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Using a flash with the SL...

Dr. G

By Dr. G
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Dr. G

Dr. G

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Let me preface this by saying I've never used a flash before.  I was always in the mindset that I could correct underexposed portions of an image in LR.  A friend of mine is a professional photographer and was explaining to me how he used to be of the same mindset but a number of years ago started using a flash off camera to get much better results while maintaing a natural look to his images.  

 

I'm going to be travelling in a few weeks and already know that I'm going to need to use a fill flash for an outdoor event I'll be covering.  The event is taking place in the late morning and the sun will be behind my subjects.  I know this because last year I was at the event and ended up with underexposed images of my subjects' faces.  I'll need a flash that can provide good fill in.  I'm looking at the SF40 and SF64.  I've read mixed reviews about the power of the SF40.  Obviously it is not as large as the SF64 but, ultimately, image quality is more important.  I'm already carrying the SL with either the 24-90 or the Summilux-SL 50, so comapctness isn't exactly a priority.

 

Any advice would be appreciated.

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Einst_Stein

Einst_Stein

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For outdoors fill in, I don't feel it needs sophisticated flash. Any simple flash with built in sensor works fine, better if it comes with light control such as 1/2, 1/4, 1/16.

 

I am using Leica Mini flash , the one for 5he old Leica Mini P&S film. It is small and enough for fill in. I also like the old Olympus 32. The Contax 280 has strength control and leave it to 1/4 almost cover all fill in. All can be have for less than US$30.

 

I have Metz 58 with Leica Adapter (3502 0r 3802, don't have it with me now). It used to work well with M9 but not so on SL.

 

If for sophisticated events, such as wedding, I would get a Quantum, otherwise, for outdoors fill in, think any cheappy semi auto is enough.

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Let me preface this by saying I've never used a flash before.   ... I'm going to be travelling in a few weeks and already know that I'm going to need to use a fill flash for an outdoor event I'll be covering. ...

In this particular case I'd think that acquiring the experience before the event might be more important than choosing one of several serviceable flash guns.

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Dr. G

Dr. G

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In this particular case I'd think that acquiring the experience before the event might be more important than choosing one of several serviceable flash guns.

 

I agree, which is why I'm trying to make the proper decision so I can spend some time using the flash over the next couple of weeks.

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LocalHero1953

LocalHero1953

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I have the SF64. My only advice would be: if you want TTL, then the SF64 (or another Leica flash) is your only option.

If you don't want TTL, then pick one powerful enough for your purpose that has a good interface: for events, a quick, intuitive interface is as important for a flash as for a camera.

And the SF64 interface is a slow PITA IMO!

Edited by LocalHero1953
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sillbeers15

sillbeers15

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Let me preface this by saying I've never used a flash before.  I was always in the mindset that I could correct underexposed portions of an image in LR.  A friend of mine is a professional photographer and was explaining to me how he used to be of the same mindset but a number of years ago started using a flash off camera to get much better results while maintaing a natural look to his images.  

 

I'm going to be travelling in a few weeks and already know that I'm going to need to use a fill flash for an outdoor event I'll be covering.  The event is taking place in the late morning and the sun will be behind my subjects.  I know this because last year I was at the event and ended up with underexposed images of my subjects' faces.  I'll need a flash that can provide good fill in.  I'm looking at the SF40 and SF64.  I've read mixed reviews about the power of the SF40.  Obviously it is not as large as the SF64 but, ultimately, image quality is more important.  I'm already carrying the SL with either the 24-90 or the Summilux-SL 50, so comapctness isn't exactly a priority.

 

Any advice would be appreciated.

 

I'm not sure about the size of the event you said you intend to cover? I've learn to befriend the practice of fill in flash for outdoor when the subject happens to be people. I use off camera flash mostly and have found the cheapest method of a flash extention cord (Nikon pin layout) to extend my SF58 off camera attached to a self stick. My SF58 is set to TTL-HSS with 1 & half stops lower on the flash while my SL is set on M mode & spot metering (for me to point the AF & exposure locked on the face). Below is an example of a family portrait/snapshot of my wife and daughter. You would not even realise that a flash was fired from my left hand stretched (plus selfi stick extention of 0.7M) holding onto my flash fired. I set the exposure on my SL against the ambient light. Knowing the show background will mean I get my subjects underexposed if I did not fill in with a flash.

38358516395_b48d8990ec_k.jpgL1050136 by sillbeers15

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RoySmith

RoySmith

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I have the SF64. My only advice would be: if you want TTL, then the SF64 (or another Leica flash) is your only option.

If you don't want TTL, then pick one powerful enough for your purpose that has a good interface: for events, a quick, intuitive interface is as important for a flash as for a camera.

And the SF64 interface is a slow PITA IMO!

 

 

+1

 

The SF64 on the camera is high enough that I don't see red-eye - but the lighting is flat.  The lighting will be more natural if you move it further away as sillbeers15 suggests.

There is a nice comparison of the SF40 and SF64 here. A wireless solution from Leica is overdue.

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LocalHero1953

LocalHero1953

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+1

 

The SF64 on the camera is high enough that I don't see red-eye - but the lighting is flat.  The lighting will be more natural if you move it further away as sillbeers15 suggests.

There is a nice comparison of the SF40 and SF64 here. A wireless solution from Leica is overdue.

Leica should do the same as Hasselblad has done with the X1D: buy into Nikon's flash ecosystem. 

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meerec

meerec

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Seems to me the Nikon-pin-type flashes work with all my Leica cameras: Q, SL, CL as well as my Hasselblad H5D-50C so I couldn’t be happier. For example I use Profoto B2 and A1, on camera and off camera, on all those cameras.

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LocalHero1953

LocalHero1953

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Seems to me the Nikon-pin-type flashes work with all my Leica cameras: Q, SL, CL as well as my Hasselblad H5D-50C so I couldn’t be happier. For example I use Profoto B2 and A1, on camera and off camera, on all those cameras.

Yes, the cameras will all trigger the flash, which is fine for A (autothyristor) and M mode on the flash, but they won't work in TTL mode, nor will the camera communicate aperture and ISO to the flash, which would make A mode use quick and simple.

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sillbeers15

sillbeers15

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Seems to me the Nikon-pin-type flashes work with all my Leica cameras: Q, SL, CL as well as my Hasselblad H5D-50C so I couldn’t be happier. For example I use Profoto B2 and A1, on camera and off camera, on all those cameras.

 

It is a damn pity Leica stil cannot offer a wireless trigger TTL-HSS solution till date. I'm really impressed with the Profoto A1 lighting system concept of a small yet powerful lighting solution good for travelling. There are lots of big and powerful strobe solutions out there suitable for photographic jobs and especially commercials but the solution is irrelvent to travelers on the go wanting to apply lighting solution. This is my 'hate' part of my relationship with Leica.

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meerec

meerec

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Yes, the cameras will all trigger the flash, which is fine for A (autothyristor) and M mode on the flash, but they won't work in TTL mode, nor will the camera communicate aperture and ISO to the flash, which would make A mode use quick and simple.

Couldn’t care less about these things. It was important in the age of film. In the digital era, it takes me 2 shots to evaluate exposure and nail it by reviewing the image. Something you couldn’t do with film. I shoot in manual mode with flash / strobe / moonlight.

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meerec

meerec

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It is a damn pity Leica stil cannot offer a wireless trigger TTL-HSS solution till date. I'm really impressed with the Profoto A1 lighting system concept of a small yet powerful lighting solution good for travelling. There are lots of big and powerful strobe solutions out there suitable for photographic jobs and especially commercials but the solution is irrelvent to travelers on the go wanting to apply lighting solution. This is my 'hate' part of my relationship with Leica.

What do you miss? I don’t think you miss TTL much, do you?

As for HSS, yes it would be useful to shoot at high shutter speeds rather than 1/250s only. But that’s ok, I can live without.

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sillbeers15

sillbeers15

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What do you miss? I don’t think you miss TTL much, do you?

As for HSS, yes it would be useful to shoot at high shutter speeds rather than 1/250s only. But that’s ok, I can live without.

 

You are correct, I do not miss TTL, it is more HSS that I would like to have as there are lots of creative things that could be done with it available. I've been trying to crack the sync speed of 1/180sec by utilising the HSR mode of PW Plus IIIs and following some youtube claim of setting normal speed lites to full power on manual,...till date I could only acheive moderate results of triggering wireless @ manual mode up to sync speed of 1/400sec. Not the 1/8000sec claimed by some. So still miss the wireless triggering HSS flash!

Edited by sillbeers15
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lx1713

lx1713

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Let me preface this by saying I've never used a flash before.  I was always in the mindset that I could correct underexposed portions of an image in LR.  A friend of mine is a professional photographer and was explaining to me how he used to be of the same mindset but a number of years ago started using a flash off camera to get much better results while maintaing a natural look to his images.  

 

I'm going to be travelling in a few weeks and already know that I'm going to need to use a fill flash for an outdoor event I'll be covering.  The event is taking place in the late morning and the sun will be behind my subjects.  I know this because last year I was at the event and ended up with underexposed images of my subjects' faces.  I'll need a flash that can provide good fill in.  I'm looking at the SF40 and SF64.  I've read mixed reviews about the power of the SF40.  Obviously it is not as large as the SF64 but, ultimately, image quality is more important.  I'm already carrying the SL with either the 24-90 or the Summilux-SL 50, so comapctness isn't exactly a priority.

 

Any advice would be appreciated.

A little late to chime in. 

For simplicity and because of your inexperience: 

 

Shoot RAW.

Over expose slightly when back lit.

Use the zoom if you use flash.

Stay at 24-50mm focal length. 

Stay within 1-3 meters

 

Take your time. 

Shoot on manual, say f5.6 to f8. At a comfortable ISO (50 -400, I guess) and shutter speed for the situation.

Test your shots first before drawing attention for a pose.

 

If your shutter speed goes up above 1/250, SF64 will switch to HSS so don’t worry just roll your shutter speed to control your ambient exposure and let the flash exposure stay at f5.6 - 8.0 and ISO setting.

 

Set exposure compensation to -1.5 to -3 just to fill gently. Or a manual setting. Test first.

 

To have a little off center flash. Rotate the flash head left or right and bounce off a card. If you hate the flash fill look add a warm filter to the flash. It’s a little tedious but it can be nice.

 

 

As this is your first time with the flash, don’t be too disappointed with the results because the degree of fill is a taste thing.

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meerec

meerec

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You are correct, I do not miss TTL, it is more HSS that I would like to have as there are lots of creative things that could be done with it available. I've been trying to crack the sync speed of 1/180sec by utilising the HSR mode of PW Plus IIIs and following some youtube claim of setting normal speed lites to full power on manual,...till date I could only acheive moderate results of triggering wireless @ manual mode up to sync speed of 1/400sec. Not the 1/8000sec claimed by some. So still miss the wireless triggering HSS flash!

For HSS I use another camera. Like the Q or H5D.

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