S 006 - focus problems

[sincurves]

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Seeking advice on whether this is the end of the road for my S 006 - hope not. At the end of a portrait shoot it stopped focusing. No sound from the AF indicated another motor failure. Sent it off to Leica and paid EUR500 to have the motor replaced. Turns out focus is still off. Could the mirror or sensor be out of alignment? I have a clear and focused image in the OVF, but the resulting images are out of focus. In the images below I focused manually on the queen, but the image shows focus somewhere else. 

 

Appreciate any thoughts on whether there is a remedy for this as I really like the S 006 look (and upgrades are too costly...).

 

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[ocean2059]

I also happened to me: the motor on my Summarit-S 70/2.5 died few years ago and Leica replaced the motor but the focus was off with the new motor. I am about to send the lens to Leica for recalibration and alignment . From the image you posted, the focus on your lens was off by a fair large amount. Since you just have the motor replaced, maybe you can ask Leica or your dealer to take it back and recalibrate the focus.  

[tom0511]

I would give the whole combo to Leica for repair

[msh58]

If the viewfinder and the recorded image disagree about the focus it seems that the camera body needs adjustment.

You mentioned the photos were taken with MF. Does the autofocus produce a sharp image on the viewfinder and out of focus in the image as well? In AF I guess the calibration of the AF sensor contributes, too. I am guessing the impression of the autofocus sensor, the viewfinder image and the recorded image can all be in disagreement with respect to each other.

Do you have other lenses besides the 120/2.5 to check whether it is the lens? 

[sincurves]

I will have access to more lenses next week which I think will rule out the lens as the culprit. I would have thought the combo would be calibrated as part of AF repair, but that might not be the case. One last trip to Leica then.

[LeicaR10]

Sincurves,   When Leica replaces a S lens AF motor, they do a complete CLA.  It is returned to specifications for the lens.  I suggest based on my experience with many years with the S system, the AF sensor might be off.  I suggest you first try other S lenses.  If no issue with other S lenses and problem remains, S006 and S 120 will need a trip to Wetzlar.  Last, I just looked at your photograph caption and it says a S 120 was used.  You may recall, in low light or low contrast situations, the S 120 AF will hunt focus and sometimes it does miss focus.  r/ Mark  

[ZHNL]

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There are multiple possibility. 

You said focus is all right in OVF but image is off. That means OVF path is off that you need shimmer behind focus screen to adjust. 

Then, if above images were taken with AF, it also means AF path is off. However, I would use a well defined target under very good light to repeat the test to claim the AF failure. As the condition could be treaky for S AF engine. The QUEEN is a very low contrast target that S will struggle to focus. 

If it turns out indeed AF also mis focused, it means both your OVF path and AF focus paths are off. 

[msh58]

Indeed, there are multiple possibilities, which can be identified with systematic testing. We haven't heard about the AF results at all: I think these images were manually focused. One simple possibility is that the focusing screen is not firmly in place: then the AF could be ok and MF off. 

Also, were both MF and AF ok before the AF motor of the 120 S broke? 

 

[sincurves]

I'll try to add a few more specifics:

1. Both MF and AF worked fine until the AF broke on the lens.

2. After AF broke I could not get MF to work either. OVF looked fine, but the images were not - same behavior as above.

3. Both body and 120mm was sent to Leica for repair. Motor was fixed on the lens.

4. I had a note on the diagnosis stating the CCD sensor was broken and needed replacement and was offered the 007 and S3 upgrades. I have had the same note on previous AF repairs and have tried to get more specifics on what was wrong with the CCD without any answers. I have  disregarded this as an attempt to push upgrades and have had no issues with the sensor after such notes. Until now. I'm not sure what impact a CCD issue would have with focus except if alignment is off.

5. The attached images was done with MF on the queen. It looked fine in OVF with a clear focus on said piece.

6. For the two images I could not get AF to engage at all. Internittently it would start to move, but it would stop straight away. No hunting.

7. I have tried AF on well lit objects this morning and it behaves the same. It will internittently engage, sporadically hunt, but it will not lock.

8. Even with images totally OOF I catch myself thinking the bokeh of this lens is special. 

Thanks for responses and advices, much appreciated.

 

 

[ZHNL]

This sounds to me the camera was not put together correctly during CLA. Your sensor most likely was corrupted by now so I think Leica is not pushing you about upgrade but offer you some solution. 
 

if you shoot f16/f22 at sky or white wall and visually check the image you can differentiate dust and corrosion spot. Corrosion spot like a butterfly with wing on each side.  Too bad Leica is no longer offer sensor replacement even at cost. 
 

i think they should be able to correct AF and OVF focus issue easily but not sensor. 
 

good luck. 

[sincurves]

19 minutes ago, ZHNL said:

This sounds to me the camera was not put together correctly during CLA. Your sensor most likely was corrupted by now so I think Leica is not pushing you about upgrade but offer you some solution. 
 

if you shoot f16/f22 at sky or white wall and visually check the image you can differentiate dust and corrosion spot. Corrosion spot like a butterfly with wing on each side.  Too bad Leica is no longer offer sensor replacement even at cost. 
 

i think they should be able to correct AF and OVF focus issue easily but not sensor. 
 

good luck. 

Thanks. 

Sensor is fine, no corrosion.

Checking the report from Leica again it states the autofocus is caused by the lens. Repair of sensor is offered at USD5k - which I don't think is needed.

I'll send it in one last time before I give up on this. 

 

 

[msh58]

vor 5 Stunden schrieb sincurves:

I'll try to add a few more specifics:

1. Both MF and AF worked fine until the AF broke on the lens.

2. After AF broke I could not get MF to work either. OVF looked fine, but the images were not - same behavior as above.

3. Both body and 120mm was sent to Leica for repair. Motor was fixed on the lens.

4. I had a note on the diagnosis stating the CCD sensor was broken and needed replacement and was offered the 007 and S3 upgrades. I have had the same note on previous AF repairs and have tried to get more specifics on what was wrong with the CCD without any answers. I have  disregarded this as an attempt to push upgrades and have had no issues with the sensor after such notes. Until now. I'm not sure what impact a CCD issue would have with focus except if alignment is off.

5. The attached images was done with MF on the queen. It looked fine in OVF with a clear focus on said piece.

6. For the two images I could not get AF to engage at all. Internittently it would start to move, but it would stop straight away. No hunting.

7. I have tried AF on well lit objects this morning and it behaves the same. It will internittently engage, sporadically hunt, but it will not lock.

8. Even with images totally OOF I catch myself thinking the bokeh of this lens is special. 

Thanks for responses and advices, much appreciated.

 

 

From manual focus not working it seems clear that the camera is messed up: the distances from the mirror to the focus screen and sensor are not the same. Furthermore, the autofocus sensor seems to be acting up. Leica should fix all of this free of charge now, since you have already paid to supposedly get the camera working. 

My experience of the Leica service is that their quality seems to be much more uneven than that of their production of new cameras and lenses. Your experience again shows their arrogant attitude towards the customer. Even upon request they refuse to elaborate on the problem as if it was a classified secret. 

Let's hope someone at Leica reads this discussion and, above all, that you get you camera and lens in perfect condition again.

Good luck, and don't give up easily! - Matti

[BernardC]

AF works, but not MF. It could be an issue with the focusing screen. You should make sure that it's seated properly.

[msh58]

vor einer Stunde schrieb BernardC:

AF works, but not MF. It could be an issue with the focusing screen. You should make sure that it's seated properly.

This video may be helpful, it shows how the focusing screen locks in place.