with to correct for the sensors lack of the proper amount of IR blocking. here is the issue the M8 was designed with less IR protection than other DSLR camera out there (design issue) so what the filter does is get the IR protection up to the same level as other digital camera's , look at the filter as making the camera normal with regards to IR protection. Now what happens with 35mm and wider is there is a oblique angle that creates the cyan drift as you get wider in lenses . The firmware and code from 35mm and wider are tuned to cut that out given the coding

 

6. Can somebody point me to the sizes of filters for the lenses noted above.

 

From memory 15CV lens folks are using a 39mm

Leica glass

21,24,90 apo use a 55mm

28 cron, 35 lux, 50 lux, 90 elmarit use 46mm amy have missed one here

35 cron, 90 macro use a 39mm

75cron, WATE with adapter 49mm

75 lux and 50 Nocti use a 60mm

 

7. I bought my M8 back in May but have not registered it with Leica yet. Am I still eligible for my free filters and as an aside can I still validate the warranty?

 

I believe you are, you should register

 

8. Is there life on Mars?

 

Absolutely, they just wear visors all the time , little hot there

 

9. What are my hopes of getting those filters before the beginning of October?

 

No chance in hell. LOL Than again they have caught up pretty much. You may have to make a last minute purchase , tough call

 

10. Is there likely to be a firmware update addressing the colour shift making those filters redundant? If so, then surely Leica are on the hook for alot of now unused IR cut filters.

 

 

Never will happen, firmware cannot correct for IR contamination . It's theinvisible light of the spectrum unless you put a very large umbrella over earth to block it than this is the way it is and always will be

 

Many thanks. I have a feeling that this will raise another 10 questions but hopefully not.

 

Bottom line make your life easy buy the IR filters put them on every lens , turn the IR /On in the menu and completely forget about all of this and go out and shoot and don't think of it again. My rule of thumb and exactly what i have done. One extra word use Leica filters on at least 24mm and wider the firmware is tuned to the Leica filters remember that and the cyan drift will be less present with the Leica filters on the very wide end. i put Leica filters on every lens but you don't have too

[artur5]

There are here far more experienced users than I, but as far as I can say :

 

1- No cyan issue with 50mm. and longer lenses

2- Let the coded+IR on the menu, It won't make any difference if the lens isn't coded and longer than 50mm.

3- I don't see the need to code 50mm. and above, but others may differ

4- Yes coding the CV 15/4.5 seems mandatory ( best thing is get a John Milich M-LTM adapter with the 6 pits milled and code the lens as the Leica WATE 16mm focal )

5- No IR filter= No cyan drift. ( select lens coded without filter on the menu)

6- CV/15 has no filter tread. Needs a DIY solution or an adapter. the 50/2 (Summicron, I suposse) comes in several versions and filters sizes.

I think the CV 75 has a 43mm filter tread ( beware with Leica IR filters of this size, they seem to be a different pitch and maybe won't fit on a non-Leica lens). .

7- I don't think you should have any problem registering now.

8- You've got me..

9- You mean the free Leica filters.. 4 weeks is a fair possibility. It depends upon the filter sizes you need and if they have in stock

10- NO

[lars_bergquist]

I do generally second all that Guy has said, thank you. There are two points however:

 

First, from necessity I had to use a B+W 486 filter on my pre-asph. 21mm Elmarit, and I could not detect any bad effect from not using a Leica-branded filter, even though these are supposed to be the filters that the firmware is calibrated for. This makes me suspect that the only wide-angle lenses that really do benefit from a Leica filter (in contradistinction to B+W) may be the Cosina/Voigtländer 15 and 12mm numbers! I have a Leica 39mm on order and will investigate.

 

Second, when working in black and white, it can be advantageous to work with common UV filters or without filtering. You will get more detail in dark green foliage, and also better sky/cloud contrast, in short, the extended red and IR sensitivity will give you the equivalent of a medium yellow (Y) filter – at no cost.

 

The old man from the Age of the Yellow Filter

[jlm]

FYI:

 

Ii have found that the 49mm Heliopan UV/IR glass is slightly larger than the glass from the B+W and Leica UV/IR filters and thus will not fit into my WATE adapter.

[Guest guy_mancuso]

Thanks lars yes different effects for B&W can be had with and without the IR filter on. I need to experiment with that myself.

 

 

On the subject of Leica versus B+W filters on the wide side i have not completely tested the difference on some lenses . Folks are getting good results on the CV 15mm with either filter. I know the WATE works the best with leica filter and cleans up better than the B+W so i do highly recommend it there. i think down in this range experiment a little to see what works best for certain lenses. I chose to go all Leica filters because than all my files from different lenses had the same color and the B+W i noticed on the WATE at least went a touch green because it is a stronger IR filter a very easy fix for Raw shooters but Leica has tuned the firmware to there filters so that is something to just keep in mind but the B+W filters work and work very well.

[Cindy Flood]

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My older version Leica 50/2 takes the same 39mm filter as the CV15 (but I would measure the front of yours before you buy). Buy two filters and leave them on the lenses. Also, I highly recommend John Milich's hood/adapter for the CV15 (otherwise you have to affix the filter to the lens with an o-ring or tape.)

[jaapv]

Thanks lars yes different effects for B&W can be had with and without the IR filter on. I need to experiment with that myself.

 

 

On the subject of Leica versus B+W filters on the wide side i have not completely tested the difference on some lenses . Folks are getting good results on the CV 15mm with either filter. I know the WATE works the best with leica filter and cleans up better than the B+W so i do highly recommend it there. i think down in this range experiment a little to see what works best for certain lenses. I chose to go all Leica filters because than all my files from different lenses had the same color and the B+W i noticed on the WATE at least went a touch green because it is a stronger IR filter a very easy fix for Raw shooters but Leica has tuned the firmware to there filters so that is something to just keep in mind but the B+W filters work and work very well.

 

B&W has some cyan shift on the CV 15, Leica seems to be cleaner.

[lars_bergquist]

B&W has some cyan shift on the CV 15, Leica seems to be cleaner.

 

My experience too with B+W.

 

There has been some soul searching about filter threads. The correct pitch is indeed all-important. The correct full description of the 39mm Leica lens threads is M39x0.5, meaning Metric 39mm by .5mm pitch. This is also what B+W deliver (and my their mounting rings are luscious!) With a B+W filter the C/V 75mm wants the one marked '43ES' on the inside of the mount ring. Be careful as B+W has 486 filters with both .5 and .75mm pitch on their books.

 

The old man from the Age of A36 Filters

[ArtZ]

For "Home Coding" a friend of mine has used adesive black letters you buy at the shops (and you transfer with a pen writing on the plastic cover) to code some old lenses with great success. He says once you have transfer the "dashes" to the lens, they remain there. It says it more solid than the "Sharpie-code"

 

Cheers!

.

[artur5]

My experience too with B+W.

 

There has been some soul searching about filter threads. The correct pitch is indeed all-important. The correct full description of the 39mm Leica lens threads is M39x0.5, meaning Metric 39mm by .5mm pitch. This is also what B+W deliver (and my their mounting rings are luscious!) With a B+W filter the C/V 75mm wants the one marked '43ES' on the inside of the mount ring. Be careful as B+W has 486 filters with both .5 and .75mm pitch on their books.

 

The old man from the Age of A36 Filters

 

I ordered a 43mm B+W 486 filter ( for my ZM 35/2) from Foto Huppert.

No problem mounting on the Zeiss. It's the 0.75mm. pitch version.

The inside of the mount ring says "B+W 43 486 UV IR CUT" and on the box "43 486 14685 UV-IR-CUT"

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the C/V 75 has also a 0.75mm. pitch

Foto Huppert on their web offers only one model of 43mm. filter ( black or silver). No details about pitch size.

[GarethC]

As an added thought, subsequent ot some more reading, can I code without milling the lens mount? I realize that this is probably only a temporary solution as it's more likely to wear faster but could it be a stop gap measure?

[GarethC]

I also forgot to ask, do all Summicron 50/2's have the same filter size or did they change with some versions?

[usefeet]

I keep on reading the word 'WATE'. What does this stand for? Thanks.

[GarethC]

wide angle tri elmar

[doubice]

I also forgot to ask, do all Summicron 50/2's have the same filter size or did they change with some versions?

 

All version are E-39 (39mm).

 

Best,

 

Jan

[Fotomiguel]

Somebody knows where there is the Leica IR E-49mm in stock?

Cheers!

[rafael_macia]

What a wonderful learning tool the forum is!

 

Rafael

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[stunsworth]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the C/V 75 has also a 0.75mm. pitch

 

I'm sure it has the same as the Leica. All of the filters I've bought could be used on either - eg 39mm on Leica and CV 21/25/90.

[sean_reid]

Bottom line make your life easy buy the IR filters put them on every lens , turn the IR /On in the menu and completely forget about all of this and go out and shoot and don't think of it again. My rule of thumb and exactly what i have done. One extra word use Leica filters on at least 24mm and wider the firmware is tuned to the Leica filters remember that and the cyan drift will be less present with the Leica filters on the very wide end. i put Leica filters on every lens but you don't have too

 

Excellent advice from Guy throughout his response. My only additions would be:

 

1) There may times when light source in the subject cause filter reflections, etc. In that case, pull the filter and use Jaime's profiles (search forum for that thread).

 

2) Some people prefer no filter for BW work. There are pros and cons to that approach.

 

Cheers,

 

Sean