Telyt 280 F 4.8 Focusing Issue

[WPCello]

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I just acquired on ebay a Leitz Canada Telyt 280mm f4.8.  The lens is mint.  However, it will not focus properly either on my Visoflex II or on my Leicaflex Standard with the appropriate adapter. The focusing barrel/mechanism seems to function smoothly and without any apparent issues.  Before I contact the seller, I am possibly doing something wrong? 

I will add in here that while I have used Leica M's off and on over the years, this is a first with a Visoflex.

[Susie]

Hi,

Assuming that you are using the correct adapters (16466 on the Viso 11 and 14167 on the Leicaflex) the only thing I can suggest is that the lens head has come sligthly unscrewed from the focusing barrel.  The two come apart so that the lens head can be used on the Televit. 

Just to double check, the 16466 is not the normal screw thread to bayonet adapter - it is thicker to make up the difference between a PLOOT/Viso 1 and the Viso 2 and 3, with a tripod attachment at the bottom.  On the Leicaflex you'll need to use both adapters together.

I would photgraph the set-up for you but my camera is away having a new sensor fitted.  If you look on the Telyt thread in the M lens forum you'll find pictures there.

Susie

[farnz]

This sounds slightly odd to me if you're able to focus other lenses with your Visoflex II but you can't achieve good focus with the 280/4.8 because the Visoflex allows you to look down the optical train so by the time the image focusses in your eye the image of any lens will focus properly on the film too (once the mirror is lifted).  The element that might be at fault would be the Visoflex II but if that's okay with other lenses then that rules out the Visoflex II too.🤔

Pete.

[spydrxx]

This is my setup for your visual reference

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[WPCello]

Attached is a photo of my lens in question.  It appears to vary slightly from the photo in the response.  My lens is the latest and last version with the M mount that includes the tripod mount.  In other words, it will mount directly to the Viso II or the M body directly (I am using an MDa); or for that matter on the Leicaflex with the 14167 adapter.  That said, what I am reading is that I still need the Oubio 16466?  If so, then I am bit further confused since my Telyt 400mm 6.8 connects directly to the Viso II and the 14167 adapter on the Leicaflex and focuses correctly without the Oubio.

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[Susie]

Hi WP.

Yours, like my two are the second version.  Spydrxx has the last version that goes straight onto the Viso 2 and 3.  Yours is designed to go onto a Viso 1, or a Viso 2 using an Oubio.  Looking at your photo, I would say that someone has fitted an ordinary screwmount to bayonet adaptor onto your lens - the thread is the same.  See if the bayonet mount will unscrew - it might be quite tight.  The Oubio/16466 is much thicker.  The lens does indeed have  tripod mounting on it, but so does the Oubio.

Susie

[WPCello]

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It is my understanding that the lens was made in two versions:  11902 Screw; and 11914 bayonet.

 

 

[spydrxx]

After seeing your picture I tend to agree with Susie -I'm convinced  your version has a screw mount fixture to which somebody has attached an adapter (screwmount to M). You need to unscrew the adapter (get a piece of rubber kitchen drawer mat or leather to provide a good firm grip so you don't rip your hand to shreds) and then attach the lens to an OUBIO which will provide the proper spacing and M mount to allow focusing on M bodies.

[WPCello]

Yes, that is apparently the problem here.  I also checked my previously referenced Telyt 400 6.8  and determined that the mount is for Visoflex II only and will not mount directly on an M camera body.

[luigi bertolotti]

Spydrixx is perfectly right : the lens showed by WPCello is clearly a 11912 - the 2nd version of Telyt 280 - which has a Leica screw thread to be mounted on Visoflex I , and needs OUBIO ring to be mounted (and focused correctly) on Viso II/III : the M adapter that clearly is visible onto its screw mount must be removed : it hasn't any sense.

The first version 11902 was quite different in design, but based on the same principle - Viso I direct mount, Viso II/II with OUBIO,; it's only the version 3 (11914) that has an M bayonet to fit directly Viso II/III : this is the version depicted by Spydrixx (and in turn it has some minor variants in finishing, but always coded as 11914 : for completness, there existed also the 11904 which is the lenshead only of 11914, available in this form to be mounted on Televit quick focusing system)

The Telyt 400 6,8 is like the version 3 of Telyt 280, in this respect : direct mount on Viso II/III, so not focusing if you mount directly on a M body (on digital Ms with EVF, you can use the Novoflex LEM/VIS ring to "add" the length of the Viso II/III). 

The difference is that the 400 6,8, as its brother 560 6,8, was made also in a version with Leicaflex R mount (a bit "longer" than the Viso mount) , while 280 was never made in R mount.

I use my 280 rather frequently (on Televit - it handles fine, though heavy) : it's a good performer, but focusing is  someway critical wide open… I even have the feel of a certain focus shift… fact is that instead of focusing wide open and then close a bit, now I prefer (with M240 and EVF) to focus at real closure… at the end, I end with using it, most of times and if possible, at f8 as a good compromise between sureness of focus and clear view in EVF.

Edited February 19, 2019 by luigi bertolotti

[Susie]

Well, your lens looks identical to mine except for the very narrow bayonet ring, and mine needs an oubio to work.  The distance from the rear of the focusing ring (where the white DOF lines meet the distance ring, if you see what I mean) should be in to order of 46mm.  If yours measures about 25mm to the mating face of the bayonet, then it is as I said above - someone has put a screw  to bayonet adaptor on by mistake.

Susie

[WPCello]

After checking serial nos. etc., my lens is a 11912; manufactured in 1965.  So the M mount was mistakenly added, which gives the impression of the lens being a later version.  I cannot by hand remove the offending mount.  Looks like a trip to Camera Techs here in Seattle.  I just hope no damage was done as the lens otherwise is pristine.

Thanks all.

[spydrxx]

I doubt the adapter was mistakenly added...the previous owner, I'm sure, had a reason for adding it...probably to use the lens on a non-Leica SLR, without the Visoflex but perhaps with a Leica M->whatever camera adapter, or on a SLR/DSLR body which had been converted to accept M Mount lenses.

[luigi bertolotti]

15 hours ago, spydrxx said:

I doubt the adapter was mistakenly added...the previous owner, I'm sure, had a reason for adding it...probably to use the lens on a non-Leica SLR, without the Visoflex but perhaps with a Leica M->whatever camera adapter, or on a SLR/DSLR body which had been converted to accept M Mount lenses.

That's looks logical… but strange  : a Viso I lens with a M adapter is a non-standard combo in terms of flange distance…. no adapter in the market (Fotodiox, Leinox, Metabones… dozens exist..) provides such kind of coupling to some SLR Mount… (they provide adapters for M Mount to some other Mount … but of course implying the usage of a standard M lens made for a M body)…  well, of course if one gets some M to SLR adapter and puts a bellows in the middle…. …  but with a long/heavy lens like this is a damn oddity (the "bellows" speculation has came to my mind because, oddly enough, you can mount the lenshead of the Telyt 280 V3 on the Leitz bellows II... odd also this, but with a reasonable focusing range…)

Anyway… be sure that with proper force/torque you'll find the way to unscrew it… the problem is how to APPLY the needed force (years ago, in such a task, I cut to blood my hand… M bayonet blades ARE blades… )

 

 

Edited February 20, 2019 by luigi bertolotti

[farnz]

2 hours ago, luigi bertolotti said:

the problem is how to APPLY the needed force

I would mount the M-mount rear lens cap as normal and apply a strap wrench if more force than can be exerted by the hands is needed.

Pete.

[pico]

12 minutes ago, farnz said:

I would mount the M-mount rear lens cap as normal and apply a strap wrench if more force than can be exerted by the hands is needed.

Pete.

I'm lost here but if the problem is removing a screw-mount adapter then some M rear lens caps have three expressions on their bottom sides that were designed to fit perfectly into an adapter to facilitate its removal.

[farnz]

4 minutes ago, pico said:

I'm lost here but if the problem is removing a screw-mount adapter then some M rear lens caps have three expressions on their bottom sides that were designed to fit perfectly into an adapter to facilitate its removal.

Hi, Jac,

I have one or two of those too but I don't think they'll work in this case because the LTM-M adaptor is semi-fused to the the lens's screw mount so only the 'sharp' M-mount side of the adaptor is exposed.

Pete.

[TomB_tx]

The nubs on the M cap were to remove the adapter from the camera body if the ltm lens first unscrewed from the adapter.

[jaapv]

I would use something like a scrap Visoflex body to unscrew the adapter.

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[luigi bertolotti]

9 hours ago, jaapv said:

I would use something like a scrap Visoflex body to unscrew the adapter.

Brilliant idea … didn't think of… the plastic of back caps can be easily broken if "fusing" of the adapter is strong