Ecar Posted February 22, 2018 Share #1 Posted February 22, 2018 Advertisement (gone after registration) I just found (yet another...) 'Made in Germany' 35/1.4 v2 (11870). S/N is 3433XXX, which indicates that its birth date was sometime in 1987 if I'm not mistaken. It comes in its original box, with matching serial on the sticker. Interestingly, however, the writing on the box says 'Made in Canada'. I know it was some kind of a transition period for Leica, with parts from Canada being sent back to Germany, but it's the first time I see such a lens/box mismatch. Out of curiosity, a quick question for the experts here: have you seen this before? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted February 22, 2018 Posted February 22, 2018 Hi Ecar, Take a look here Summilux 35mm Pre-ASPH lens/box mismatch. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
DickieT Posted February 22, 2018 Share #2 Posted February 22, 2018 Not claiming to be an expert but I can certainly look on my box and see what it say.. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted February 22, 2018 Share #3 Posted February 22, 2018 (edited) I have a similar situatuion : Elmarit 28 1st type, Wetzlar, with "Made in Canada / Fabrique au Canada" box... and the Elmarit 28 1st was a mixed Canadian/German item like the last Summilux 35 (and your lens belongs to the timeframe of the switch Ontario to Wetzlar) Imho, the logical reason is one : I don't think Leitz had an in-house cardboard Printing/manufacturing dept. ...boxes were outsourced somewhere, and being a rather "cheap" component, they were ordered in rather big batches, delivered in advance to some central warehouse... in modern manufacturing Language, box is not a "just in time" component... the "economical batch" of boxes was determined not strictly dependent on the planned batches of lenses (which for both Elmarit 28 and Summilux 35 were NOT big batches) : the switch from one factory to the other for the manufacturing of a complete lens was surely a much more critical process... the "last mile" of feeding the manufacturing line with boxes was accomplished using the boxes available in the warehouse, and this brought to some mismatches (intentional or not, but anyway "un-managed" , as a minor issue) Edited February 22, 2018 by luigi bertolotti 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted February 22, 2018 Share #4 Posted February 22, 2018 I just found (yet another...) 'Made in Germany' 35/1.4 v2 (11870). S/N is 3433XXX, which indicates that its birth date was sometime in 1987 if I'm not mistaken. It comes in its original box, with matching serial on the sticker. Interestingly, however, the writing on the box says 'Made in Canada'. What is the printing on the lens? Canada or Germany? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecar Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share #5 Posted February 23, 2018 I have a similar situatuion : Elmarit 28 1st type, Wetzlar, with "Made in Canada / Fabrique au Canada" box... and the Elmarit 28 1st was a mixed Canadian/German item like the last Summilux 35 (and your lens belongs to the timeframe of the switch Ontario to Wetzlar) Imho, the logical reason is one : I don't think Leitz had an in-house cardboard Printing/manufacturing dept. ...boxes were outsourced somewhere, and being a rather "cheap" component, they were ordered in rather big batches, delivered in advance to some central warehouse... in modern manufacturing Language, box is not a "just in time" component... the "economical batch" of boxes was determined not strictly dependent on the planned batches of lenses (which for both Elmarit 28 and Summilux 35 were NOT big batches) : the switch from one factory to the other for the manufacturing of a complete lens was surely a much more critical process... the "last mile" of feeding the manufacturing line with boxes was accomplished using the boxes available in the warehouse, and this brought to some mismatches (intentional or not, but anyway "un-managed" , as a minor issue) Grazie, Luigi. I think you may be right. Or perhaps they were moving production from Canada to Germany at the time, had spare boxes lying around and decided to ship them along? What is the printing on the lens? Canada or Germany? 'Made in Germany'. Else it wouldn't be so unusual, I guess. And the sticker with the S/N is perfect, not like it's been taken from a box and attached to another. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted February 23, 2018 Share #6 Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) Grazie, Luigi. I think you may be right. Or perhaps they were moving production from Canada to Germany at the time, had spare boxes lying around and decided to ship them along? Yes... your hipotesis, at the end, is quite similar to mine... all a matter of "availability at warehouse"... for people that works (like me) around manufacturing concerns, is a typical situation : imagine that you (production manager) have already shifted manufacturing to Wetzlar... Canada has still 50/100 "Canada boxes"... you have ordered to your provider a significant batch of "German boxes" (3000 with a certain scheduling ? ... see in our Wiki the planned batches of Summilux for 1987/88/89) but the first delivery hasn't yet been made, and you have some orders to fulfill : what do you do ? Call Ontario and ask them "send me xx boxes, please". Edited February 23, 2018 by luigi bertolotti 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecar Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share #7 Posted February 23, 2018 Advertisement (gone after registration) Yes... your hipotesis, at the end, is quite similar to mine... all a matter of "availability at warehouse"... for people that works (like me) around manufacturing concerns, is a typical situation : imagine that you (production manager) have already shifted manufacturing to Wetzlar... Canada has still 50/100 "Canada boxes"... you have ordered to your provider a significant batch of "German boxes" (3000 ? see in our Wiki the planned batches of Summilux for 1987/88/89) but the first delivery hasn't yet been made, and you have some orders to fulfill : what do you do ? Call Ontario and ask them "send me xx boxes, please". Indeed. I suppose 30 years ago people were more relaxed about country of origin regulations and labeling... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted February 23, 2018 Share #8 Posted February 23, 2018 (edited) Indeed. I suppose 30 years ago people were more relaxed about country of origin regulations and labeling... That's a good point : probably TODAY such a delivery scope, with a not so clear "country of origin" statement, could be even illegal... (*) globalization has made world more and more complex... (*) This year I bought a pair of new ski gloves : a typical Austrian brand... and label with a clear "made in Vietnam"... what if should they had been presented in a fine box with "made in Austria" written onto, with the "made in Vietnam" gloves inside ? Edited February 23, 2018 by luigi bertolotti 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DickieT Posted February 23, 2018 Share #9 Posted February 23, 2018 My serial is 308xxxx and both lens and box say Made in Canada. No confusion 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecar Posted February 23, 2018 Author Share #10 Posted February 23, 2018 My serial is 308xxxx and both lens and box say Made in Canada. No confusion Thanx for looking. I guess I found another Leica oddity. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted February 23, 2018 Share #11 Posted February 23, 2018 Summilux 1.4, Canada # 2289967 - with tab & infinity lock. An oddity? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted February 24, 2018 Share #12 Posted February 24, 2018 The oddity is that I have a very close one... 2290026 (Canada, tab & infinity lock) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecar Posted August 26, 2020 Author Share #13 Posted August 26, 2020 (edited) I'm now planning to sell the lens that prompted this thread in the first place and was looking at eBay to get an indication of current market prices. Interestingly, I found another one of those oddities - identical to mine (serial numbers are only about 100 units apart) i.e., Made in Germany with matching serial number on Canadian box - that was sold a couple of weeks ago: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Leica-Summilux-M-35-mm-f-1-4-MADE-IN-GERMANY-11870-pre-asph-with-box-2/114326097715?hash=item1a9e5dcf33:g:kY4AAOSw8nte0tVD Edited August 26, 2020 by Ecar Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
petard Posted February 18 Share #14 Posted February 18 (edited) Just to chime on this old thread, recently bought a Summilux that has "Made in Germany" engraved on the lens but the box is the Canadian version. Serial on the box and the lens match as well (343xxxx). I noticed Leitz written on the front ring like the Canadian version while the later German versions have Leica printed on them. My version does have the issue of not fitting on a digital body which according the manual is limited to the Made in Canada version. Aside from this, does anyone know what the technical differences (if any) are between the Canadian-German and German versions? Edited February 18 by petard Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted February 19 Share #15 Posted February 19 (edited) Can you please post a picture of the back of your lens, a view similar to this one ? Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! The front of your lens ought to be of this kind, I suppose : Edited February 19 by luigi bertolotti Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! The front of your lens ought to be of this kind, I suppose : ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/282075-summilux-35mm-pre-asph-lensbox-mismatch/?do=findComment&comment=5759790'>More sharing options...
petard Posted February 19 Share #16 Posted February 19 Yes the front looks like the one you posted. Here is the picture from the back: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/282075-summilux-35mm-pre-asph-lensbox-mismatch/?do=findComment&comment=5759981'>More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted February 19 Share #17 Posted February 19 (edited) Thanks ! Indeed, such an item (like the my one I posted) can work on a digital M... years ago there was an in-depth thread on this matter. Edited February 19 by luigi bertolotti Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
UliWer Posted February 20 Share #18 Posted February 20 vor 12 Stunden schrieb luigi bertolotti: can work on a digital M... It depends on the model. With the M8, M9 and M (Typ 240) the „collar“ around the rear element may touch the sides of the camera‘s „throat“. The bayonet of the M10, 11 has a protruding ring with which the lenses rear has more space inside, so it won‘t touch. Leica offerered to change the older Canadian or early German versions by shorting the rear „collar“, so there may be older versions which work without problem with all digital models. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted February 20 Share #19 Posted February 20 (edited) 3 hours ago, UliWer said: It depends on the model. With the M8, M9 and M (Typ 240) the „collar“ around the rear element may touch the sides of the camera‘s „throat“. The bayonet of the M10, 11 has a protruding ring with which the lenses rear has more space inside, so it won‘t touch. Leica offerered to change the older Canadian or early German versions by shorting the rear „collar“, so there may be older versions which work without problem with all digital models. Yes, You have made me to remember that old thread... but I think that the collar was someway a manufacturing component maybe not always exactly the same (a "fine tuning" device inserted at the final QC test ? related to real focal length ?)... fact is that my very old chrome Lux never had problems on my M8 and my current M240. Edited February 20 by luigi bertolotti 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
UliWer Posted February 20 Share #20 Posted February 20 The „collar“ looks as if it served as a shield against reflections coming from the camera‘s interior and hitting the lenses rear element. Perhaps during the late Canadian phase of production they made it as long as possible for higher effectivity which was too long for the narrower digital bodies. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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