Guest guy_mancuso Posted May 4, 2007 Share #21 Posted May 4, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Now this is a good example of the WATE in action with the leica filter i was at 21mm here. Look at my corners now , very clean with no trace of the cyan cast. Looking for another wider example now Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/23142-samples-of-cyan-shifts-on-wa-lenses-please/?do=findComment&comment=245284'>More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 4, 2007 Posted May 4, 2007 Hi Guest guy_mancuso, Take a look here Samples of cyan shifts on WA lenses, please?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Guest guy_mancuso Posted May 4, 2007 Share #22 Posted May 4, 2007 Here is 18mm and 16mm . hard to tell on the 16mm in this shot because of a lot of mixed light and i am dragging the shutter for it but in tests which i can't find now at 16mm and the Leica filter works great, just have to trust me on that one 18mm 16mm and again with the leica filter. Hope this all helps understand what is going on and what the firmware is actually doing for you now Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/23142-samples-of-cyan-shifts-on-wa-lenses-please/?do=findComment&comment=245288'>More sharing options...
AGeoJO Posted May 4, 2007 Author Share #23 Posted May 4, 2007 Guy, Thank you very much for the samples. I am considering the WATE, especially since I am entitled to get 30% off but the filter issue (delayed availability of the filters) kind of makes me hesitant to get that. I will just stick to the 21mm Elmarit and wait the Leica filter for it. Thanks again, Joshua Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted May 4, 2007 Share #24 Posted May 4, 2007 Well the 49mm Leica will be out sooner than the 55mm filter like this week coming the 49's are scheduled to arrive. I had the 21mm before the WATE and it is a fine lens. hard to wrong either way but if you order on your 30 percent by the time you get either one the filters will be out. Interesting i looked at Tony's site today and man is he out of lenses, big demand lately. I need to get my 2 30 percent orders in also before June 30th Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted May 4, 2007 Share #25 Posted May 4, 2007 Bill, hard to believe a ghost town was made with black synthetic fabrics! Magenta raises it's ugly head again. I'm certain the filter will fix this and any similar future images. John, I'd agree with you except there is an overall magenta cast in the sky too...so something is off with the white balance. It's not an IR problem. Bill--did you take that shot through a windshield maybe? Just curious... @ Tim--completely different subject--that's a lot of cyan in that shot! Was that the BW filter on the CV 15? If so, and subject to a lot more comparison, I'd say the Leica filter causes less cyan than that! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted May 4, 2007 Share #26 Posted May 4, 2007 For the Leica 21 and 24, we'll need to wait a bit. 486 may be OK with 24 but I don't know yet. The 24/2.8 is my only coded lens, and like everyone else, I have only the B&W 55m filter. I posted white wall shots with that filter on and the new corrections ("ON+UV/IR") two weeks back, using indirect daylight at about 5650K. Take a look in this thread, as there are quite a few other examples. My posts are #44, #45, #61 and some analysis with curves plotted in #66. The most important conclusion is that at least down to 24mm the Leica filter correction leaves the red and green levels equal across the frame from center to corner (see #66 for that), but it does little or nothing for the luminance channel vignetting, which was attacked in the earlier "ON" firmware. I think these two corrections look like the result of independent efforts, rather than one being a revision of the other, but this is just a guess on my part. Two comments -- my daylight examples will be typical for outdoor shooting, but the tougher case that Sean Reid uses (a white card illuminated by 3000K studio tungsten lights) will show stronger cyan drift to the corners because there is more red to be cut off in his lights. Second, remember that the vignetting we see is the product of two factors, not the sum of them. The color shift can be thought of as a percentage decrease in the reds multiplying the reduction that the luminance vignetting has already caused. This accounts for most of the increased difference at f/8 compared with f/2.0 between the red levels filtered and unfiltered that Sean reports in his recent article. There is simply more red in the corners to start with at f/8 since the vignetting of luminance is less. Finally, here are two daylight shots (5650 K, -1 tint) with the 24/2.8 used at f/4 so the effects are modest. Both are with the B&W 486 filter, the first corrected and the second with lens detection "OFF". The major difference between these two is overall color shift. Correcting the second to 5800+3 removes most of the green cast. So I'm looking forward to the smaller diameter of the Leica filter as the real gain when it arrives someday. scott Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/23142-samples-of-cyan-shifts-on-wa-lenses-please/?do=findComment&comment=245362'>More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted May 4, 2007 Share #27 Posted May 4, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) Here is 18mm and 16mm . hard to tell on the 16mm in this shot because of a lot of mixed light and i am dragging the shutter for it but in tests which i can't find now at 16mm and the Leica filter works great, just have to trust me on that one 18mm 16mm and again with the leica filter. Hope this all helps understand what is going on and what the firmware is actually doing for you now (referring to the second picture above, shot at 16mm focal length with Leica filter) Guy, there seems to be a little green in the upper left corner. So I wonder, are you leaving the menu setting at ON+UV/IR (18mm) or correcting the camera's information about the WATE focal length for each shot when you change the focal length on the WATE itself. In other words, does you second shot show the WATE at 16 and the camera at 18 or both of them thinking they are 16mm? scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted May 4, 2007 Share #28 Posted May 4, 2007 Scott I may have left the menu at 18mm and shot at 16mm in this one but my camera data said 16mm. I was running pretty fast on this shoot. I know on my testing outside this shoot i had that right and it was clean. This is a tough shot becuase there is flouresents and tungsten canned light also plus the Metz going off. Just a lot of different light going on. need to find my test shots. let's see if I can locate them Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted May 4, 2007 Share #29 Posted May 4, 2007 I'll shoot something in the morning at 16mm Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted May 4, 2007 Share #30 Posted May 4, 2007 Scott I may have left the menu at 18mm and shot at 16mm in this one but my camera data said 16mm. I was running pretty fast on this shoot. I know on my testing outside this shoot i had that right and it was clean. This is a tough shot becuase there is flourescents and tungsten canned light also plus the Metz going off. Just a lot of different light going on. need to find my test shots. let's see if I can locate them If the EXIF on that shot says 16mm you must have set it in the menu -- it doesn't have anyplace else to find out that fact. (Sorry, I could have checked this if the EXIF is still in your post.) So the grey-green corner is probably just flourescent light. I know people like to see pictures and get to the end result, but this kind of complicated situation is why simple white wall tests have their place -- you learn what you can control and are ready for the rest. regards, scott Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tashley Posted May 4, 2007 Share #31 Posted May 4, 2007 John, I'd agree with you except there is an overall magenta cast in the sky too...so something is off with the white balance. It's not an IR problem. Bill--did you take that shot through a windshield maybe? Just curious... @ Tim--completely different subject--that's a lot of cyan in that shot! Was that the BW filter on the CV 15? If so, and subject to a lot more comparison, I'd say the Leica filter causes less cyan than that! Hi Jamie, Yup, I shot it in February so it was B+W alright but my little photoshop action baulks at nothing! ;-) Tim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill W Posted May 4, 2007 Share #32 Posted May 4, 2007 Jamie, It was not taken through a windshield. I was outdoors. Could it be with my post processing bringing out this shift. There is obviously no synthetic materian in old barn wood but this was obviously in the shadows. I can process again. I have both a DNG and jpg. Any suggestions are always appreciated. Other shots during of this same subject do not have this color shift shot from other views. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted May 4, 2007 Share #33 Posted May 4, 2007 Okay a quick early morning still in pajamas test. Yes ugly street scene . LOL. All shot at 16mm about F8 and just having the ON/IR filter switch going off and on. pretty obvious which is which . These are with the WATE at 16mm with the custom adapter and Leica filter Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/23142-samples-of-cyan-shifts-on-wa-lenses-please/?do=findComment&comment=245687'>More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted May 4, 2007 Share #34 Posted May 4, 2007 One more set Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/23142-samples-of-cyan-shifts-on-wa-lenses-please/?do=findComment&comment=245690'>More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted May 4, 2007 Share #35 Posted May 4, 2007 That is a pretty damn good correction, not sure you can get better than that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted May 4, 2007 Share #36 Posted May 4, 2007 Jamie,It was not taken through a windshield. I was outdoors. Could it be with my post processing bringing out this shift. There is obviously no synthetic materian in old barn wood but this was obviously in the shadows. I can process again. I have both a DNG and jpg. Any suggestions are always appreciated. Other shots during of this same subject do not have this color shift shot from other views. I was just curious why the sky seemed to have a large magenta component, but you can't really tell from a web JPEG. If you're up to sending the DNG, I'd love to have a look! Send it to me jhroberts@james-roberts-photography.com either directly or through YouSendIt - File Sharing Transfer Delivery - PC FTP Replacement if you like. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill W Posted May 4, 2007 Share #37 Posted May 4, 2007 Guy, What a difference it makes with the filter and switch on. One other observation is that your garage is too damn clean. Which one of the vehicles were you required to buy the wife as a result of your buying so much M equipment lately? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guy_mancuso Posted May 4, 2007 Share #38 Posted May 4, 2007 Yes she got a new BMW 335I but she had to give up the 325 convertible with her lease. I picked this out for her. It is a rocket ship . I'm driving it later today to Lake Havasu to play in a golf tourney. I have gotten it up to 120 so far, this is the fastest car i have owned 0-60 in like 4.9 or something like that afraid to look at the specs. Need to move to Montana. LOL Yes with this setup i have completely forgotten about the IR issue, it has become a non issue now. Leica really did a nice job on the firmware with the cyan cast removal. Amazing feat really Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGeoJO Posted May 4, 2007 Author Share #39 Posted May 4, 2007 Yup, I am echoing Bill's observation that your garage is clean/neat, Guy. Now, do I see quite a bit of shoe storage closets there :D ? Back to the IR cut filter issue. I just took a shot using my 21mm Elmarit in my backyard. First with a filter (Heliopan, camera set to "On+IR) and the second one without the filter (camera set only ot "On) and I couldn't tell the difference between the two shots.... I did another set but this time indoors, on the one with the filter, I could detect a slight cyan shift in two of the corners but the shot without the filter doesn't show any cyan shift. Unless there are pronounced areas with black synthetic fabrics (what's the chance of that happening using a wide angle lens ?), it looks like I will be better off without the filter.... Did I buy the filter for nothing then? I am more anxious to get Leica's own filter now than ever..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pklein Posted May 4, 2007 Share #40 Posted May 4, 2007 Sean: A request on a related matter. There is some question about the benefits of shooting B&W with or without the IR filter. On one hand, shooting without the filter can fill in some shadow detail in dim, tungsten-lit available light shots. On the other hand, the IR light might be a bit out of focus, and it might blur important things like facial detail. The question is how much. Yes, I know it would depend on the specific lighting, but we might be able to develop a rule of thumb. When you are doing your normal shooting or testing, when you run across an IR-rich tungsten-lit picture, would you shoot off a couple of B&Ws both with and without the filter, and post a couple of detailed crops? Either here, or on your site, or both. I suspect this subject will interest you, since we're both available light hounds. :-) Thanks! --Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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