01af Posted March 4, 2013 Author Share #61 Posted March 4, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) I was wondering if the metering cell has been moved, compared to the M9. Don't worry too much about this question. Lenses like the Hologon 15 mm are better used in live-view mode anyway, and metering is working just fine in this mode. My test shots with the W.Rokkor-PI 21 mm also have been taken in live-view mode and auto-exposure mode, and exposure always came out well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 4, 2013 Posted March 4, 2013 Hi 01af, Take a look here New M and old super-wide. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Olsen Posted March 4, 2013 Share #62 Posted March 4, 2013 Well, the CV 12mm doesn't seem to be too weird: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/forum-zur-leica-m9/274421-praxisberichte-und-bewertungen-der-m.html#post2332472 - To what I can see: The CV 12 is 'just as bad' on the M240 as on the M9. No improvement there. - Which is what I expected. A 'flat' sensor is not a 'fast' sensor. So, here Leica had to chose either or... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
k-hawinkler Posted March 4, 2013 Share #63 Posted March 4, 2013 Plug-ins for Adobe Photoshop Lightroom | Adobe Labs Jaap, Thanks. Is there such a tool to use with Photoshop! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted March 4, 2013 Share #64 Posted March 4, 2013 Afaik not by Adobe. RawTherapee seems to be useful - I have no experience myself. I have heard a people who made an action. C1 is perfect and easy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manolo Posted March 4, 2013 Share #65 Posted March 4, 2013 grate thread please keep posting as we have more info. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecar Posted March 4, 2013 Share #66 Posted March 4, 2013 I was wondering, if the metering cell has been moved, compared to the M9. I have a Carl Zeiss Hologon, that interestingly works in good light pretty well, metering with my Leica MP, while with any of the digital Ms, I have it does not work, as the lens' rear shroud is so close to the shutter, shading obstructing the path between shutter curtain and metering cell. When trying to meter with the MP, the cutoff for light sensitivity is a lot earlier than normal. I guess, the reason why it works in some light with the MP is, that the meter reads from a round circle, painted on the shutter curtain, which is vertically reaching further downwards, out of the way of the deep rear group of the lens. Interesting question, Dirk, as the M has different metering modes ("Classic", which is supposed to operate as on previous M cameras, and 3 "Advanced" options where, unless I'm mistaken, the light is metered directly from the sensor). So far, I have stuck with Classic but am planning to explore the Advanced options when time allows. The "Advanced" mode may indeed be a solution to your issue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecar Posted March 4, 2013 Share #67 Posted March 4, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) I've not seen how results from the 21 lux look, but I imagine they're good as Leica will have prioritised their current lens series. Chris, I grabbed a few white wall shots with the Summilux 21 yesterday: whilst the vignetting correction is not ideal (the corners are still darker than I'd like), there are no red edges to speak of. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tobey bilek Posted March 4, 2013 Share #68 Posted March 4, 2013 Looks as if I will never be a M customer. I have a M9P from last Sept, 2012, and my 12, 15, 21 pre asph and 28 version 3 all work perfectly, at least as well as on film. The results here do not look good. The 12 & 15 are screw mounts from the day they were introduced. There was a nice demo at Central Camera and I tested them, developed the film at home, called back and told them I wanted the exact demo lenses. Got them. The are menu coded as 21 pre asph. I bought 25 4.0 CV lated. The lens is an extreme disappointment on digital even at F8. Not sure what to do with it. Bin probably. Will never buy another CV product. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
douglasf13 Posted March 4, 2013 Share #69 Posted March 4, 2013 Looks as if I will never be a M customer. I have a M9P from last Sept, 2012, and my 12, 15, 21 pre asph and 28 version 3 all work perfectly, at least as well as on film. The results here do not look good. The 12 & 15 are screw mounts from the day they were introduced. There was a nice demo at Central Camera and I tested them, developed the film at home, called back and told them I wanted the exact demo lenses. Got them. The are menu coded as 21 pre asph. I bought 25 4.0 CV lated. The lens is an extreme disappointment on digital even at F8. Not sure what to do with it. Bin probably. Will never buy another CV product. Tobey, is resolution a problem with the 25/4, or just color shift? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted March 4, 2013 Share #70 Posted March 4, 2013 The 12 & 15 are screw mounts from the day they were introduced. Trivial point: The 15mm is now available in M-mount with coupled focusing. I have the screw mount and it performs better on an M9 than on a good micro 4/3, which speaks to something Leica is doing quite right. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Johnston Posted March 4, 2013 Share #71 Posted March 4, 2013 i was very pleased with what i got from the 25/4 on the m8 in particular. having recently moved to an old m9, the initial feeling is the performance looks good but is much wider than i got used to on the cropped sensor. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted March 4, 2013 Share #72 Posted March 4, 2013 I was wondering, if the metering cell has been moved, compared to the M9. I have a Carl Zeiss Hologon, that interestingly works in good light pretty well, metering with my Leica MP, while with any of the digital Ms, I have it does not work, as the lens' rear shroud is so close to the shutter, shading obstructing the path between shutter curtain and metering cell.... .... Sorry : do you mean that the Hologon 15 f8 CAN be used on digital Ms, apart the metering issue ? I thought it was "mechanically" un-compatible (not that I plan to buy one... ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
douglasf13 Posted March 4, 2013 Share #73 Posted March 4, 2013 Afaik not by Adobe. RawTherapee seems to be useful - I have no experience myself. I have heard a people who made an action.C1 is perfect and easy. Yeah, I think the plug-in only exists for Lightroom, not PS. FWIW, both the Lightroom and C1 implementation of fixing color shift is very easy to use. It's literally a couple of clicks with Lightroom, and you can do a whole batch of photos at once. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
UliWer Posted March 4, 2013 Share #74 Posted March 4, 2013 Sorry : do you mean that the Hologon 15 f8 CAN be used on digital Ms, apart the metering issue ? I thought it was "mechanically" un-compatible (not that I plan to buy one... ) The M-Manual explicitly says the Hologon 1:8/15mm cannot be used. Same as we knew from the M8/M9. Leica Camera AG - Downloads Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmradman Posted March 4, 2013 Share #75 Posted March 4, 2013 The M-Manual explicitly says the Hologon 1:8/15mm cannot be used. Same as we knew from the M8/M9.Leica Camera AG - Downloads I think Menos has 16mm f8 Hologon which is converted G lens, not original 1970s 15mm version. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rscheffler Posted March 5, 2013 Share #76 Posted March 5, 2013 Is there such a tool to use with Photoshop! Awhile ago I came across this review of the CV12 on NEX by Photozone, and in it they describe how to fix the colour shift and vignetting problem in Photoshop. I have not tried it yet because at the time I decided to go with Cornerfix instead, because it worked on the RAW file itself. And I'm being lazy by trying to avoid any additional work in Photoshop whenever necessary. It might be worth a try. One other thought came to mind about the CV12 and vignetting. While trying it on the GXR, I was a bit unhappy about an aspect of edge performance. I don't recall if it was a sharpness issue, or some shading/colour shift (the GXR will colour shift, just that it tends to be blue rather than the much more annoying magenta seen with many other cameras). Since I was using this lens primarily for landscape type shots focused to infinity, I decide to try it instead focused to around 1.5 or 2m, but stopped down to f/8 or f/11, and found the results more pleasing. By focusing closer, the lens's rear element is moved slightly farther away from the sensor surface, which slightly reduces the angle of incidence. I've definitely seen this effect with both versions of the ZM21 on NEX when comparing focus at infinity and at minimum focusing distance. But of course, setting to minimum focusing distance is impractical for general use, rather it's an observation that colour shift definitely changes in severity depending on focus distance. On the GXR one's dealing only with an APS-C sensor, so the improvement I saw might have been just enough to reach the edge of the APS-C format, but not for a full frame sensor. I wonder if someone with the M could try the CV12 again, but at different focusing distances for the same scene, just to see if this might have a positive effect? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rscheffler Posted March 5, 2013 Share #77 Posted March 5, 2013 Chris,I grabbed a few white wall shots with the Summilux 21 yesterday: whilst the vignetting correction is not ideal (the corners are still darker than I'd like), there are no red edges to speak of. That's good to know. Regarding the vignetting character of the 21 Lux, I actually like it quite a lot. Interesting comparison tidbit: on the M9, at f/3.5, it exhibits less vignetting than the 21 SEM wide open. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rscheffler Posted March 5, 2013 Share #78 Posted March 5, 2013 I think Menos has 16mm f8 Hologon which is converted G lens, not original 1970s 15mm version. Yes, he has the converted G, but JeffoJeffo has the 15/8, and is also posting in 'the view through older glass' thread. Here's a colour shot with the M9 for an example of how bad the colour shift is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
menos I M6 Posted March 5, 2013 Share #79 Posted March 5, 2013 Yes, Luigi, both the rare 15 ƒ8 Hologon and properly converted M mount 16 ƒ8 Hologon can be used on the Leica M8, M9 and MM. With samples, where the rear protection shroud is not modified, the light meter of the digital M bodies will not reliably work, as the lens shadows the light path between metering cell and shutter curtain. I suppose, Leica understandably covers their bases by stating these lenses as not compatible with the digital M in the manual as these lenses are indeed extremely close to the shutter and won't work for colour photographs without third party software and a lot of effort. I use mine on the MM and absolutely love this lens, which pairs fantastically with the Mono. In fact, prior to getting the Hologon, I had absolutely zero interest in the M10. The very only interest in that camera was induced by the statement, that the new sensor design was of a flatter nature, more suited to wide-angle lenses. If it is correct though, that to accommodate long R lenses, Leica sacrificed the optimisation of the sensor for wide angle lenses, this would be a true pity. Who wants to shoot a telephoto lens with a measly EVF? I certainly do not. In my opinion, that optimisation should be kept for a digital R10, a camera much better suited for the use of long lenses. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
01af Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share #80 Posted March 5, 2013 If it is correct though, that to accommodate long R lenses, Leica sacrificed the optimisation of the sensor for wide angle lenses, this would be a true pity. What makes you think that this might be the case? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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