menos I M6 Posted July 11, 2014 Share #121 Posted July 11, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) No, I am not beating you or anybody, but that is the configuration in which the lockups happen, in the others-according to our beta testers - not. If that is the case Jaap, than I must have been hallucinating - all the troubles I went trough to find a configuration that works … I apologize and admit you are truthfully correct … Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 11, 2014 Posted July 11, 2014 Hi menos I M6, Take a look here Frustrated... Where is the M9 firmware fix?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jaapv Posted July 11, 2014 Share #122 Posted July 11, 2014 The thing is, Dirk, that the bug was known a the release of the firmware. Leica clearly decided that the relevancy was either of no importance or did not warrant the effort as it only affected a combination that makes no sense, or that it was not possible to avoid this problem without impairing the important other aspects of the update. I - and others- did advise against putting out firmware with a known bug. Water under the bridge now. And hey! What works works. I would not have upgraded at the time but for the betatesting, as I had no SD troubles. As it is my M9 runs smoothly with the newest the way I use the camera, so no complaints here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick_S Posted July 11, 2014 Share #123 Posted July 11, 2014 No, I am not beating you or anybody, but that is the configuration in which the lockups happen, in the others-according to our beta testers - not. It happened to me the other day. I asked a companion to include me in the photo, the on switch of my Monochrom got pushed to continuous rather than single-shot, though I use discrete mode, and the camera locked up. I had to take off the baseplate and remove the battery to reset it. Fortunately the photograph was not corrupted. As a fix, the firmware should at least override the discrete menu setting when continuous mode is selected. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Gunst Lund Posted July 11, 2014 Share #124 Posted July 11, 2014 I downgraded my M9 to 1.162 and can report that the time to store the raw files to the card are about half compared to the later firmware versions. Thanks Menos! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 11, 2014 Share #125 Posted July 11, 2014 That is correct, however as you don't need to wait for the file to be stored before taking the next shot, the advantage is limited to the emptying of the buffer. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Gunst Lund Posted July 11, 2014 Share #126 Posted July 11, 2014 Yes, that was not my point. There must be much less battery power used for the in camera processing and/or writing. Half? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 11, 2014 Share #127 Posted July 11, 2014 Advertisement (gone after registration) No, the speed loss is caused by double-checking the data writing to the SD card. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Gunst Lund Posted July 11, 2014 Share #128 Posted July 11, 2014 Are you stating there is no power used for this double checking? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 12, 2014 Share #129 Posted July 12, 2014 Probably a bit, but negligible in comparison to the LCD and shutter mechanism etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
menos I M6 Posted July 12, 2014 Share #130 Posted July 12, 2014 I downgraded my M9 to 1.162 and can report that the time to store the raw files to the card are about half compared to the later firmware versions. Thanks Menos! You are welcome Erik. The faster write times are one part of the benefit of FW 1.162. The other part, essential to people relying on Discreet Mode is, that with later FW Discreet Mode is flawed. I shoot exclusively with Discreet Mode and never use Continous mode since the M8.2. When I am in a situation where I would want to shoot several frames quickly in sequence, I can shoot, … lift my finger, shoot, …*lift my finger, … This does not work with later FW, as you have to lift your finger COMPLETELY off the shutter release and still have delayed shutter re-cocking many times, completely breaking Discreet Mode. Important: Be advised, the older FW 1.162 does need more discipline in regards of SD card management: 1) Only certain cards are working reliably (basic rule is: stay away from larger cards than 8GB and stay away from most modern faster cards than 30MB/s) 2) Always format the card in camera after having downloaded your shots to the computer and have backup-ed them to a redundant drive. 3)Never shoot the camera with almost empty battery! Leica changed battery management in camera with later FW, as they found that when the camera runs on very little battery capacity a sudden power need for image data creation and writing to card can cause data corruption and even corrupted SD cards to the point that they are not readable anymore by other devices! Leica fixed this in later FW by capping the allowed battery life in camera and introducing double data integrity checking while writing to card (extending write times severely). As a general rule: I use many batteries (currently 9) and only shoot them to ~30% capacity before I swap in the next fresh battery. I can easily shoot a day long this way on 2 - 3 batteries. I have a calendar reminder every three months, when I completely discharge each battery in sequence and re-charge them for calibration. This way battery life is also maximised (my oldest batteries from the M8.2 are now more than three years in regular use and hold a good charge with 150+ shots). Now if somebody like Jaap doesn't use Discreet Mode and doesn't mind the longer write times of later FW, surely newer firmware revisions are safer, better and for general users to be preferred. But this never has been the point of discussion here (except for Jaap). The discussion has been about Discreet Mode and shutter re-cocking issues, which both were solved with FW 1.162, if the user practiced strict discipline with critical points of using these first gen Leica digital M cameras. Unfortunately Discreet Mode has been broken again in later FW revisions and Leica introduced significantly longer writing times to card to the already languish Leica M9 as a fix for the SD card debacle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 12, 2014 Share #131 Posted July 12, 2014 I think you gave a good rundown of the disadvantages of reverting to 1.162, Dirk. That has been my point all the time. Just one thing, the SD card problem appeared not when Leica changed the firmware, but when Sandisk introduced a newer type of cards. It was never established which one of the two interpreted the SD card standard incorrectly or even whether this was a bug in the SD standard itself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
menos I M6 Posted July 12, 2014 Share #132 Posted July 12, 2014 Jaap I take it you're more of a "glass half empty" person, aren't you? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 12, 2014 Share #133 Posted July 12, 2014 No, I'm more an "informed decision" type of person. You may recall the introduction of a special SD card section on the forum because of the problems with cards in 1.162. Hence my question: do we really want to go there again? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erik Gunst Lund Posted July 17, 2014 Share #134 Posted July 17, 2014 Usually I say an 'Educated decision' In the future I will change that to 'Educated and Informed decision' Thanks Jaap So far the M9 just clicks away on 1.162 no issues at all. That is what matters to me, that my M9 works as expected. I use 8 Gb cards from Lexar and always follow the same procedure you mention, also did low format on my old Sandisk SD cards I used in M8 . I will of course keep an close eye on performance... Thanks for all of your great inputs guys! On a side note; Do try not to steer everyone into using 'your' solution, a bit wasted on most people here - just inform people what you do and why and leave it at that Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
john neal Posted July 18, 2014 Share #135 Posted July 18, 2014 Erik, I am interested to know what version you downgraded from, and how? My M9-P will not go back from 1.196 no matter what I try. If there is a magic trick, I would like to learn it Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Lss- Posted July 18, 2014 Share #136 Posted July 18, 2014 I doubt that the combo C/D is as intended, reason I wonder that Leica did not disable it. It works perfectly on M8. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 18, 2014 Share #137 Posted July 18, 2014 Erik, I am interested to know what version you downgraded from, and how? My M9-P will not go back from 1.196 no matter what I try. If there is a magic trick, I would like to learn it There is no magic trick. You cannot install M 9 firmware on an M9P. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted July 20, 2014 Share #138 Posted July 20, 2014 For my M9 FW version 1.162 and a Panasonic Gold card seem optimal - given the options available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
colonel Posted July 20, 2014 Share #139 Posted July 20, 2014 There is a comprehensive thread on SD card issues My personal experience is that I use exclusively Samsung and PNY class 6 and class 10 cards on the M9 and have never had a problem with any firmware .... I only used a Sandisk card once and there was a problem. Go figure I use Sandisk with my other cameras but since sticking to the above I never had an SD card issue on the M8 or M9 Rgds Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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