jmahto Posted January 26, 2017 Share #101 Posted January 26, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) I also use Auto ISO most of the time. Even when I am changing f and t manually. With auto ISO capped to acceptable high value (3200 for M240 in my case), I can shoot confidently that lowest ISO is chosen. If I get M10, then ISO knob will have the only function of looking good. But I don't mind that since looking good is an important part of M. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 26, 2017 Posted January 26, 2017 Hi jmahto, Take a look here Bad M10 ISO dial is bad. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
digitalfx Posted January 26, 2017 Share #102 Posted January 26, 2017 The problem with Auto ISO on the M10 is that you don't know what the camera chose until you look at the data on the image. I know everyone likes a clean OVF...but I would love to have more info while shooting. I want complete control of ISO, auto is a great option, but only if you know what the camera is doing. This is why I love the new ISO dial...I now have completely control and know at a glance exactly where my ISO is set. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Ash Posted January 26, 2017 Share #103 Posted January 26, 2017 The problem that I have with auto-Iso is that I tend to permanently adapt the upper limit. I think the Iso dial is way easier and better. Gesendet von iPhone mit Tapatalk Pro Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted January 26, 2017 Share #104 Posted January 26, 2017 I never use auto ISO but I may be missing a trick. I generally use manual controls, and occasionally aperture priority. I regularly take photos in low light and find that if the light is poor, especially when artificial light is involved, the meter is not nearly as reliable or useful as it is in decent light. So if I used auto ISO I'd have to constantly keep an eye on the ISO setting selected by the camera and make an adjustments to exposure; aperture, shutter speed, or exposure compensation, assuming it works with auto ISO. (Obviously, increasing ISO would normally be a last resort. ) All this would achieve would effectively be to switch the ISO setting from the screen (on my M240) to the shutter speed dial, the aperture ring or, if it works, the EC wheel, all perfectly convenient. So creating another dial seems redundant to me. I'm missing something though, because you wouldn't be using auto ISO unless it conferred some advantage that eluded me. Any help please? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke_Miller Posted January 26, 2017 Share #105 Posted January 26, 2017 I use Auto ISO regularly, but not exclusively. Typically I will be in Manual and set aperture and shutter speed to values that are appropriate to the subject. If I have a dynamic subject at an event, for example. I might want 1/125 to stop subject motion and f5.6 for a reasonable DOF. Auto ISO with a max ceiling that I am comfortable with (3200 on my M-240, higher on my M-246) allows me to shoot quickly and not have to worry about exposure. Just as with Aperture priority I have to be alert to situations that will fool the meter. In that case I will pan away from the light, window, etc. and lock exposure with a half press of the shutter and then re-compose. Works very nicely when you want to work quickly, but not necessary for many situations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmahto Posted January 26, 2017 Share #106 Posted January 26, 2017 I use Auto ISO regularly, but not exclusively. Typically I will be in Manual and set aperture and shutter speed to values that are appropriate to the subject. If I have a dynamic subject at an event, for example. I might want 1/125 to stop subject motion and f5.6 for a reasonable DOF. Auto ISO with a max ceiling that I am comfortable with (3200 on my M-240, higher on my M-246) allows me to shoot quickly and not have to worry about exposure. Just as with Aperture priority I have to be alert to situations that will fool the meter. In that case I will pan away from the light, window, etc. and lock exposure with a half press of the shutter and then re-compose. Works very nicely when you want to work quickly, but not necessary for many situations. +1 I also use the technique of pointing the camera someplace else (of desired brightness) to lock the exposure and bring back and shoot. Very few times I can't use the above technique and I have to manually force the ISO down (by taking off auto) so that it doesn't overexpose. Shooting stage performance is one such example where bright lights on performers tend to fool the meter. You can either do exposure compensation (technique 1) or manually force the ISO down (technique 2). People have their own favorite technique. I myself have oscillated between them. I used to be exposure compensation guy but after I got burned once (shooting a bunch of pics with compensation accidentally on), I moved to explicitly controlling ISO in tricky situations. But exposure compensation is easier and I keep going back and forth. On the issue of checking what ISO camera is using (AUTO ISO and fixed both), I simply point the camera (M240) to the scene and press d-pad button which displays the exposure info on LCD. That clearly shows ISO and shutterspeed at eye level that camera is going to use when I press the shutter. Update: I understand the lure of being able to see ISO in OVF but IMHO, it will clutter it. There had been times when I have mistaken ISO as shutterspeed number on Canon. I would like to see only one number (which is shutterspeed) in OVF. But then I am not too strict with this. As long as the numbers are not confusing, I am fine. I like the way ISO and shutterspeed is displayed in EVF. Very clearly stated on top. That works too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmahto Posted January 26, 2017 Share #107 Posted January 26, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) The problem with Auto ISO on the M10 is that you don't know what the camera chose until you look at the data on the image. I know everyone likes a clean OVF...but I would love to have more info while shooting. I want complete control of ISO, auto is a great option, but only if you know what the camera is doing. This is why I love the new ISO dial...I now have completely control and know at a glance exactly where my ISO is set. See my previous response. On M240, you can see ISO on LCD used by pressing the center D-pad button while pointing the camera to the scene. I guess M10 should work similarly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter H Posted January 26, 2017 Share #108 Posted January 26, 2017 I use Auto ISO regularly, but not exclusively. Typically I will be in Manual and set aperture and shutter speed to values that are appropriate to the subject. If I have a dynamic subject at an event, for example. I might want 1/125 to stop subject motion and f5.6 for a reasonable DOF. Auto ISO with a max ceiling that I am comfortable with (3200 on my M-240, higher on my M-246) allows me to shoot quickly and not have to worry about exposure. Just as with Aperture priority I have to be alert to situations that will fool the meter. In that case I will pan away from the light, window, etc. and lock exposure with a half press of the shutter and then re-compose. Works very nicely when you want to work quickly, but not necessary for many situations. Interesting. After three years of daily use, I've never even tried auto iso so I didn't realise that locking exposure also locked the auto iso. Obvious really! Never to late to learn. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted January 26, 2017 Share #109 Posted January 26, 2017 What is this "Auto ISO" you guys are all talking about? I've only been shooting with my M10 for two days and I've completely forgot about this "Auto ISO" thing you are talking about. Rick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Livingston Posted January 26, 2017 Share #110 Posted January 26, 2017 Its on your camera too, Rick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 26, 2017 Share #111 Posted January 26, 2017 In my modest and uninformed view, for digital ISO is entirely different from film. Digital has no ISO, really. It is what you can get away with in post processing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick Posted January 26, 2017 Share #112 Posted January 26, 2017 Its on your camera too, Rick Oh, thanks... is that what that "A" is on my ISO dial. Just to get this straight. You mean to say I don't even have to use the menu for this "Auto ISO" thing? That dial is even more useful than I thought. RickAnalog Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalfx Posted January 26, 2017 Share #113 Posted January 26, 2017 See my previous response. On M240, you can see ISO on LCD used by pressing the center D-pad button while pointing the camera to the scene. I guess M10 should work similarly. I stand corrected. You can see the ISO on the LCD by doing nothing But I use the rangefinder 80% of the time...so I don't want to turn on the LCD just to see what auto ISO is doing. But this is why I love the new dial. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmahto Posted January 26, 2017 Share #114 Posted January 26, 2017 I stand corrected. You can see the ISO on the LCD by doing nothing But I use the rangefinder 80% of the time...so I don't want to turn on the LCD just to see what auto ISO is doing. But this is why I love the new dial. I also use RF most of the times. I don't worry about ISO since I trust the algorithm which is very good. Only when there is difficult light, I simply press the d-pad button to check ISO. (Note: I am not talking LV, it is simply INFO screen displayed on LCD) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalfx Posted January 27, 2017 Share #115 Posted January 27, 2017 I also use RF most of the times. I don't worry about ISO since I trust the algorithm which is very good. Only when there is difficult light, I simply press the d-pad button to check ISO. (Note: I am not talking LV, it is simply INFO screen displayed on LCD) ahhh...ok, thats very useful. Thanks, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted January 27, 2017 Share #116 Posted January 27, 2017 The ISO setting comes into play twice during the making on an image. Exactly. F-stop and shutter speed are the exposure parameters; they determine how much of the incident light is actually captured by the sensor (or film for that matter). The ISO setting, on the other hand, tells the camera how much light – i.e. what number of photons – is sufficient for a correct exposure. Thus changing the ISO setting influences which shutter speed will be chosen, provided it is chosen automatically. The ISO setting may also determine, completely or partly, which amplification is applied to the pixel voltages before they are fed to an analogue-to-digital converter. To what extent the amplification actually depends on the ISO value is a different question. Depending on the noise characteristics of the sensor it may be advisable to increase the amplification only up to a certain value. With modern, mostly ISO-less sensors the benefits of increasing amplification are quite limited, and in the interest of maximising dynamic range, high levels of amplification should rather be avoided. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Ricoh Posted January 27, 2017 Share #117 Posted January 27, 2017 I wasn't aware ISO affected DR, but would when I think about it it's probably a gain bandwidth product limitation, with the product remaining constant. But, why does it take longer to write to the SD card with higher ISO settings? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted January 27, 2017 Share #118 Posted January 27, 2017 I wasn't aware ISO affected DR, but would when I think about it it's probably a gain bandwidth product limitation, with the product remaining constant. But, why does it take longer to write to the SD card with higher ISO settings? At higher ISO there is more noice in the raw file, so it doesn't compress as well. Compression ( .zip style is used) requires building a table of what's in the file and the noise requires a bigger table and makes a bigger output file, which takes longer... scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Ricoh Posted January 27, 2017 Share #119 Posted January 27, 2017 At higher ISO there is more noice in the raw file, so it doesn't compress as well. Compression ( .zip style is used) requires building a table of what's in the file and the noise requires a bigger table and makes a bigger output file, which takes longer... scott Even if one saves RAW only? I wasn't aware RAW files are compressed.Again thinking about it, noise has high frequency components, and unless filtered by the electronics it will fill the bandwidth to be stored. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted January 27, 2017 Share #120 Posted January 27, 2017 Even if one saves RAW only? I wasn't aware RAW files are compressed. They are. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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