If You Were Me: The 50mm Dilemma.

[lct]

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4 minutes ago, analog-digital said:

Why do we want the perfect lens when we can't even get a good picture?

Because this way i know where my crappy pics come from

[a.noctilux]

Perfection ?

 

When I found one perfect lens (really ?), I began searching a more perfect lens.

It means that perfect lens never last in perfection.

...

good for me as I always feel that perfection is boring.

[MAFORLIFE]

On 1/17/2021 at 9:01 AM, shirubadanieru said:

(more so with the collapsible and rigid v1, not so much with the rigid v2),

Hello, would you mind clarifying what you mean by rigid V1 and rigid V2? When does it stop being V1 and becomes V2? In my understanding of the Summicron chronology, the V1 is the collapsible, the V2 is the rigid (from serial 140 or so until 223), then comes the V3 starting at batch 226 (actually some people even would call that the V2, including the collapsible, the DR and the rigid in V1).. Thank you. 

[lct]

You may wisk to ask @luigi bertolotti who knows much better than me but see below a little summary about Summicron 50/2 non apo main versions. I seem to recall that Ken Rockwell did a good job on this but i haven't kept a link sorry.

• 1st version Collapsible SOOIC
• 2nd version Rigid SOSIC (11818)
• 2nd version Rigid Dual Range (11918)
• 2nd version Rigid black paint (11117)
• 3rd version Rigid black (11817)
• 4th version Rigid black (11819) / silver (11825)
• 5th version Rigid black (11826) / silver (11816) / titanium (11624)

[MAFORLIFE]

4 hours ago, lct said:

You may wisk to ask @luigi bertolotti who knows much better than me but see below a little summary about Summicron 50/2 non apo main versions. I seem to recall that Ken Rockwell did a good job on this but i haven't kept a link sorry.

• 1st version Collapsible SOOIC
• 2nd version Rigid SOSIC (11818)
• 2nd version Rigid Dual Range (11918)
• 2nd version Rigid black paint (11117)
• 3rd version Rigid black (11817)
• 4th version Rigid black (11819) / silver (11825)
• 5th version Rigid black (11826) / silver (11816) / titanium (11624)

Thank for the taking the time to write this. It's in line with my previous post, in which I assume that there is only one version of the "rigid". V1 is the collapsible, V2 is all the rigid (original design) including the Dual Range, V3 is the first redesigned summicron. But I know that @shirubadanieru has very subtile taste, so maybe he had a reason for calling two versions of the rigid. I personally prefer the rendering of my earlier rigid (batch 158) vs my later rigid (batch 207). It might be just the way the lens was kept, but both have perfect optics, and both render completely different... 

[lct]

I used to think that there is a rigid variant of the Summicron 50/2 v1 as well but i have no experience with it and @luigi bertolotti told me he was not in agreement. I will try to retrieve the link if you wish.

 

[Ecar]

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15 hours ago, MAFORLIFE said:

Thank for the taking the time to write this. It's in line with my previous post, in which I assume that there is only one version of the "rigid". V1 is the collapsible, V2 is all the rigid (original design) including the Dual Range, V3 is the first redesigned summicron. But I know that @shirubadanieru has very subtile taste, so maybe he had a reason for calling two versions of the rigid. I personally prefer the rendering of my earlier rigid (batch 158) vs my later rigid (batch 207). It might be just the way the lens was kept, but both have perfect optics, and both render completely different... 

AFAIK, there are two versions (or types) of the Rigid. An early one (11118, SOSTA?) with the thin focusing ring that it shares with the DR) and a later one (11818, SOSIC?) with a slightly larger ring. No idea as to when exactly the latter replaced the former. I have both and although they are supposed to share the same optical design, there are indeed subtle, but noticeable differences in rendering.

[MAFORLIFE]

8 hours ago, Ecar said:

AFAIK, there are two versions (or types) of the Rigid. An early one (11118, SOSTA?) with the thin focusing ring that it shares with the DR) and a later one (11818, SOSIC?) with a slightly larger ring. No idea as to when exactly the latter replaced the former. I have both and although they are supposed to share the same optical design, there are indeed subtle, but noticeable differences in rendering.

Thank you, this is helpful! 

[luigi bertolotti]

On 10/14/2025 at 4:59 AM, lct said:

You may wisk to ask @luigi bertolotti who knows much better than me but see below a little summary about Summicron 50/2 non apo main versions. I seem to recall that Ken Rockwell did a good job on this but i haven't kept a link sorry.

• 1st version Collapsible SOOIC
• 2nd version Rigid SOSIC (11818)
• 2nd version Rigid Dual Range (11918)
• 2nd version Rigid black paint (11117)
• 3rd version Rigid black (11817)
• 4th version Rigid black (11819) / silver (11825)
• 5th version Rigid black (11826) / silver (11816) / titanium (11624)

Thanks for the appreciation 🙂... me too cannot find that old thread... but my final opinion is that is someway vain to establish a definite scale of "versions"... how can we assess what is a version or a variant ? Just for example, the SM Summicron was made in

1) Collapsible mount

2) Rigid mount, single distance scale

3) Rigid mount, dual distance scale

... and for BM the plot is a lot more complicated (blacks, knurling, DR... 🤔)... btw it existed and was made in numbers, also the SM in Compur version... 😉

If we could agree that VERSION means a specific optical design (apart coating, which could evolve...) , in this sense we surely have :

1) TWO 7 elements designs one for collapsible(SM and BM, I think identical) , one for rigid (SM and BM, also identical... Leitz did provide a SM mount for owners of a BM rigid) : we can call those two design as SOOIC and SOSTA (or SOOIC and SOSIC, just to make things simpler 🤔); the last design was used also for the Dual Range...

2) First 6 elements design (1969 ?) which can be identified as 11817

3) Second 6 elements design (1979) which can be identified as 11819

AFAIK in optical terms this is still the current design of the non apo Summicron... made in several different mounts and finishings (also in the SM "limited" version... also in the oldstyle "50 years Summicron" edition...) 

What I do not know by sure is if the first 6 elements has the lens unit unscrewable from mount (forBellows+Visoflex usage) ; the second surely not.

Edited yesterday at 09:00 AM by luigi bertolotti