Now the time to swap M240 for SL ?

[Boojay]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

7 minutes ago, JoanP said:

Another POV is that there is now a "bundle" being offered consisting of a NEW SL, with either the 24-90 OR the 50mm including cable release, cables, battery, etc. and the 2 year Leica warranty as all is new. This is going for $7995 at B&H and even lower at POPFLASH. I know as I just called POPLFLASH which is where I've bought quite a bit of Leica gear. I've actually never handled or even seen an SL but these are really great deals. POPFLASH has the same bundle for $7588. They told me, "as they trickle in from Leica we are selling them at a discount". I have a M10 and M246 with a bunch of M glass. I'd love to try an SL and would pick this over the newer and improved S1 or S1R.

Yes there are deals here in the UK too on the SL and used market prices have dropped significantly.   My M10 has been away at Wetzlar so I decided to dip my toe and purchased a used SL that sadly after a couple of days, I have sent back to the dealer.   No fault of the camera, I loved the files it produced but my hands are just not big enough to handle it.  I had hoped it would be the camera to use my M lenses with and I would maybe have purchased the 24-90.  The EVF was everything I expected it to be.  My issue was the stretch to reach the joystick with my thumb, it was ergonomically terrible for me, my small hands just couldn't cope, it felt really awkward.  Also, and I know it shouldn't matter, (but it does), mostly the M lenses just look silly on such a large body whereas they sit nicely on the CL.   Noctilux looked fine.  To me the SL needs it's dedicated lenses, I did try the 23mm and the 18-56TL  but I feel FF sensor needs FF lenses.

Very glad I tried it, and I'm really looking forward to seeing the SL2 and it's styling, but for now I can happily settle with M10 and CL.

 

 

 

 

 

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[IkarusJohn]

I wonder if these discounts reflect a re-alignment of the SL to face off the competition from the other L mount offerings.  At this point, Leica will be wanting new users to buy into Leica’s SL lenses.  Extending the SL life (perhaps offering it in parallel with the SL2?) and offering it at a discount might not be a silly idea - I would expect the marginal cost of continuing the line is relatively small compared to the cost of a new model.

Edited May 24, 2019 by IkarusJohn

[jrp]

I suspect that now that Sony has a respectable range of lenses, the SL is a tough sell against the Sony A7iii, say. I remember when I first got a 24Mpx camera, the Nikon D3x.  It required careful handling because the resolution has so high (double the mainstream).  Nikon and Canon have entered the mirrorless game as has Panasonic.  Assuming that they have, by now, covered development costs, they can afford to reduce the price a bit to encourage people into the system.

The price of SL lenses can be hard to swallow.  But the results they produce are as good as it gets, especially on the Panasonic bodies. Unfortunately, the Leica lenses are rarely reviewed or even mentioned on Panasonic reviews, presumably because reviewers judge that their price limits interest in the lenses beyond a niche crowd,

[rfunnell]

 

I have always been a Leica M lover but the SL with it's wonderful new lenses has really captured my attention.

With ageing eyesight and the quality of the new SL lenses being so good I'm getting much better images and to me that's what its all about.

The price of the SL currently is fantastic for what you get.

I will keep the SL when the SL2 arrives as a second body.

 

[Einst_Stein]

I was wishing a new M form Leica with EVF and L mount and M lens to L adapter.. 

i have SL and M 240. I can use SL with SL lenses, and M lenses on M to L adapter. 

But to be honest, I still prefer M240 with M lenses.

may not be rationale, but what the hack !

[250swb]

20 hours ago, rfunnell said:

 

The price of the SL currently is fantastic for what you get.

Not nearly as fantastic as the price of the Nikon Z7 with which you can use lenses by Nikon, Sony, Leica (L, M, and R), Zeiss, etc. You also get in body stabilisation that works with all lenses, both manual and auto, something the SL.2 needs to have to get even close to the Z7's versatility and IQ but it will never compete on price in a million years.

[thighslapper]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

..... buying anything from Leica has never been a rational economic decision ..... 

[scott kirkpatrick]

On 5/25/2019 at 1:43 AM, jrp said:

The price of SL lenses can be hard to swallow.  But the results they produce are as good as it gets, especially on the Panasonic bodies. Unfortunately, the Leica lenses are rarely reviewed or even mentioned on Panasonic reviews, presumably because reviewers judge that their price limits interest in the lenses beyond a niche crowd,

I suspect the fact that many reviewers are given a kit of camera and lens by the manufacturer might not be a good way to get SL Summicrons and zooms compared with the Panasonic offerings.

[Rupert Greenwell]

On 5/24/2019 at 9:58 PM, Boojay said:

Yes there are deals here in the UK too on the SL and used market prices have dropped significantly.   My M10 has been away at Wetzlar so I decided to dip my toe and purchased a used SL that sadly after a couple of days, I have sent back to the dealer.   No fault of the camera, I loved the files it produced but my hands are just not big enough to handle it.  I had hoped it would be the camera to use my M lenses with and I would maybe have purchased the 24-90.  The EVF was everything I expected it to be.  My issue was the stretch to reach the joystick with my thumb, it was ergonomically terrible for me, my small hands just couldn't cope, it felt really awkward.  Also, and I know it shouldn't matter, (but it does), mostly the M lenses just look silly on such a large body whereas they sit nicely on the CL.   Noctilux looked fine.  To me the SL needs it's dedicated lenses, I did try the 23mm and the 18-56TL  but I feel FF sensor needs FF lenses.

Very glad I tried it, and I'm really looking forward to seeing the SL2 and it's styling, but for now I can happily settle with M10 and CL.

 

 

 

 

 

With hindsight I could have lent you my SL to try as I live near the Shropshire border.  I traded my M240 for a used SL about two years ago (keeping a MP240 which I later traded for a M10). I have quite small hands too and have just checked and yes I have to change the position of my hand on the grip to stretch my thumb to reach the joystick, I also find the bottom right hand button a bit difficult. I still don't know what to make of the SL, I have the 24-90 and 90-280 but have given up trying to get the autofocus to work reliably on certain moving subjects. I prefer using the R lenses plus the Noctilux and M 75mm Lux on the SL.  I also find the EVF to be hopeless in certain bright light such as the early morning or late evening sunlight. Hazy, misty conditions too leave you blind. I have twice boxed it and the lenses up to sell on but had second thoughts and given it a reprieve ! the files are very good but it and the larger lenses are quite a handful compared to the M cameras.

By the way very many thanks for recommending Malcom Taylor, I have now paid a number of visits to him. He has worked his way through servicing and repairing my film cameras and lenses. I find him most fascinating, his work is first class and I have learnt a awful lot from him.

[ron777]

2 hours ago, Rupert Greenwell said:

With hindsight I could have lent you my SL to try as I live near the Shropshire border.  I traded my M240 for a used SL about two years ago (keeping a MP240 which I later traded for a M10). I have quite small hands too and have just checked and yes I have to change the position of my hand on the grip to stretch my thumb to reach the joystick, I also find the bottom right hand button a bit difficult. I still don't know what to make of the SL, I have the 24-90 and 90-280 but have given up trying to get the autofocus to work reliably on certain moving subjects. I prefer using the R lenses plus the Noctilux and M 75mm Lux on the SL.  I also find the EVF to be hopeless in certain bright light such as the early morning or late evening sunlight. Hazy, misty conditions too leave you blind. I have twice boxed it and the lenses up to sell on but had second thoughts and given it a reprieve ! the files are very good but it and the larger lenses are quite a handful compared to the M cameras.

By the way very many thanks for recommending Malcom Taylor, I have now paid a number of visits to him. He has worked his way through servicing and repairing my film cameras and lenses. I find him most fascinating, his work is first class and I have learnt a awful lot from him.

I am pleased to hear that I am not alone in my criticism of the SL's EVF in bright light scenarios.  I reside in South Florida, where the sun shines quite intensely for the better part of the year, and had encountered the same issue as yourself in terms of EVF viewing which, had often (recently sold my SL) been rendered useless.  Many an image's acquisition had been lost due to my inability to view the subject.  I've since moved on to a different body, while maintaining the SL glass.  Whether the SL2 will achieve resolution of this issue, or whether Leica even considers it an issue, remains to be seen. 

Edited May 26, 2019 by ron777

[Boojay]

2 hours ago, Rupert Greenwell said:

With hindsight I could have lent you my SL to try as I live near the Shropshire border.  I traded my M240 for a used SL about two years ago (keeping a MP240 which I later traded for a M10). I have quite small hands too and have just checked and yes I have to change the position of my hand on the grip to stretch my thumb to reach the joystick, I also find the bottom right hand button a bit difficult. I still don't know what to make of the SL, I have the 24-90 and 90-280 but have given up trying to get the autofocus to work reliably on certain moving subjects. I prefer using the R lenses plus the Noctilux and M 75mm Lux on the SL.  I also find the EVF to be hopeless in certain bright light such as the early morning or late evening sunlight. Hazy, misty conditions too leave you blind. I have twice boxed it and the lenses up to sell on but had second thoughts and given it a reprieve ! the files are very good but it and the larger lenses are quite a handful compared to the M cameras.

By the way very many thanks for recommending Malcom Taylor, I have now paid a number of visits to him. He has worked his way through servicing and repairing my film cameras and lenses. I find him most fascinating, his work is first class and I have learnt a awful lot from him.

Kind thought Rupert, thank you for it.   Hopefully the dealer will excuse me for returning the SL, I did buy my 240,  M10, as well as several Leica lenses from him over the last few years, I'm just glad I didn't purchase a new SL because that would have felt bad.   Seems hard to believe (but true), considering how long the SL has been in the market place I have never come across one in anyone's hand, otherwise I would probably have asked if I could try it.  

Like you I find time spent with Malcolm such an education, and totally fascinating.  Not sure I have anything for him to do at the moment but I would like a visit with him anyway just to soak up a little more.

 

 

 

 

[Rupert Greenwell]

There has been so much praise for the EVF in the Sl that I thought that it was me at fault but it is often when the light is quite special during what they call the golden hour when the opportunity for taking interesting photos arises that the EVF lets me down, the Leica Q is not much better either. I find myself using manual focus and the spirit level to frame the shot and hope for the best, you could drive a large truck through the scene and the EVF would not pick it up ! 

  I expect that the SL2 will probably be a improvement but at a price. I too bought the SL without first trying it as sadly my local dealer is no longer allowed to sell Leica. Gone are the days when I was handed a Leica and told to play with it for a few days, he knew what the outcome would be !  I have now had my fingers burnt by three Leica main dealers in the UK, which only leaves a few left. I will follow how the Panasonics turn out as my local dealer is a stockist.

[BernardC]

7 hours ago, thighslapper said:

..... buying anything from Leica has never been a rational economic decision ..... 

I know of many examples of Leica equipment that was used for decades and then resold at break-even, or even at a slight profit, taking inflation into account.

M gear can be free (to a close approximation) in professional use, if you shop wisely. That's certainly not the case with competing systems.

The SL is relatively cheap now, and it may well hold its value in the next few years. Nobody will care in 2022 that the SL is weak at 12,800 ISO, but they will still appreciate the groundbreaking design and excellent ergonomics.

[ru2far2c]

Looking to pick up a SL tomorrow in Munich to go with my M240. I like the way feels in hand. There are a few thing to learn I’m sure. So far I’ve only handled one in the store. For now the plan is to use M lenses only with the SL. Hopefully the learning curve is a shallow one. For me 24 megapixels is perfectly fine. I’m sure the SL2 will be just as nice if not nicer. For me this is a deal with trade I cannot pass up. 

Apparently SL batteries are hard to come by for some reason as are the M to L adaptor by Leica as well.

[tommydom]

12 minutes ago, ru2far2c said:

[...snip...]

Apparently SL batteries are hard to come by for some reason as are the M to L adaptor by Leica as well.

I had an order for an SL battery - it is used by the Leica Q2 as well - from B&H and my order took about 45 days to fill. Patience is a virtue... 

[ru2far2c]

2 hours ago, tommydom said:

I had an order for an SL battery - it is used by the Leica Q2 as well - from B&H and my order took about 45 days to fill. Patience is a virtue... 

Thanks for the heads up. We are on holiday in Germany now. Have checked several places and all are back ordered. For me unfortunately living in Ecuador B&H will not ship it there. So hopefully later this year the demand will drop and they will be back in supply. Planning on visiting the US in September or October or some friends maybe visiting before then and they could mule a battery and few other accessories for me before hand. 😉