Magnesium Flash Ribbon

[pgk]

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Whilst not strictly relevant as a Leica item, I wonder if anyone can tell me what era this dates from? I picked it up for a pittance and it intrigues me. Would Leicas have ever been used with such illuminants and if so how would they have triggered the ribbon? (I did photograph it with Leica lens;)). I've posted on the RFF too but any info would be interesting. Amazingly, though not in good condition its in (most of) its original box, and is complete with rather fragile instructions which seem to indicate that its a storage mechanism and a holder for burning the ribbon (surely not?) and claims sufficient ribbon inside for 300 exposures. Its marked Kodak, Holborn, London (Kodak was still there in the late seventies, early eighties). Anyone?

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[Orient XI]

I would imagine it dates from the 1920's. Why one would need to buy it when a pair of pliers would do the job shows the power of Kodak at the time!

It would be used in the technique known as "open flash" the camera is placed on a tripod and the shutter opened on a B or T setting. If the photographer or his assistant walked around the subject whilst the ribbon was burning the lighting could be made fairly even. Obviously the use of ribbon would be confined to static subjects as all spontaneity would be lost on animate subjects. Exposure could be determined by "experience" or guesswork.

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[jaapv]

It provided Al Jolson with the inspiration for the Black and White Minstrel Show :D Although it was not as bad as Flash Powder, which could literally blow up in your face. (And yes, I am old, but not so old as to have used this )

Edited July 11, 2014 by jaapv

[gyoung]

Such things were still in occasional use when I started in professional photography in the 60s. And even by 1970 I worked with an old stager who wouldn't use these newfangled PF60s.

He used an (original) Gandolfi and looked scathingly at my Sinar. He once set fire to a stand at Earls Court with flashpowder.

 

Gerry

[pgk]

Someone on RFF provided this link: http://www.photomemorabilia.co.uk/Il...h_History.html which bears out the late usage of such items. I also notice that (somewhat surprisingly in today's risk averse culture;)) you can still buy magnesium ribbon on ebay, which could make for interesting imagery......

[pico]

Magnesium flash was first used in 1864.

.

Edited July 11, 2014 by pico

[wda]

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I remember my father used exactly such a device with magnesium ribbon, in the 1930s, which had to be measured according to the flash output desired. Health and Safety officials would have had a field day, had they existed at the time.

[semi-ambivalent]

Such things were still in occasional use when I started in professional photography in the 60s. And even by 1970 I worked with an old stager who wouldn't use these newfangled PF60s.

He used an (original) Gandolfi and looked scathingly at my Sinar. He once set fire to a stand at Earls Court with flashpowder.

 

Gerry

 

He was an artifact of a now lost era; count yourself lucky to have made his acquaintance. The fire makes for excellent icing!

 

s-a

[jaapv]

I could imagine that magnesium ribbon might still be a practical way to shape light in interior photography, compared to multiple flash. More smooth and more control. Not that I am aware of anybody using it...

[erl]

I have a faint memory of watching and 'old photographer' use magnesium ribbon for 'instant flash'. A smokey affair. I have clear memories of using expendable flash bulbs that I believe were (still are) filled with magnesium ribbon. More reliable than the first electronic flashes that I used!

[pop]

I have a faint memory of watching and 'old photographer' use magnesium ribbon for 'instant flash'. A smokey affair. I have clear memories of using expendable flash bulbs that I believe were (still are) filled with magnesium ribbon. More reliable than the first electronic flashes that I used!

The reliability was, of course, due to rigorous QC at the factory. They tested each bulb before it was shipped.

[erl]

A habit they picked up from match manufactures, no doubt.

[pgk]

I also notice that (somewhat surprisingly in today's risk averse culture;)) you can still buy magnesium ribbon on ebay, which could make for interesting imagery......

In a fit of madness I've ordered a small (25g) roll. This could either be fun or.....

[pop]

In a fit of madness I've ordered a small (25g) roll. This could either be fun or.....

 

Do not use during take off or landing.

[pgk]

Do not use during take off or landing.

Just don't go there;).

[erl]

I have a faint memory of watching and 'old photographer' use magnesium ribbon for 'instant flash'. A smokey affair. I have clear memories of using expendable flash bulbs that I believe were (still are) filled with magnesium ribbon. More reliable than the first electronic flashes that I used!

Thinking back, maybe it was 'flash powder' I saw him use? Don't even know what that is! What I do know is that magnesium ribbon does not 'flash', but slow burns very brightly.

[pico]

[...] I have clear memories of using expendable flash bulbs that I believe were (still are) filled with magnesium ribbon.

 

Magnesium in flashbulbs was phased out; replaced with zirconium which is brighter. I have cases of large flashbulbs, including some I'm a little frightened of such as the Mazda 75 used from aircraft for night recon, and some that have an ignition duration of almost two seconds. That's a lot of light! And heat.

 

Image (not mine) shows Mazda 75 at far right, 1.75 second bulb just left of Mazda. The 1.75 is in a flash holder. It is not really that long.

 

[pop]

Thinking back, maybe it was 'flash powder' I saw him use? Don't even know what that is! What I do know is that magnesium ribbon does not 'flash', but slow burns very brightly.

 

When anything burns, its constituents atoms or molecules attach to oxygen.

 

The ribbon has a small surface, hence it takes a while until each atom is exposed to the air and can bind to an oxygen atom. Bulbs are filled with magnesium shave which has a rather large surface area. The same weight in the form of powder has an even larger surface area, such that the number of magnesium atoms which can find oxygen atoms at the same time is much larger, too.

Edited July 12, 2014 by pop

[pico]

When anything burns, its constituents atoms or molecules attach to oxygen.

 

The ribbon has a small surface, hence it takes a while until each atom is exposed to the air and can bind to a oxygen atom. Bulbs are filled with magnesium shave which has a rather large surface area. The same weight in the form of powder has an even larger surface area, such that the number of magnesium atoms which can find oxygen atoms at the same time is much larger, too.

 

Flashbulbs are filled with oxygen, not air which is mostly nitrogen. Does that make a difference?

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Hallo,

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[pop]

Flashbulbs are filled with oxygen, not air which is mostly nitrogen. Does that make a difference?

 

It certainly should.