jip Posted January 15, 2014 Share #121 Posted January 15, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) The only product I've bought new from Leica is the M240, all my lenses are second hand, 50 Summicron latest spherical model. 35 Summicron aspherical latest model, 90 Elmarit-m latest model... All of these works flawless, since most problems these days are problems that exist when the lens arrives at your hands and do not happen to come forward after some time. It's safe to say I rather buy second hand, almost new lenses. Then u know 1 it doesn't have any weird flaws, and 2 it probably won't get any flaws later on. With the M240 though: No ISO 640 line (I'm lucky?) Rangefinder calibration is good! On all my lenses. (I'm lucky?) Beeping noise when recording audio! (Annoying!) but not worth sending it back for... Maybe later... My red Leica dot when I got the camera was rotated 10° malign the left L of Leica higher the the a on the right... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 Hi jip, Take a look here More quality Control Issues. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Guest tanks Posted January 15, 2014 Share #122 Posted January 15, 2014 ...Fact is, is all camera companies screw up in a variety of ways. Ask Nikon about their D600 issues and D800 autofocus issues and see if you can buy a Nikon AW1 anywhere. Apparently supply chain issues there too. ... Two wrongs do not make it right though. One of the reasons we buy Leicas is hoping that one would not have to deal with these type of issues. . Yes, Leicas are expensive and yes Leica seems to have screwed up too often lately. Disappointment is a function of expectation. Because we expect more from Leica, I think we are all especially disappointed when they stumble. I also think we are disappointed because QC is one of their marketing strategies. It is like finding out a politician that has been pushing family values has a mistress or two on the side . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted January 15, 2014 Share #123 Posted January 15, 2014 ... It is like finding out a politician that has been pushing family values has a mistress or two on the side . I don't agree. The mistress is deliberate and deceitful but lapses in customer services are not. True, the lapses shouldn't happen but Leica's not deliberately being shoddy if that's what's actually happening. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest tanks Posted January 15, 2014 Share #124 Posted January 15, 2014 We are coming up on almost a year now since the release of the M. Shouldn't lapses that were "growing pains" due to M being a new product be taken care of now? If, and that is a big if as I don't have statistics to figure one way or another, there are "more quality issues" with Leicas as the title suggests then there is an issue with either the corporate culture (shipping vs QC) or fault somewhere in QC methods. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
george + Posted January 15, 2014 Share #125 Posted January 15, 2014 We certainly heard of problems - on this site. But what are the statistics? How many M-s are out there? And how many had to be returned to Leica? (not counting the lug-recall) Should we have a simple count? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted January 15, 2014 Share #126 Posted January 15, 2014 I don't agree. The mistress is deliberate and deceitful but lapses in customer services are not. True, the lapses shouldn't happen but Leica's not deliberately being shoddy if that's what's actually happening. Pete. Pete, Leica has been making lenses (or at least E Leitz/Leica) for well over 100 years. For the last 7 to 8 years, we have have a litany of excuses about faulty lenses and assurances that they will do better. I have not detected any improvement from recent experiences/posts and threads. So either Leica is incapable of making lenses any better (I sincerely hope not) or else they have decided that a high dissatisfaction rate amongst their customers is OK. I linked to a thread from years ago from Stefan Daniel, saying he was absolutely shocked that bad lenses were sailing past QC undetected. Well they still are! This must be a deliberate decision by Leica, not to beef up QC and spend extra money checking their product. Thus it is just as bad as the politician with the mistress. Worse because the latter has no impact on me. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted January 15, 2014 Share #127 Posted January 15, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) Wilson, I can't believe that any company would cynically risk an excellent reputation such as Leica's that has been earned and built up over decades by deliberately impeding its manufacturing and after sales service operations. Clearly the reported problems are unacceptable and you have my sympathy for the distress and inconvenience they've caused you but in my book it has to be (temporary I sincerely hope) incompetence not a strategy. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 15, 2014 Share #128 Posted January 15, 2014 Perhaps this should be a separate thread, but we rarely hear of the good things that Leica has done in the spirit of customer support. I will add (perhaps repeating) a great experience I had. Shortly after buying my M9 I had a terrific bicycle accident that seriously damaged the camera, and destroyed the 35mm Summilux lens. I was devastated, but still in good spirits, and wrote about if here. Shortly after that, a person well connected to Leica who wishes to remain anonymous wrote to me, giving me the name of a gentleman at Leica, NJ as a personal reference. I contacted Leica, sent the camera in for repair, and it got super-express service, a major rebuild, and was back in my hands in two weeks. I did pay for the repair which was still very reasonable. Now I have an M9 that might very well be better than new. I suspect there are many others who have had remarkably good experiences. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lethbrp Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share #129 Posted January 15, 2014 Perhaps this should be a separate thread, but we rarely hear of the good things that Leica has done in the spirit of customer support. I will add (perhaps repeating) a great experience I had. Shortly after buying my M9 I had a terrific bicycle accident that seriously damaged the camera, and destroyed the 35mm Summilux lens. I was devastated, but still in good spirits, and wrote about if here. Shortly after that, a person well connected to Leica who wishes to remain anonymous wrote to me, giving me the name of a gentleman at Leica, NJ as a personal reference. I contacted Leica, sent the camera in for repair, and it got super-express service, a major rebuild, and was back in my hands in two weeks. I did pay for the repair which was still very reasonable. Now I have an M9 that might very well be better than new. I suspect there are many others who have had remarkably good experiences. This thread was not a criticism of Leica customer service. Like you, I've experienced nothing but excellent service. The thread was a criticism of the quality assurance team that allows defective new items out into the marketplace in the first instance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted January 15, 2014 Share #130 Posted January 15, 2014 This thread was not a criticism of Leica customer service. Like you, I've experienced nothing but excellent service. The thread was a criticism of the quality assurance team that allows defective new items out into the marketplace in the first instance. Perhaps a moderator will delete my post. It is too late for me to do it myself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterP Posted January 17, 2014 Share #131 Posted January 17, 2014 Well I might as well chime in on this as well. here is an inventory of Leica equipment I purchased in the last 10 years, some I still have others that have been sold. 18mm demo - excellent 28mm Elmarit - new - sloppy aperture ring 75mm Summarit - new - I have never had a lens which I barely used come apart in my hands 90mm Elmarit - 2 copies both used, 1 excellent, the other sloppy aperture ring m6 - used, m7 (2copies) - used - all good m8 - new - don't get me started on this, the main reason I didn't bother with the 9 m240 - new- love it, just too bad it doesn't have auto sensor cleaning. now compare to my Zeiss lenses 35mm new - excellent 50mm new - excellent Aside from the issues with the Canon 1Dmk3, which Canon fixed, I have never had a bit of trouble with the 9 bodies I purchased nor with the 12 lenses - all purchased new. I also have 3 Zeiss lenses for the Canon mount - all of which are problem free. From my past experiences, I would not buy a Leica lens on-line, I would rather purchase in person so I can test it. And since someone brought up Customer Service - I found my 3 experiences with Leica NJ to be very bad (to put it mildly). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted January 17, 2014 Share #132 Posted January 17, 2014 From my past experiences, I would not buy a Leica lens on-line, I would rather purchase in person so I can test it. I would have loved to do this but Leica UK in their wisdom, took away the dealership from my local Leica shop, with whom I and a number of other long term Leica users had a very good relationship over many years. I had bought 4 generations of Digliux from them, and my M8, M9 plus various lenses, flashes and accessories. They were a small shop occupying half of a pharmacy and apparently did not fit Leica’s desired image, in spite of providing exactly the sort of knowledgable and personal service that Leica owners want. They really don’t have a clue much of the time and think that a snazzy Leica Boutique, run by young sales oiks, is what we want! Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterP Posted January 17, 2014 Share #133 Posted January 17, 2014 I would have loved to do this but Leica UK in their wisdom, took away the dealership from my local Leica shop, with whom I and a number of other long term Leica users had a very good relationship over many years. I had bought 4 generations of Digliux from them, and my M8, M9 plus various lenses, flashes and accessories. They were a small shop occupying half of a pharmacy and apparently did not fit Leica’s desired image, in spite of providing exactly the sort of knowledgable and personal service that Leica owners want. They really don’t have a clue much of the time and think that a snazzy Leica Boutique, run by young sales oiks, is what we want! Wilson Yes that certainly is too bad! Although we have a Leica store in LA, I still prefer my old contact at Samy's! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thighslapper Posted January 17, 2014 Share #134 Posted January 17, 2014 Pete, Leica has been making lenses (or at least E Leitz/Leica) for well over 100 years. For the last 7 to 8 years, we have have a litany of excuses about faulty lenses and assurances that they will do better. I have not detected any improvement from recent experiences/posts and threads. So either Leica is incapable of making lenses any better (I sincerely hope not) or else they have decided that a high dissatisfaction rate amongst their customers is OK. I linked to a thread from years ago from Stefan Daniel, saying he was absolutely shocked that bad lenses were sailing past QC undetected. Well they still are! This must be a deliberate decision by Leica, not to beef up QC and spend extra money checking their product. Thus it is just as bad as the politician with the mistress. Worse because the latter has no impact on me. Wilson .... yet again I would point out ...... and at risk of being criticised (yet again) ...... it is noticeable that hardly any Leica lenses are unavailable ex-stock .... which was not the case even 18 months ago .... so Leica has clearly increased production ..... which must have either been by cutting corners or by increasing staff ... or both. Either of these can ... and often does ...cause a drop in product quality and reduced interception of substandard goods. The need to improve the balance sheet and keep the shareholders happy nearly always over-rides the warnings about reduced quality ...... until the consequences cause enough bad press to jeopardise profitability. Unless the staff at places like Leica Mayfair start shi**ing themselves because sales are dropping as a result then things will not change. Leica .... like every other business is out to make money and not a charity to help photographers ....... None of this is surprising ..... and at some stage equilibrium will be reached and things will quieten down.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted January 18, 2014 Share #135 Posted January 18, 2014 I would have loved to do this but Leica UK in their wisdom, took away the dealership from my local Leica shop, with whom I and a number of other long term Leica users had a very good relationship over many years. I had bought 4 generations of Digliux from them, and my M8, M9 plus various lenses, flashes and accessories. They were a small shop occupying half of a pharmacy and apparently did not fit Leica’s desired image, in spite of providing exactly the sort of knowledgable and personal service that Leica owners want. They really don’t have a clue much of the time and think that a snazzy Leica Boutique, run by young sales oiks, is what we want! Wilson They don’t think that, they think that an expanded customer base wants it… Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterP Posted January 18, 2014 Share #136 Posted January 18, 2014 . Leica .... like every other business is out to make money and not a charity to help photographers ....... .... You can't be serious!!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mirekti Posted January 18, 2014 Share #137 Posted January 18, 2014 I'll share my experience too. I came from Canon last year in May. 35 FLE - perfect 75 Cron - came with a 35 Cron manual, and filter thread got unscrewed together with the Circular Polarizer filter. After a month of use (and it wasn't heavily used), the apperture ring was faulty, it wouldn't click in and it would get stuck. I sent it for a repair, and the lens came back with the filter thread ring which doesn't unscrew anymore, and the apperture ring is fixed. The lens flares a bit, but I'm not sure whether this is normal or something got messed up in NJ. 135 APO - perfect M - almost perfect. Up to date I didn't have a single lock up, and only three black photos on 10000 taken. The shutter was kind of doing a bla sound when this happened. Focusing is super precise with all three lenses. All in all, I'm a happy consumer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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