Both M10 Monochrom and M10/(P)?

[dancook]

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Does anyone have both the M10 and M10 Monochrom?

How do you decide between them? do you ever convert M10 shots to black and white and wonder why you bother with the monochrom, or do you feel it has it's place?

I want the monochrom for the high ISO handling but sometimes I think it would be nice to have the M10 colours sometime as well (at least with quicker handling than.....) the X1D II which i have 80/135. I want a wider lens to shoot colour portraits of people surrounded by their hobby stuff - I just wonder sometimes what if I sold the X1D II before I spent even more money on it and got an M10 Monochrom and M10-P. Whilst this is probably only G.A.S talking, I'm still interested to hear from those who have both and how they see them.

Edited June 6, 2020 by dancook

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[Jeff S]

 I own the M10 and the original Monochrom.  I don't take them out together, as the main benefit of the Monochrom for me is the special experience of 'seeing and thinking' in a black and white mode, as I did for decades in my b/w film days.  I can do that to some extent with any color digital camera as well, but it's really not the same.  

I find IQ with both cameras fully capable for my print needs, provided of course that I do my job in all phases of the shooting and printing workflow.  In fact, the use of color channels in PP when using the M10 is something I miss with the Monochrom, which isn't as flexible with use of color lens filters...but again, is a different experience.

This is a personal thing, as we each have different goals and needs.  I don't have any use for ultra high ISO, nor for making monster sized prints, so the M10 Monochrom would be overkill for me.  But, admittedly, the M10 platform is more robust and user friendly than the M9 platform used for the MM, although the latter is a real bargain these days.

Jeff

[Anakronox]

I shoot with both the M10 and M10 Monochrom and when going out take both.  The weather where I’m at right now swings between stormy and beautiful from minute to minute.  I can never be sure if the light will cooperate or not.  Depending on conditions I’ll prioritize one over the other.  Beautiful light and nice colors?  M10 it is.  Middling light and more contrast but no interesting color?  M10M.  I don’t really like to convert my M10 shots to black and white, but will if I see see a scene that I know will work better and the M10 is already in my hand. 

[onasj]

I take both the M10P and the M10M when possible.  The M10M's sensor is superior (understatement, especially in modest light) but color is occasionally needed.  Plus not having to switch lenses to change focal length is very convenient.  But if you don't have an M10P already you might want to wait a couple months for a potential M10R announcement.

[T25UFO]

I have M10-M and M10-D.  When I bought the Mono I thought about selling the D but now glad I kept it.  Both are very special cameras.  The Mono coupled with 50mm APO produces quite stunning results.  I understand the point @Jeff S makes about not needing high ISO, but with this camera you can effectively ignore the ISO.  It’s the first camera I’ve used where Auto ISO has become my default setting.

The D is equally special, but for different reasons.  You either get it or you don’t; I do and I find it a most refreshing camera to use.  I do take both out at the same time for much the same reasons as @Anakronox and most of the time I keep a 50mm lens on both.  The Summicron APO on the Mono and the Retro  Summilux on the D.  The old style Retro lens just feels “right” on the D.

I also have the Q2, which is not getting as much use nowadays, but no intention of selling.

[Likaleica]

I am fortunate to have both the M10-P and the M10M.  I would say that I use the M10M 90% of the time, but I have been working on a specifically monochrome project for the past 5 months, one that oddly requires high ISO in daylight because I've been using a pinhole.  The high ISO performance of the M10M allows me to handhold the camera with the pinhole, which was kind of unheard of previously.  

However, even with normal lens use I still reach for the Monochom most often.  I am partially color blind so I don't trust my color post-processing ability and I don't like to let the software decide what is best.  I don't really manipulate colors but I'm sure some of my results look odd to others.  Since I can't see color well I apparently tend to crank it up, which makes the photo look weird.  

Also, like many on the Forum, I am of the vintage that monochrome photography was how I started and holds a special place for me as to what photography "should be."  I don't really have that narrow view, but I do like good black and white work.  

When I do go out with the M10-P (I seldom take both) I keep the preview in BW JPG.  I almost never chimp, but when I do I like to see the image in BW.

Like Jeff S, I don't need the increased resolution and would have preferred 24MP max.  However, the ergonomics and UI just can't be beat.  I'm afraid Leica has eliminated me as a future customer because I am so completely satisfied with this platform.

I don't know which would be my "desert island" camera.  The M10-P would make more sense, but I would miss the Monochrom.  I think an M10D-Monochrom would be my ideal camera.

[dancook]

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5 hours ago, Likaleica said:

I am fortunate to have both the M10-P and the M10M.  I would say that I use the M10M 90% of the time, but I have been working on a specifically monochrome project for the past 5 months, one that oddly requires high ISO in daylight because I've been using a pinhole.  The high ISO performance of the M10M allows me to handhold the camera with the pinhole, which was kind of unheard of previously.  

That sounds interesting, are you publishing the output somewhere?

[MarkP]

.

Edited June 7, 2020 by MarkP

[MarkP]

13 hours ago, Jeff S said:

 I own the M10 and the original Monochrom.  I don't take them out together, as the main benefit of the Monochrom for me is the special experience of 'seeing and thinking' in a black and white mode, as I did for decades in my b/w film days.  I can do that to some extent with any color digital camera as well, but it's really not the same.  

I find IQ with both cameras fully capable for my print needs, provided of course that I do my job in all phases of the shooting and printing workflow.  In fact, the use of color channels in PP when using the M10 is something I miss with the Monochrom, which isn't as flexible with use of color lens filters...but again, is a different experience.

This is a personal thing, as we each have different goals and needs.  I don't have any use for ultra high ISO, nor for making monster sized prints, so the M10 Monochrom would be overkill for me.  But, admittedly, the M10 platform is more robust and user friendly than the M9 platform used for the MM, although the latter is a real bargain these days.

Jeff

I have these two cameras too and fully agree with you.

[dkmoore]

I have both and would always want to have a color body of some sort. About 4-5 years ago I had the M240P and M246 and I was using the M246 90% of the time so I got rid of the M240P to fund additional lenses. I quickly realized that maybe that 10% is more like 30% and I need to have a color camera.   :  )

It will be interesting to see if the M10R sensor is as good or close to as good as the M10M sensor. If so, easy upgrade decision and I agree with Onasj. I believe the camera will go live Q4 based on what I am hearing. Get rid of the X1D.  :  )-                  (I have no reasonable reason for recommending you to get rid of the X1D)

I have a harder time deciding which lens to put on both when I go out. UGH.

[Fedro]

I have both and usually go out with both. I convert about 50% of the M10P to B&W but would not want to be without a colour body. 

That said, if you already cover  colour with your X1D (which I also have) or Sonys not sure if you need to have it with an M

For a while I "only" had the 246 and SL and that was totally ok

[tgray]

I imagine I will try to pick up a used M10 in the future as a backup camera or for the few times I want color. But the M10M was far too expensive for me to justify having both. I should probably replace my aging Ricoh GR as that makes an excellent 2nd camera for my usage, and I’d save a boatload of money compared to another Leica

[Tulpenwahn]

Not exactly what you asked for, but quite interesting:

I own a M9 and bought a M10M a month ago. Of course, I used the M10M heavily since then. Side effect: after I had hardly used the M9 for quite a while, I now feel like taking more colour photos again, too (especially with the M9). Which does not mean that the M10M is not great fun. On the contrary. It is a mutually reinforcing effect.

Seeing only BW photos in your stream, in the end is a little bit depressing:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/winfried-veil/

To add a colour picture once in a while makes your photography life lively.

 

Edited June 8, 2020 by Tulpenwahn

[Franka373]

4 hours ago, Tulpenwahn said:

Not exactly what you asked for, but quite interesting:

I own a M9 and bought a M10M a month ago. Of course, I used the M10M heavily since then. Side effect: after I had hardly used the M9 for quite a while, I now feel like taking more colour photos again, too (especially with the M9). Which does not mean that the M10M is not great fun. On the contrary. It is a mutually reinforcing effect.

Seeing only BW photos in your stream, in the end is a little bit depressing:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/winfried-veil/

To add a colour picture once in a while makes your photography life lively.

 

A lot of great photos on your site.  

[Likaleica]

On 6/7/2020 at 4:23 AM, dancook said:

That sounds interesting, are you publishing the output somewhere?

Yes, I'm looking at different options now.

[dancook]

Thanks everyone for their inputs..

I will stick to my original plan, M10M + 28 lux and a 50 (lux?) alongside X1D II (30/45)/80/135 - I keep looking at the 35-75 zoom... but when I remember it's £5k, getting a 30/45 becomes a lot more appealing again, add to that the size of the thing!

[FlashGordonPhotography]

On 6/10/2020 at 7:46 PM, dancook said:

Thanks everyone for their inputs..

I will stick to my original plan, M10M + 28 lux and a 50 (lux?) alongside X1D II (30/45)/80/135 - I keep looking at the 35-75 zoom... but when I remember it's £5k, getting a 30/45 becomes a lot more appealing again, add to that the size of the thing!

I have the M10M M10 and X1D. My M10 is the one that gets used the least. I carry a very small kit for the M10M (28, 50, 90) and a bigger kit for the X1D (21, 30, 35-75, 90, 135/TC (I swap the 90 for the 80 if I'm shooting portraits)). The M10 doesn't have the resolution I require. If I wanted to shoot M lenses in colour I'd take the SL2 instead. When the M10R arrives I'll be first in line.

Gordon

p.s. If you're keeping the X1D then get the zoom. It's a bag of primes, optically. And compared to the 30,45 and 65 it replaces it's both lighter and cheaper.

[dancook]

13 hours ago, FlashGordonPhotography said:

I have the M10M M10 and X1D. My M10 is the one that gets used the least. I carry a very small kit for the M10M (28, 50, 90) and a bigger kit for the X1D (21, 30, 35-75, 90, 135/TC (I swap the 90 for the 80 if I'm shooting portraits)). The M10 doesn't have the resolution I require. If I wanted to shoot M lenses in colour I'd take the SL2 instead. When the M10R arrives I'll be first in line.

Gordon

p.s. If you're keeping the X1D then get the zoom. It's a bag of primes, optically. And compared to the 30,45 and 65 it replaces it's both lighter and cheaper.

Just a £5000 bag of primes! I have been considering it some and I'll have to consider order of acquirement...

M10M, 28 Lux, 50 lux and XCD 35-75 ...is not a cheap wish list.. but it makes good sense

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2 hours ago, dancook said:

Just a £5000 bag of primes! I have been considering it some and I'll have to consider order of acquirement...

M10M, 28 Lux, 50 lux and XCD 35-75 ...is not a cheap wish list.. but it makes good sense

Your mind on the M Lux lenses Dan is probably made up, but I have to say that since using the M10-M my desire for the faster and more expensive Leica lenses has faded, the "slower" lenses work just fine because of the very clean / usable high ASA's that the M10-M affords. Summicrons will suffice easily and in my opinion they give a better overall quality of image especially when both are used and compared wide open.

[dancook]

4 hours ago, petermullett said:

Your mind on the M Lux lenses Dan is probably made up, but I have to say that since using the M10-M my desire for the faster and more expensive Leica lenses has faded, the "slower" lenses work just fine because of the very clean / usable high ASA's that the M10-M affords. Summicrons will suffice easily and in my opinion they give a better overall quality of image especially when both are used and compared wide open.

I've bounced the idea around a fair bit, really wanted the 28mm lux in particular - i do like the look wide open.