Monochrome and monogamy

[Guest malland]

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Rather than looking at the image on the LCD, it seems to me that one should be looking at the histogram, which is real data from the DNG and not from the JPG as on the M9, .

 

—Mitch/Bangkok

Surabaya-Johnny

[MarkP]

Rather than looking at the image on the LCD, it seems to me that one should be looking at the histogram, which is real data from the DNG and not from the JPG as on the M9, .

 

—Mitch/Bangkok

Surabaya-Johnny

 

Yes, any decision should be made off the histogram, not the image on the LCD display. Otherwise you could always turn on highlight clipping (at 100%) on the display. If you see the red flashing for anything more than specular highlights you have overexposed the image.

[menos I M6]

I am still feeling the attraction of the Monochrome, most well nearly all of my pictures end up B&W, I have only printed 3 pictures in colour and a few hundred in B&W but to date I just can't justify the £6k

 

One thing that genuinely troubles me is whether I would abandon my trusty M9-P. Do those with both still really use both ?

 

M9 has become the "filler camera", wearing a second lens, while I majorly use the Mono.

The digital workflow with the Mono, M9 and M8 is so entirely different, that I try to prevent to shoot these cameras mixed and mostly grab the Mono.

 

If you shoot for B&W, just go for it, sell the M9, get a Mono and be done with it.

[tomasis7]

buy mm and shoot sub -2 stop and never worry about exposing highlights since 10 000 iso looks good. It's heaven for slow speed lenses as summarits 2.5 and elmar 3.8.

 

That would be good workout for truly good pictures.

[otto.f]

I use both and I had heavy thoughts about carrying both when traveling. But after all, it more than weighs up to the results. The simple fact that you make your decision on the spot to do it in either color or B&W and not afterwards, is nearly worth the money. And then when you come home: the unbelievable richness in tone of the MM images makes you forget the costs very soon.

(I am a 50/50 B&W/color shooter btw and have always been)

[Ecaton]

Bad decision to visit this thread just after having surfed on evil-bay for MMs. I`m close to call up my trusted Leica dealer to get a MM. M9 and MP will probably be sold and the Sony RX1 and other compact stuff used for color. As others, I tend to convert most of my M9 shots to B&W, so why not just getting the real thing.

[250swb]

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buy mm and shoot sub -2 stop and never worry about exposing highlights since 10 000 iso looks good. It's heaven for slow speed lenses as summarits 2.5 and elmar 3.8.

 

That would be good workout for truly good pictures.

 

I wouldn't under expose by 2 stops (maybe 1 stop, mostly 2/3) but I agree about the high ISO, it looks so good. My set limit is 8000 ISO and the MM is the only camera I have ever trusted with 'Auto ISO' (under the right circumstances) because it never gets ugly.

 

Steve

[Guest malland]

buy mm and shoot sub -2 stop and never worry about exposing highlights since 10 000 iso looks good. It's heaven for slow speed lenses as summarits 2.5 and elmar 3.8.

 

That would be good workout for truly good pictures.

That's fallacious because, while the MM noise may be acceptable at ISO 5,000 and even at 10,000 for some people, the dynamic range is very narrow at these high ISOs. As stated by Jim Kasson on page 5 post #100 of this thread, one could be better by shooting the M-Monochrom at ISO 1250 and increasing Exposure in post-processing in Lighroom 4/5 (but note that neither Jim nor I have tested this yet.)

 

—Mitch/Paris

Surabaya-Johnny

[jaapv]

buy mm and shoot sub -2 stop and never worry about exposing highlights since 10 000 iso looks good. It's heaven for slow speed lenses as summarits 2.5 and elmar 3.8.

 

That would be good workout for truly good pictures.

Shoot -2 stops and lose two stops dynamic range...

[honcho]

buy mm and shoot sub -2 stop.....

 

Apart from buying an MM, that's a crap idea on any media.

[mark_j]

That's fallacious because, while the MM noise may be acceptable at ISO 5,000 and even at 10,000 for some people, the dynamic range is very narrow at these high ISOs. As stated by Jim Kasson on page 5 post #100 of this thread, one could be better by shooting the M-Monochrom at ISO 1250 and increasing Exposure in post-processing in Lighroom 4/5 (but note that neither Jim nor I have tested this yet.)

 

—Mitch/Paris

Surabaya-Johnny

 

Mitch

 

Last month we had a brief discussion on your other thread about the M9 and I was going to try out the "shoot at 640 and push in post" idea. Unfortunately I sold my M9 which makes this a bit tricky but I did exchange it for a Monochrom and the other evening I was shooting in Covent Garden at dusk using ISO from 800 to 6400. I am still sorting through the shots but will try and post some examples tomorrow where I shot at 3200 and should have shot at 6400.

 

I have to say though that my initial thoughts (before looking at each picture in depth) is that the different noise/grain structure on the MM may make the comparison less striking than for the M9 as even at 6400 the pictures looked sort of OK (with a +20 noise reduction in LR5).

 

One question for the technical gurus out there: If you shoot at say 1600 and then push 1 stop in post, does that not reduce the DR of the photo to the same DR as if you had shot at 3200 and not pushed? This still confuses the heck out of me.

[Guest malland]

Mark,

 

Well, yes, that is the point: you get less noise and more dynamic range. See Jim Kasson's posts #114, #115 and #118 on page 6 of the thread in question. Also, for the M-Monochrom, in view of what Jim said in that thread, I would try ISO1250 and not 1600 for pushing in post.

 

—Mitch/Paris

Surabaya-Johnny

[Guest malland]

Apart from buying an MM, that's a crap idea on any media.

No, for shooting the M9 at high-ISO, you get better image quality by using the technique of "Shooting at ISO 640 and pushing Exposure in LR4/5", as documented in this thread. It's not intuitive but the tests show it's valid, and it makes the M9 a good high-ISO camera, contrary to the conventional wisdom, not the least because of the good color rendition that is produced in this way.

 

—Mitch/Paris

Surabaya-Johnny

[tomasis7]

I wouldn't under expose by 2 stops (maybe 1 stop, mostly 2/3) but I agree about the high ISO, it looks so good. My set limit is 8000 ISO and the MM is the only camera I have ever trusted with 'Auto ISO' (under the right circumstances) because it never gets ugly.

 

Steve

 

I agree. I exaggerated a bit. Normaly I take under 1 stop.

 

That's fallacious because, while the MM noise may be acceptable at ISO 5,000 and even at 10,000 for some people, the dynamic range is very narrow at these high ISOs. As stated by Jim Kasson on page 5 post #100 of this thread, one could be better by shooting the M-Monochrom at ISO 1250 and increasing Exposure in post-processing in Lighroom 4/5 (but note that neither Jim nor I have tested this yet.)

 

—Mitch/Paris

Surabaya-Johnny

 

thanks for the link. base 1250 is not bad, by 4 stops, it would be 10 000. I never meant shooting -2 stops at iso 10 000. Doing at base iso setitng i.e. 1250, makes sense

 

Shoot -2 stops and lose two stops dynamic range...

 

some proofs? I tried understand Puts article and didnt got clever. Seems that M is better at midtones and MM do better at both ends of curve. The question is how much.

 

Apart from buying an MM, that's a crap idea on any media.

 

For you. Not for some.