Cindy Flood Posted August 21, 2007 Share #21 Posted August 21, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Jamie may have hit on something. If the Canon 580 works, why not the little Canon 430? That would be the right size for me. Has anyone tried it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted August 21, 2007 Posted August 21, 2007 Hi Cindy Flood, Take a look here Using flash anyone? Any recommendation?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Guest guy_mancuso Posted August 21, 2007 Share #22 Posted August 21, 2007 Remember though you need a flash that you can maually adjust the ISO, F stop, A mode, zoom and also have manual control. Most of the new flashes are camera specific driven and set the ISO , zooming to lens on and TTL and maybe not A mode at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted August 21, 2007 Share #23 Posted August 21, 2007 Remember though you need a flash that you can maually adjust the ISO, F stop, A mode, zoom and also have manual control. Most of the new flashes are camera specific driven and set the ISO , zooming to lens on and TTL and maybe not A mode at all. Hey Guy--we're talking dumb manual settings--so you don't need any of those features. If you want to add a lot of light--like the Metz flashes do--then you need that kind of control (like working in the sun outdoors). But for balancing flash with ambient light indoors, the 580 just goes on manual and you use the little wheel thingy (easy to use) to adjust the flash output from full to 1/256 (or whatever it is). Your synch speed is 1/250 or less with the m8, so you essentially control the ambient with the shutter and the flash with the manual power setting and the aperture. It's manual, but it works, and with the 580 controls, anyway, it works quickly. If you're bouncing the flash, you don't even need the zoom much (because hopefully you're bouncing off of something big and not pointing the flash at a subject So you get something that looks like this (ISO 640 1/16s f2.0 75 Lux--could have had faster shutter but it was dark).. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! BTW--if you don't like the tungsten warmth in the background, just gel the flash with a straw filter and white balance for tungsten Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! BTW--if you don't like the tungsten warmth in the background, just gel the flash with a straw filter and white balance for tungsten ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/31486-using-flash-anyone-any-recommendation/?do=findComment&comment=334718'>More sharing options...
simon_hughes Posted August 21, 2007 Share #24 Posted August 21, 2007 I just tried an older Nikon SB-80DX in manual mode and it works well too. I've got a 24D coming (great price on a excellent used one from KEH) but at least the 80DX gives me tilt/swivel etc, and I can even put my Lightsphere on it (now there's a strange looking combo on a Leica!). Cheers, Simon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted August 21, 2007 Share #25 Posted August 21, 2007 Hey Guy--we're talking dumb manual settings--so you don't need any of those features. If you want to add a lot of light--like the Metz flashes do--then you need that kind of control (like working in the sun outdoors). But for balancing flash with ambient light indoors, the 580 just goes on manual and you use the little wheel thingy (easy to use) to adjust the flash output from full to 1/256 (or whatever it is). Your synch speed is 1/250 or less with the m8, so you essentially control the ambient with the shutter and the flash with the manual power setting and the aperture. It's manual, but it works, and with the 580 controls, anyway, it works quickly. If you're bouncing the flash, you don't even need the zoom much (because hopefully you're bouncing off of something big and not pointing the flash at a subject So you get something that looks like this (ISO 640 1/16s f2.0 75 Lux--could have had faster shutter but it was dark).. [ATTACH]50634[/ATTACH] BTW--if you don't like the tungsten warmth in the background, just gel the flash with a straw filter and white balance for tungsten Exactly Jamie if your not needing the A mode and such for like event work which provides no time to play in the M mode than having a manual output where you can adjust the power is great and i use this technique a lot myself. Mainly outdoor fill. Just like working with the bigger strobes Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rondeb Posted August 21, 2007 Share #26 Posted August 21, 2007 Alright! I just tried dialing down my 550EX to 1/128(its' lowest) and this works great! Lovin' it.....but.... Is this safe to do without an adapter? I don't want to blow my M8 out or anything. Thanks for the help. BTW, I'm going to check out my old 420EX(smaller) now. I'll post results. Best, Ron Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rondeb Posted August 21, 2007 Share #27 Posted August 21, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) OK. No way to dial down the 420EX. So much for that one. Anyone care to comment on whether the 550/580 is safe to mount directly to the M8 without an adapter? Thanks, Ron Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon_hughes Posted August 21, 2007 Share #28 Posted August 21, 2007 Most modern flashes are OK, it's the older ones with the high voltage that you need the adaptor for. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rondeb Posted August 21, 2007 Share #29 Posted August 21, 2007 Most modern flashes are OK, it's the older ones with the high voltage that you need the adaptor for. Sweet! I may be selling my 24d then. Best, Ron Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon_hughes Posted August 21, 2007 Share #30 Posted August 21, 2007 Just to be sure you know, you will NOT have TTL without the 24D (or possibly a matched Metz flash). I plan to get an off-camera cord to use with the 24D to at least be able to point it where I want. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rondeb Posted August 21, 2007 Share #31 Posted August 21, 2007 Just to be sure you know, you will NOT have TTL without the 24D (or possibly a matched Metz flash). I plan to get an off-camera cord to use with the 24D to at least be able to point it where I want. Thanks again Simon. I've actually never liked the TTL on the 24D anyways. The pre-flash is much too distracting and I've found better results using the A mode anyways. Best, Ron Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dante Posted August 21, 2007 Share #32 Posted August 21, 2007 I would recommend the Nikon SB-20, which costs about $40 on Ebay. It is GN100 in feet at ISO 100. Simple, reliable, good. It has a tilt head (-7 to 90 degrees) and three rotating diffusers (cleverly designed and coaxial with the head tilt). It isn't as vulnerable to knocks as other flashes. It has TTL (obviously inapplicable), A (five apertures), and M (Full down to 1/16 power). It also has a standby mode that turns it off two minutes after the last flash. The Nikon ready-light signal works on the M8 and sets the camera up to synch (per whatever synch setting you have the camera on). The only thing to watch with third-party flashes (and maybe even Leica ones) is that the meter takes a fraction of a second to understand that a flash is attached when the camera comes out of sleep. If the camera is "asleep" and you jam down on the shutter release, the camera may fire without flash. Wait until the lightning bolt appears in the VF. Alternatively, the Konica HX-18W is a tiny thyristor auto flash with two auto modes. Good for traveling light. Its scale shows ISO 100 and 400, but you can close down a stop to get the ISO 200 aperture value (what an M8 calls ISO "160"). It also triggers the ready light/synch on the M8. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGeoJO Posted August 21, 2007 Author Share #33 Posted August 21, 2007 dante, If you let the flash trigger the sync speed then you have less control of the ambient light. Then the background may be too dark where if you do it manually, you can setup the shutter speed to balance the available light with flash. I am thinking of using that with Gary Fong's Lightsphere or Stof-fen or something similar. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted August 21, 2007 Share #34 Posted August 21, 2007 I use a Stofen . But back to Dante's point if you hold the shutter down until the second position meter hold than it will fire with no issues, but Dante is correct if you just slam it down than no go on the flash if you go to fast. i use the Metz 54 quite a bit with some of these corporate events, i do have a Nikon SB28DX and it works fine except you can't set the ISO but you sure can fool it by adjusting the aperture on the flash to say F4 at ISO 100 which is stuck and if you have the M8 at ISO 640 than you can shoot at F8 or F11. So you can trick these things on the A mode Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grober Posted August 21, 2007 Share #35 Posted August 21, 2007 Note the use (in Cindy's photos posted in this thread) of a Wein SynchSafe between the flash and the M8. I've never had a Leica flash unit, nor have any experience with one, but I think it's important even mandatory to use the Wein SynchSafe between the M8 and any non-Leica flash. I always use this same Wein electrical safety gizmo between my M8 and an old but still usable SunPak 383 portable flash unit. I also use it whenever I use my Morris radio trigger unit to fire one or two remote studio flashes wirelessly. Make good sense to me: why risk frying a $5000 camera with an errant, potentially killer, over-voltage from a lowly $60 flash? -g Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlesphoto99 Posted August 21, 2007 Share #36 Posted August 21, 2007 Note the use (in Cindy's photos posted in this thread) of a Wein SynchSafe between the flash and the M8. I've never had a Leica flash unit, nor have any experience with one, but I think it's important even mandatory to use the Wein SynchSafe between the M8 and any non-Leica flash. I always use this same Wein electrical safety gizmo between my M8 and an old but still usable SunPak 383 portable flash unit. I also use it whenever I use my Morris radio trigger unit to fire one or two remote studio flashes wirelessly. Make good sense to me: why risk frying a $5000 camera with an errant, potentially killer, over-voltage from a lowly $60 flash? -g I doubt one needs to use a safe sync in Cindy's case, but a good bet with any older flash. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted August 21, 2007 Share #37 Posted August 21, 2007 OK, you don't need a synch-safe with any modern portable flash. You probably need one if you're going to hook up a strobe directly to the hot shoe. But I'd use Pocket Wizards or equivalent to do that. To answer a direct question, yes, the 550 EX Canon flash works fine, but the 580 has that wheel that makes full manual completely workable even at events. It's a snap to set manual settings with that thing, and the 550 just, um, isn't as good The 580 also has a ton of control in terms of turning it down... well beyond 1/16th output for instance. But they aren't cheap, that's for sure (and no, there isn't any TTL with this setup. What you do get though is perfect control of flash vs ambient exposure. But you need to play a second or two--that's what the chimp is for!) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cindy Flood Posted August 21, 2007 Share #38 Posted August 21, 2007 I had a conversation with an electronics wizard who warned me about mixing electronic parts of different brands not only because of the differences in voltage (which is not a worry with the new strobes) but also because of the different contact pins. I use the safe-sync because I like the extra protection that it affords. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
charlesphoto99 Posted August 22, 2007 Share #39 Posted August 22, 2007 I had a conversation with an electronics wizard who warned me about mixing electronic parts of different brands not only because of the differences in voltage (which is not a worry with the new strobes) but also because of the different contact pins. I use the safe-sync because I like the extra protection that it affords. Yes, but you are really just running a flash MADE for Leica through a cord that retains the same voltage and functions. Not a problem if you're down with the kludginess of it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilFarber Posted August 22, 2007 Share #40 Posted August 22, 2007 I have been shooting weddings with 2 m8's and using a Metz 54 without aa cells in the head, which makes the strobe much lighter. Using the Demb Jumbo Bounce Card and the metz on camera with a lightweight Quantum Turbo SC battery it is a really light combo for 14 hour days. The exposures have been excellent and you just change the degree of tilt when needed. It also gives that little bit of extra height for the vertical shots. I have also used his bracket set up, but got tired of removing or loosening it to get at the battery and card, but if you really want the extra height for the strobe on verticals it is a great lightweight set up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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