Leica SL or Hasselblad X1D

[Jeff S]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Thanks Jeff 

 

I have been an IP customer for 12 years ... just talked about the P800 but will probably continue to do PDF and Blurb books ... not at this point wanting to exhibit. Lucky if I can find 10 days a year to devote to photography.

 

You may want to look seriously at the X1D and GFX lens imaging ... after 4 years with a Leica S ... now gone due to all the Leica mis adventures ... I am not convinced that the IQ with respect to uniqueness will be the same.

 

Bob

 

Thanks....too bad about your limited time...I have the luxury of being retired, so time is not a problem.  

 

I don't buy into a new camera system without testing it in my own print workflow.  So, yes, the X1D and the GFX (and perhaps the SL) will be rented or demo-ed before making any decision.  I did that with the S006 (with zoom) recently, but it didn't suit my needs (for reasons other than IQ).  The S007 and set of primes are not in consideration at current prices, and not until Leica comes clean on lens issues.  I really prefer OVF, but the mirror-less systems might present a lot of other offsetting benefits.  

 

TBD.

 

Jeff

[Guest NEIL-D-WILLIAMS]

 mmmmm...... yet more cameras that vastly exceed my capabilities to use them to their full potential .....

 

what I have already is over-kill considering I can 'only' print to A2 .... and even then half the time I don't know what to do with the prints ......

 

+1............hahahahha.

I now tend to print everything I like and put them in a cubbard. I do have some nice leather portfolios made which I like to show off my best work but everything that comes out of my camera are my best work................

[Jeff S]

I make lots of 'work prints'.  They go up on a wall in my work space, for contemplation.  Very, very few of those make it to frame worthy stage. 

 

Editing is the essence of photography.....we do it when we shoot, when we post-process and again when we review for print and/or display.

 

Jeff

[Guest NEIL-D-WILLIAMS]

 

 

ImagePrint 10 makes printing a breeze, without need to deal with any printer settings whatsoever.....just input the paper and print size, and IP does the rest, from superb profiles for virtually any paper, to all necessary settings, and always in soft-proof mode.

 

 

 

 

Jeff

 

Mate,

Ive tried that image print twice, and can't get the hang of it. The first time someone else mentioned it on the forum and I downloaded the trial and had a few goes to try and set A2 paper size and couldn't do it so I deleted it. I then heard you were using it so I tried it again but quickly switched back to Lightroom print as I needed a 1 inch border on the left hand side for my portfolio prints and couldn't figure out how to do that in IP and was in a hurry to get them printed.

Neil 

[Jeff S]

Mate,

Ive tried that image print twice, and can't get the hang of it. The first time someone else mentioned it on the forum and I downloaded the trial and had a few goes to try and set A2 paper size and couldn't do it so I deleted it. I then heard you were using it so I tried it again but quickly switched back to Lightroom print as I needed a 1 inch border on the left hand side for my portfolio prints and couldn't figure out how to do that in IP and was in a hurry to get them printed.

Neil 

 

You should watch their videos.  LuLa also just video interviewed their top guy.  They also have superb support customer support staff, willing to walk you through anything.

 

I've found it to be a piece of cake, and I'm not the nerdy type.

 

I was a big fan of printing out of LR; now I wouldn't go back if you paid me.

 

Jeff

Edited September 24, 2016 by Jeff S

[Guest NEIL-D-WILLIAMS]

I'm on the rig Jeff. I will look for the videos and see if I can get my head wrapped around it

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Jeff S]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Well, I couldn't run a rig.

 

Jeff

[Guest NEIL-D-WILLIAMS]

Well, I couldn't run a rig.

 

Jeff

 

Jeff

I've watched the basics videos (7 I think) but i don't see where if I want to have a 1/2 inch border on three sides and a 1 1/2" border on the left hand side (for binding) how to do that......is that possible??

[Jeff S]

Anything is possible, although depending on the page size, you may of course have to crop the pic to maintain those margins.  Easy to drag and extend borders, and exact measurements show at top as you do it.  

 

Jeff

[gpwhite]

I used to print all the time and big ... filled a closet with enough paper to withstand a decade of printing ... and also prints ... which the significant other had no interest in displaying.

 

One day the Epson 4900 developed a terminal case of clogged heads ... nothing would fix them.

 

Now I send most of my prints to Shutterfly ... 4x6 and an occasional 5x7.

 

Looking at most of the available pictures from the X1D ... highly resolved bland pics ... not much character or distinction.

 

So I realized that 23 x 16 will not be that far above the 17 x 11 inch at 360 that the 24 mp Leica sensors deliver.

 

Cancelled my preorder on the X1D and am moving back to a M246 and probably a M-D.

 

As a travel cam my Leica Q is pretty hard to beat.

 

Bob

 

I have very nice results at 16 x 24 from my really good M262 and M246 files, but MF definitely holds together better at that print size, IMHO. I know forum squawkers tell me to stand back further for larger prints, but it is hard to forgo the illusion of 3D that MF offers on 16 x 24 prints. I guess if you have a really good image from 24MP FF, then its energy at 16 x 24 remains strong.

 

The M-D is a completely liberating camera. I had no idea this would happen. But I started with an M2, so it might be my bias toward familiarity. 

[Jeff S]

Jeff

I've watched the basics videos (7 I think) but i don't see where if I want to have a 1/2 inch border on three sides and a 1 1/2" border on the left hand side (for binding) how to do that......is that possible??

 

As I wrote, I think you should be able to do about anything, but why not just email (or call) them to ask specifics...  https://www.colorbytesoftware.com/Ver10/customer_service.shtml

 

Jeff

[Guest NEIL-D-WILLIAMS]

As I wrote, I think you should be able to do about anything, but why not just email (or call) them to ask specifics...  https://www.colorbytesoftware.com/Ver10/customer_service.shtml

 

Jeff

 

Will do thanks

[steppenw0lf]

The M and SL are here and give us great photos with a lot of flexibility regarding the selection of lenses. When a new SL arrives with more pixels, that will still be true and there will be more resolution. Of course DoF is still like FF always was. (perfect for me).

 

The MF cameras have their merits (small DoF, fine gradation, many nuances). But the three new MF options are simply not there. And I wonder if you don't see the game that they are playing with you: Promise a lot, stay vague about delivery dates - the main thing is to stop the competition in the starting block.

 

Hasselblad is probably the most serious and has a reputation and will try to live up to it. So they promised relatively few lenses and already showed a "working" camera. But in reality the software seems very poor so short before delivery !!  But I "trust" them and think they will try to provide service in a decade or two. (I do not know if they can keep that promise, though.)

 

Sony is the opposite: Just spreading their technology and not really taking consistency very serious. Sony and MF ? I doubt it, not technically, but regarding their will to seriously support a niche product for a decade or two.

 

Fuji plays the typical japanese game - "we are the best, we have the most lenses, we will deliver in time". I think they took a while to deliver lenses for their small cameras. So how long will they need for the MF lenses ? They have a great roadmap but nothing touchable to show right now. Their strategy is clear: Stop Hasselblad NOW at any price, whatever we have to tell. We will see later if and when we will deliver. And will they deliver and support for the next two decades ? Who knows ...

Edited September 25, 2016 by steppenw0lf

[Jeff S]

Fuji has been turning out some terrific gear, and their record of delivering on customer needs/desires, including rapid firmware updates, and providing lens road maps in the first place (which they seem to have followed), is something Leica could seek to emulate.  I don't currently own Fuji equipment, but they have earned my attention and respect.

 

Jeff

[Guest]

In 6 months or so, I'm off tramping (catered, so a 45 litre pack), and at this stage I'll be taking the SL and the two zooms - the 24-90 for landscape, portraits and street (bush style) and the 90-280 for birds and tight lanscape.

 

The X1D is compact, great sensor, but the weathersealing and focal length range puts the SL ahead.  At this stage, my credit card is in my wallet ...

 

Keep that wallet zipped up! I have mine too, the X1D looks absolutely great, the black version especially. I believe they have actually shipped, I await my demo visit and hope fervently that I don't like it!

[Guest VVJ]

Fuji has been turning out some terrific gear, and their record of delivering on customer needs/desires, including rapid firmware updates, and providing lens road maps in the first place (which they seem to have followed), is something Leica could seek to emulate.  I don't currently own Fuji equipment, but they have earned my attention and respect.

 

Jeff

 

I concur.  With the first X models Fuji had great difficulties delivering but they have overcome that.

 

Given that the X-T2 sales are always going to dwarf the GFX 50s sales I am convinced that they easily will be able to deliver the smaller quantities of the GFX 50s.  

 

They also have the medium format experience and the medium format glass that they previously made (either for themselves or for Hasselblad) is excellent.

[dancook]

Fujirumors making some comparisons

 

http://www.fujirumors.com/fujifilm-gfx-roundup-hasselblad-x1d-vs-fujifilm-gfx-start-time-fujifilm-chose-focal-plane-shutter/

 

interesting that they say the Hasselblad has a 8 second start up time, I don't know whether that will be improved with firmware or whether wake from standby is quicker.

 

Someone also commented on Facebook that it has no exposure simulation, and that it always shows average exposure.

 

It's fortunate I've got to save a few more pennies, so I can wait to see what happens..

Edited September 27, 2016 by dancook

[colonel]

The advantage of the SL is entirely to do with speed and AF reliability.

All the current and future MF cameras will be slower and more considered in operation.

This is by design as no manufacturer has so far identified a need for a sports MF camera

 

Saying that functionality is not all it seems. The great Olympic sports photos of the 70s were taken with film and manual focus and I always chuckle to myself when someone in a forum says that one camera is no good for action because it lacks a small feature or speed advantage.

 

If you want to shoot in a more considered way and basically with primes and simply want the best IQ and most DOF play you will get a digital MF

If you want speed and reliability you will get a SL

 

The photos of both will be so good that for the average person that post photos on web albums and prints up to A3 there is no real practical difference ..

Edited September 29, 2016 by colonel

[Jeff S]

The advantage of the SL is entirely to do with speed and AF reliability.

For now, it's also related to the quality of the EVF.  And how I see the subject is paramount when it comes to my camera choice.

 

The X1D EVF is not up the specs of the SL.  We don't yet know about the GFX, although rumors are that it will be better than the X!D to start, and it's removable, so that upgrades may be feasible.

 

Besides that, ergonomics, handling, menu interface/controls, overall system reliability, weather sealing, etc are very important distinguishing features....for me.  We'll see how the various MF mirrorless options fare in this regard once models are delivered for testing.  The OVF of the S is still my ideal, but the S of course has the bulk of a DSLR+ , lens reliability issues and cost to consider.

 

It's not al about "speed and AF reliability"....for me.  I'll make my choice based on other factors.  IQ will likely be pretty great no matter the choice.

 

Jeff

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[ramarren]

...interesting that they say the Hasselblad has a 8 second start up time, I don't know whether that will be improved with firmware or whether wake from standby is quicker. ...

 

Malarky. I didn't see that even in the June-July demos. I switched both demo X1D cameras off and on again several times; they were ready to shoot within a second or so.

 

For now, it's also related to the quality of the EVF. And how I see the subject is paramount when it comes to my camera choice.

 

The X1D EVF is not up the specs of the SL. We don't yet know about the GFX, although rumors are that it will be better than the X!D to start, and it's removable, so that upgrades may be feasible. ...

Yes, the EVFs of these two cameras are different and the Leica SL EVF is slightly better. But, in practical terms, I found them equally easy to frame and focus with. (I personally have no interest in the Fuji at all so haven't really looked at its specs.) The X1D controls felt superb to my hands, on par with the SL's controls in most ways but rather different in execution due to the touchscreen control interface. Edited September 30, 2016 by ramarren