Interesting M10 Discussion with Stefan Daniel and Jesko von Oeynhausen

[cookedart]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

http://www.reddotforum.com/content/2017/02/the-leica-m10-a-discussion-with-stefan-daniel-and-jesko-von-oeynhausen/

I know this on another forum, but some interesting stuff here. Some of the more interesting stuff for the TLDR types:

 

On the M10 running hot:
 

you can see that there’s not much air left inside the camera. It’s really full, full, full – packed. So, measures have been taken on the power management. That is one part to reduce heat. For example, we switch on the sensor only when it’s really needed.

 

On a Fuji style hybrid EVF/OVF viewfinder:

we had a pre-development project to analyze that and it was a dead end. It would have been a so-so finder, a so-so rangefinder and a medium quality EVF panel.

 

On fewer buttons:

Many users were never able to remember the position for six different buttons.

 

On menus:

We would have liked to have no menu at all, but we figured out we can’t live without one.

 

On the new viewfinder:

But for the M10, everything was reworked: the prisms, the coatings, the optical calculations for the distance measuring path has all been revised. It has been mechanically re-engineered to give better stability, better precision, and the windows in the front and the rear of the rangefinder have been enlarged to create a greater view. [...] This is probably the nicest optical viewfinder we’ve ever made.

 

On developing a new EVF:

So, we decided to keep it (the visoflex 020) and to be honest there’s a bit of R&D money saved by not developing one from scratch. A lot, actually.

 

On using the SL Viewfinder as the external EVF:

Jesko: But this would have been huge to put in an accessory.

Stefan: Look at the size of the eyecup of the SL. The panel itself is a huge thing, especially compared to what we have in the Visoflex, and already that is not such a small finder.

 

On a silver EVF and on materials in general:

Silver painted plastic is kind of a no-go because it then pretends to be metal, but it’s not. This looks like plastic and it is plastic, so if something looks like metal, it should be metal.

 

On color shift:

But I can tell you if you’re interested. If you look at the RAW files, the uncalibrated RAW files, from certain lenses that are critical, they have much less color shift or other issues, so the sensor is really solid. For users, it’s still interesting if they use Voightlander lenses for example. They might be much more usable now with this camera.

Stefan: Maybe we shouldn’t say that… *laughing*

 

On the new shutter:

No. The shutter is a new development as well because it’s another challenge for the thinner body. So, the shutter has been reduced in size. That’s, by the way, the reason why the M10 doesn’t do 11 frames per second like the SL.

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[LocalHero1953]

A good read.

 

One area they are unclear on is EVF blackout. They appear to be saying that this is a limitation of the EVF itself, not the processor or the shutter. I have not yet tried it in the flesh, and I get it that new owners are happy with the blackout being much less than the M240, but I suspect that coming from the SL I will still be disappointed with the blackout, and there is apparently no prospect of a new EVF any time soon.

 

Another aspect not covered at all is the likelihood of an electronic (silent) shutter appearing in firmware.

[scott kirkpatrick]

I started purchasing R telephotos when the 240 arrived, was not happy with the long blackout while trying to use them on the 240, and very plesed with the way the SL makes them usable.  It will be interesting to see if with the better view that the 020 provides and the quicker shutter operation on the M10, it will make sense to use live view with the M10 for, say 18 and 21 mm, and 80-100mm again.  Certainly, the rangefinder coupling of the 18 and 21 for focusing, combined with the accurate framing of the 020 makes good sense.  For the short telephotos, that will require focusing over live view, I am more skeptical.

 

scott

[UliWer]

...

Another aspect not covered at all is the likelihood of an electronic (silent) shutter appearing in firmware.

In another interview with the French publication "Les Numeriques" Mr. Daniel said, it was possible with a future firmware update - if there was "strong demand" from customers.

[digitalfx]

A good read.

 

One area they are unclear on is EVF blackout. They appear to be saying that this is a limitation of the EVF itself, not the processor or the shutter. I have not yet tried it in the flesh, and I get it that new owners are happy with the blackout being much less than the M240, but I suspect that coming from the SL I will still be disappointed with the blackout, and there is apparently no prospect of a new EVF any time soon.

 

Another aspect not covered at all is the likelihood of an electronic (silent) shutter appearing in firmware.

 

 

 

The blackout is still an issue IMO. Ive read all the reviews glowing about how much its improved, but it still has a long way to go.

Shooting with the EVF is extremely slow and frustrating IMO.

 

I hope Leica introduces an improved EVF that solves this issue...but if you read the full article, it seems to suggest this isn't going to happen.

[skanga]

http://www.reddotforum.com/content/2017/02/the-leica-m10-a-discussion-with-stefan-daniel-and-jesko-von-oeynhausen/

 

I know this on another forum, but some interesting stuff here. Some of the more interesting stuff for the TLDR types:

 

On the M10 running hot:

 

 

On a Fuji style hybrid EVF/OVF viewfinder:

 

On fewer buttons:

 

On menus:

 

On the new viewfinder:

 

On developing a new EVF:

 

On using the SL Viewfinder as the external EVF:

 

On a silver EVF and on materials in general:

 

On color shift:

 

On the new shutter:

 

Yes this was a good interview. I do hope it answers the questions many people seem to have so they don't have to keep fussing about spirit levels, hybrid rangefinders, EVFs etc., and allows them to just go out and shoot. I'm glad that Leica are trying to keep the M cameras simple and close to the original M philosophy as possible but as a digital camera. There are so many great cameras available that do have evf, video, spirit levels, touch screens. If that's what you need you have a lot of choice.

[Dirk Mandeville]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Yes this was a good interview. I do hope it answers the questions many people seem to have, and they don't have to keep fussing about spirit levels, hybrid rangefinders, EVFs etc., and allows them to just go out and shoot. I'm glad that Laica are trying to keep the M cameras simple and close to the original M philosophy as possible but as a digital camera. There are so many great cameras available that do have evf, video, spirit levels, touch screens. If that's what you need you have a lot of choice.

What you call fussing, others would label earnest discussion. Having a good discussion about missing wanted features and potential future upgrades and innovations is healthy, educational, and enjoyable. It is also important for Leica to get feedback on what their customers are thinking. How boring would the forum be if all everyone did was heap praise on Leica's latest product? Critical analysis and discussion of varying perspectives is quite a bit more useful. And besides, who says we can't do that and go out and shoot too?

[skanga]

What you call fussing, others would label earnest discussion. Having a good discussion about missing wanted features and potential future upgrades and innovations is healthy, educational, and enjoyable. It is also important for Leica to get feedback on what their customers are thinking. How boring would the forum be if all everyone did was heap praise on Leica's latest product? Critical analysis and discussion of varying perspectives is quite a bit more useful. And besides, who says we can't do that and go out and shoot too?

Hi Dirk,

I agree, critical analysis and indeed constructive criticism is very important. What I meant was that there seem to be very many posts about missing features in Leica M cameras, and I hope the responses by Stephan Daniel and Jesko von Oeyhausen go a long way towards answering those questions or clarifying their position regarding the M cameras. Thanks, Sam

[Paul J]

It seems odd to me that they would create such a thorough interview and not mention lack of tether, how all of a sudden some people are locked out from the system, how they will develop the wifi with any desktop application etc.

 

Also I found the usual sales speak, which was followed by an excuse for the sales speak that anyone who knows better knows it isn't sales speak - lol. That is so untrue. But at least it was tempered with truth "we used the technology at hand"

 

It is exceptionally frustrating. I want this camera, it is better in every way, they have created an incredible thing but no tether means it is the end of the road for me. It is basic and fundamental functionality that I can not do without.

[cookedart]

It seems odd to me that they would create such a thorough interview and not mention lack of tether, how all of a sudden some people are locked out from the system, how they will develop the wifi with any desktop application etc.

 

Also I found the usual sales speak, which was followed by an excuse for the sales speak that anyone who knows better knows it isn't sales speak - lol. That is so untrue. But at least it was tempered with truth "we used the technology at hand"

 

It is exceptionally frustrating. I want this camera, it is better in every way, they have created an incredible thing but no tether means it is the end of the road for me. It is basic and fundamental functionality that I can not do without.

I agree it's unfortunate. They could have gone one way and enabled live view tethering over USB like Canon does. Unfortunately you're right, they're pushing the M away from this which means it's less positioned as a studio camera. Leica expects these users to go for the SL, likely.