M(240) Edition 60

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I doubt anyone will ever use a flash on the M 60...

Actually, I doubt anyone will ever use an M 60 at all

 

Yes, you doubt many things.

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[satijntje]

I doubt anyone will ever use a flash on the M 60...

Actually, I doubt anyone will ever use an M 60 at all

 

Well, I used it at least today and made a few shots!

 

John

[MarkP]

Well, I used it at least today and made a few shots!

 

John

 

Pleas expand on that comment .

I hope you wore white gloves;).

[satijntje]

Pleas expand on that comment .

I hope you wore white gloves;).

 

 

it was not that cold in Cologne today :D

 

John

[mfunnell]

Your point makes me wonder if one could use the ISO setting wheel for exposure compensation. That is what we would do with film Leicas, so why not for digital?

Because with film Leicas changing the ISO setting alters the reaction of the meter but does not alter the sensitivity of the film. How can it? With digital, changing the ISO value alters the sensitivity (well, we could nit-pick about "sensitivity" vs "amplification") at the sensor.

 

I see this as another muddle - the Edition 60 has aperture-priority auto-exposure, but doesn't provide for exposure compensation. It seems to me that whatever "conceptual purity" they're pursuing should either provide no auto-expusure at all (direct setting of all of "the essential four" exposure parameters they go on about; with no nasty automation interfering with one's "radical concentration on the basic essentials required for photography") or provide auto-exposure and allow for AE override by exposure compensation. That is, don't do it at all or do it properly. (Full disclosure: I use AE frequently, and seldom use exposure compensation. But still....)

 

Of course if they were really being pure, with no automatic functions interfering with one's radical concentration, they probably shouldn't have put a light meter in the thing either.

 

While I know this is all moot in the sense that few enough of the Edition 60s are likely to be used to take actual photographs, I now have the impression that rather a lot of people would buy a "production" LCD-less digital M. It beats me why, but they have certainly said so, in what seem like droves, here and elsewhere. I'm now guessing that Leica will produce one, given the level of interest and given that they've already spent the development money while producing the collectible version.

 

And why not? Give 'em what they want and count the cash! (Especially as Leica would be mad not to charge a hefty premium over the price of an M-P. The level of committment evinced by fans of the no-LCD concept seems likely to produce a willingness to pay.)

 

...Mike

[CheshireCat]

I see this as another muddle - the Edition 60 has aperture-priority auto-exposure, but doesn't provide for exposure compensation.

 

Real men will expose-and-recompose in AE mode

[mfunnell]

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Real men will expose-and-recompose in AE mode

Wimps do that! (I can do that, so it can't be hard.) Real men don't use AE at all, and they set their exposure by "just knowing", which they do with their eyes shut, as actually looking is for the inferior photographer. They zone-focus their Noctilux by feel, wide open, while looking the other way, and never miss focus. They frame each shot perfectly, while never bringing the viewfinder to their eye, as they just know their field of view. For all their lenses. They have no need to set their ISO as it is always at base, and they hand-hold their 8 second exposures with no camera shake. (Some, in moments of weakness, admit their limit for hand-holding is 4 seconds after their 8th cup of coffee.)

 

I can't do any of those things

 

...Mike

[CheshireCat]

I can't do any of those things

 

Me neither.

But I heard Chuck Norris is getting an M 60 without lens. He will bend light rays with roundhouse kicks.

[Exodies]

Are there any screen messages during firmware update? I can't remember. Perhaps screenless wonders don't update firmware.

The thing looks good, but that's because of the lack of buttons on the back rather than the lack of a screen.

I think some of the anger expressed here is because the request for improvements such as a more modern sensor, faster processor and better EVF have been ignored whereas "precious" mods such as no screen, frame lines lever, red dot removal, ... have been implemented. It's like the auto ISO fiasco - those with the wrong idea were listened to first.

I won't be happy until we have circular sensors.

[pop]

This is becoming a bit tedious, I think. Some contributors seem to think that only the needs which call for more doodads and functions are real needs. Now, some feel the need to ridicule those members who have learned to correctly expose their frames without any meters. It must be really really difficult to accept that there are people who can do something better than oneself.

[Exodies]

<snip>Some contributors seem to think that only the needs which call for more doodads and functions are real needs.<snip>

 

That's because they are. Needs for less doodads can be simply met by ignoring the doodad. You can't imagine your way out of a need for a faster EVF.

[CheshireCat]

Philipp, I think some contributors are just being [self] ironic.

 

I hardly get an exposure right with a meter, let alone without and I admire those who can (few, but they do exist).

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That's because they are. Needs for less doodads can be simply met by ignoring the doodad. You can't imagine your way out of a need for a faster EVF.

Several buttons along the left hand side. One glass pane prone to break and to collect smears. One cross shaped switch and one thumb wheel. All easy to ignore and to avoid touching. Of course.

[plasticman]

I hardly get an exposure right with a meter, let alone without and I admire those who can

 

The camera has a meter.

[rosuna]

Several buttons along the left hand side. One glass pane prone to break and to collect smears. One cross shaped switch and one thumb wheel. All easy to ignore and to avoid touching. Of course.

 

I think all those buttons and wheels affect the way you handle and grasp the camera. In my opinion you cannot easily ignore or avoid touching all those elements (you can avoid pressing a button, at least).

 

Leica is brave proposing extreme concepts: the Leica T push the logic of the digital interface to the extreme, and makes the contrary with the M60. The two concepts may work for different people and different types of cameras. None has done this in the camera industry.

[Stevez4]

Many Photokina visitors got to try out the M60. The only user controls are the aperture of the lens and the film speed. It has a working hotshoe. It is slightly slimmer than the M 240 but about as heavy.

 

It is the only digital version of the analogue Ms that we cut our teeth on.

 

I wish it had lugs for the strap instead of a leather half case.

 

The camera number 1 to 600 is on the hot shoe. It was the hit of the Leica exhibit.

 

The price assures that most of the 600 units will land in the hands of collectors who will not actually use it. What a shame.

[jaapv]

Wimps do that! (I can do that, so it can't be hard.) Real men don't use AE at all, and they set their exposure by "just knowing", which they do with their eyes shut, as actually looking is for the inferior photographer. They zone-focus their Noctilux by feel, wide open, while looking the other way, and never miss focus. They frame each shot perfectly, while never bringing the viewfinder to their eye, as they just know their field of view. For all their lenses. They have no need to set their ISO as it is always at base, and they hand-hold their 8 second exposures with no camera shake. (Some, in moments of weakness, admit their limit for hand-holding is 4 seconds after their 8th cup of coffee.)

 

I can't do any of those things

 

...Mike

 

I don't think your irony is very realistic.

On any Leica M (or any camera that allows it, for that matter), the most correct method of exposing is to meter the part of the image one wants to be zone V, or to measure highlights and shadows and average, both of which imply using the camera in manual.

 

Exposure compensation is a bit of a crutch, at best a convenience tool, as it can never be more than a guesstimate.

 

I do not blame Leica for assuming that people who buy this camera to use it are accomplished enough to actually be able use it correctly.

[mfunnell]

I do not blame Leica for assuming that people who buy this camera to use it are accomplished enough to actually be able use it correctly.

Unlike those who have bought an M7, an M8, an M8.2, an M9, an M9P an MM, an M type 240 or an M-P type 240 who, one presumes, are not quite so accomplished. Those cameras provide for both aperture-priority auto-exposure and exposure compensation. The auto-exposure is OK, even for the accomplished, despite the "most correct method" of exposure requiring manual operation, but the compensation is not. I think I get it now...

 

...Mike

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[jaapv]

Well, lets put it differently. Given the above, it is at least understandable that Leica did not consider exposure compensation as fitting in the general philosophy behind the camera.

I agree they should have left off AE as well in that case and reverted to the M6 system.

[tomasis7]

I WANT IT!! I WANT IT!!

 

it is exactly the camera i was looking for, i wish i was a rich collectioner then i could take this and focus on photographing (which opposes to the nature of being collectioner

 

man, bring the camera on to production , Leica! Please....:eek:

 

I bet the price of one of 600 bodies is $20000.

 

edit: ok, i saw the price, not much off from my bet. So it is about 12500-13500$ apart from lens. As I mentioned earlier, you pay More for Less camera like Porsche does for customers (GT3-RS).