Leica identification

[Phillmcc]

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Hi everyone , I have been told that a lot of early Leicas have three screws around the baseplate tripod mount , I've also been told that all or most of the fake Leicas have those same screws. Can anyone tell me when Leica stopped adding those screws on the baseplate please.
I own a fake body which I purchased knowing that it is fake by the way :) 

[a.noctilux]

Hello and welcome here,

Identification fake is simple or complicated depending on each camera.

Relying only on baseplate's screws is not good idea, as baseplates can be swapped easily.

Even on real genuine Leica, there are "modified"/upgraded" by the Leitz factories that we can hardly see as "fake".

😉

an example with my "I" modified "II" ...

as collector, I would like this "I" (from the numbering) stayed as "I" but it was modified at some point of it's life for "user" (I think)

 

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As user point, I'm happy with this "II" for benefit of added in the camera the rangefinder

 

 

Anyway, chasing for old Leica can be fun and expensive (or not depending on each situation),

but time to learn "how" can be long if pleasing 😇

 

 

[luigi bertolotti]

On 12/8/2019 at 4:08 PM, Phillmcc said:

Hi everyone , I have been told that a lot of early Leicas have three screws around the baseplate tripod mount , I've also been told that all or most of the fake Leicas have those same screws. Can anyone tell me when Leica stopped adding those screws on the baseplate please.
I own a fake body which I purchased knowing that it is fake by the way

Ah.. that's really a question for experts... 😎; baseplate isn't so sexy... also, on old Leicas it was probably prone to maintenance which could alter the original status... probably a generic answer can be "around s/n 100.000..." and there is also the "intermediate"version... (no screws, but sign of previous ones)

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[Anbaric]

Just wondering - are those circular marks holes that were later filled in, or indentations that were never fully drilled?

[AndreasG]

Probably clamp marks from soldering the threaded insert to the base plate?

[luigi bertolotti]

Who knows... is definitely a small detail which was modified during the long life of Barnacks... the threaded hole is clearly machined in a round insert, to add stabilty when mounting camera on tripod.. and it is like this even in last Barnacks like my IIIc, and also in this IIf

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Even if the insert is so well integrated in the main baseplate that sometime is almost impossible to identify it (maybe the chroming process "covered" the insert ?)

Anyway, in the "No screw" baseplates, the insert is secured by internal small pins, so that nothing appears on the back surface. When this started ? question mark... around 100.000 is my hipotesis 

[ChrisRouaud]

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I look forward for an expertise for a Leica Camera I bought at an auction (via Internet) in France two weeks ago and that I just received this morning.

This camera was sold as a « Leica USA ». It has no serial number on the top plate. So, I thought it was a « Dummy Leica IIIa » who will complete my collection. But, in fact, it is in working order. The baseplate of the camera, on its internal face, wear the mention « E. Leitz, Inc, New York » ; and on its external face the engravings « Open / Close » (instead of Auf /Zu) and the mention « U.S.A. » and I realize it was just identical to a Kardon baseplate. Its maximum speed is 1/1000th sec. It has a diopter adjustment lever below rewind knob (like a IIIb) but rangefinder and viewfinder eyepieces are clearly separate (like a IIIa). He has an Elmar 3.5/ 3.5 cm Nr 555797 (made in 1940).  So, a strange mix between a Leica IIIa, a Leica IIIb and a Kardon Camera. My researches in specific literature (as Van Hasbroek) didn’t give me any clue… Was it made from a Dummy Leica ? Was it a specific model made by Leitz NYC under the supervision of the Alien Property Custodian Act (from 1942) by P. Kardon, using parts of Leitz Inc. NY ?

I will enjoy enlightments from your expertise, or, links you may propose me for getting this expertise.

Enclosed to this mail are some pictures of this camera,

Thanks in advance for any information you may give me,

Best Regards,

Chris

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[dubois pierre]

The same question for me for expertise this leica 3c (1940) engraved W. H.

This curious 3c (1949) black

Thanks

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[sabears]

Unfortunately Leica n.361450 is a FAKED one, with W.H./military  engravings added later. I know that it was sold about 7-8 years ago on the web.
This forgery is really a shame, because the camera was part of a  RARE wartime delivery shipped to Japan. Indeed, in the registers it's clearly written completed 23.7.40 and shipped 6.8.40 to Tokyo on shipment 14460.

Cheers.

[sabears]

On 12/13/2019 at 10:43 PM, ChrisRouaud said:

I look forward for an expertise for a Leica Camera I bought at an auction (via Internet) in France two weeks ago and that I just received this morning.

This camera was sold as a « Leica USA ». It has no serial number on the top plate. So, I thought it was a « Dummy Leica IIIa » who will complete my collection. But, in fact, it is in working order. The baseplate of the camera, on its internal face, wear the mention « E. Leitz, Inc, New York » ; and on its external face the engravings « Open / Close » (instead of Auf /Zu) and the mention « U.S.A. » and I realize it was just identical to a Kardon baseplate. Its maximum speed is 1/1000th sec. It has a diopter adjustment lever below rewind knob (like a IIIb) but rangefinder and viewfinder eyepieces are clearly separate (like a IIIa). He has an Elmar 3.5/ 3.5 cm Nr 555797 (made in 1940).  So, a strange mix between a Leica IIIa, a Leica IIIb and a Kardon Camera. My researches in specific literature (as Van Hasbroek) didn’t give me any clue… Was it made from a Dummy Leica ? Was it a specific model made by Leitz NYC under the supervision of the Alien Property Custodian Act (from 1942) by P. Kardon, using parts of Leitz Inc. NY ?

I will enjoy enlightments from your expertise, or, links you may propose me for getting this expertise.

Enclosed to this mail are some pictures of this camera,

Thanks in advance for any information you may give me,

Best Regards,

Chris

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

We have talked about this after-war Kardon camera, with a Leitz spare part as top cover, in another post: as known, the Alien Property Custodian Act  has nothing to do with post-war production.

[dubois pierre]

57 minutes ago, sabears said:

Unfortunately Leica n.361450 is a FAKED one, with W.H./military  engravings added later. I know that it was sold about 7-8 years ago on the web.
This forgery is really a shame, because the camera was part of a  RARE wartime delivery shipped to Japan. Indeed, in the registers it's clearly written completed 23.7.40 and shipped 6.8.40 to Tokyo on shipment 14460.

Cheers.

 😉Thank you for these clarifications 

[Pyrogallol]

Did anyone see, or possibly buy this unusually numbered early body? I have not read about a Leica body with a letter on the end of the serial number, must be why it reached such a high price.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Leica-1-1a-Standard-Rangefinder-Film-Camera-Vintage-Rare-Ernst-leitz-Wetzlar-/283729918159?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&nma=true&si=k13pMs75%2BfZCJTsJ%2FrK2AibsZc8%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc

 

[willeica]

3 hours ago, Pyrogallol said:

Did anyone see, or possibly buy this unusually numbered early body? I have not read about a Leica body with a letter on the end of the serial number, must be why it reached such a high price.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Leica-1-1a-Standard-Rangefinder-Film-Camera-Vintage-Rare-Ernst-leitz-Wetzlar-/283729918159?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&nma=true&si=k13pMs75%2BfZCJTsJ%2FrK2AibsZc8%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc

 

I think that you are right about the reason for the high price. It seems to be a I Model A converted to a I Model C standardised (see the '0' on the top of the lens mounting ring). It would be worthwhile checking this with the Leica Archives. Maybe someone has already done this.

William