Ruhayat Posted May 26, 2012 Share #1 Â Posted May 26, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) I've been making plans for a 2-month backpacking trip through Myanmar, Thailand and Indochina which will start in June, and have settled on bringing the M7 with just a single 35mm lens, along with the Panasonic GF1 with just the 20mm/1.7 lens as backup, video and lowlight. Â I already have a CV Color Skopar 35mm/2.5 which mounted on the M7 fits in a belt pouch made for point and shoots. I also looked at other pancake alternatives, but other than the 40mm Summicron none of them would fit in the same pouch. Closest would be the Cron Type IV and Lux Type I. Â What struck me more, however, was that all these Leica lenses except the 28mm Elmarit are all secondhand. Why don't Leica produce a range of pancakes in the Summarit range? Wouldn't there be a niche for these? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 26, 2012 Posted May 26, 2012 Hi Ruhayat, Take a look here Why not new Summarit pancakes from Leica?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
lct Posted May 26, 2012 Share #2 Â Posted May 26, 2012 Would be great to have tiny wides a la CV. The Elmars 21/3.4 & 24/3.8 are very good but still bulky. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB_tx Posted May 27, 2012 Share #3 Â Posted May 27, 2012 That's why I still love my '69 V3 Summicron 35. The 35 1.4 CV I have is also very nice, and I often travel with it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted May 27, 2012 Share #4 Â Posted May 27, 2012 Size, performance and cost have a trade-off relationship. Â You cannot do a small, cheap and superb lens. Â Leica thinks (I guest) cheaper lenses is the natural market for other companies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted May 27, 2012 Share #5 Â Posted May 27, 2012 Size, performance and cost have a trade-off relationship. Â You cannot do a small, cheap and superb lens. [...] Â It can be done. Settle for a stop or two less speed and be happy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted May 27, 2012 Share #6 Â Posted May 27, 2012 Would be great to have tiny wides a la CV. The Elmars 21/3.4 & 24/3.8 are very good but still bulky. Its all relative;). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pico Posted May 27, 2012 Share #7 Â Posted May 27, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) Its all relative;). Â Ah hah! That explains why my brother is an only child! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill Posted May 27, 2012 Share #8 Â Posted May 27, 2012 You still can't beat the 50mm Elmar-M, IMO, for the perfect balance between compactness and performance. What use is the "best" lens in the World if it makes your camera too bulky to be with you at all times? Â Regards, Â Bill Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted May 27, 2012 Share #9 Â Posted May 27, 2012 Ditto for Elmarit 28/2.8 asph, Macro-Elmar 90/4 or even Summarit 50/2.5 perhaps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
masjah Posted May 27, 2012 Share #10  Posted May 27, 2012 I've been making plans for a 2-month backpacking trip through Myanmar, Thailand and Indochina which will start in June, and have settled on bringing the M7 with just a single 35mm lens, along with the Panasonic GF1 with just the 20mm/1.7 lens as backup, video and lowlight. I already have a CV Color Skopar 35mm/2.5 which mounted on the M7 fits in a belt pouch made for point and shoots. I also looked at other pancake alternatives, but other than the 40mm Summicron none of them would fit in the same pouch. Closest would be the Cron Type IV and Lux Type I.  What struck me more, however, was that all these Leica lenses except the 28mm Elmarit are all secondhand. Why don't Leica produce a range of pancakes in the Summarit range? Wouldn't there be a niche for these?  I think it's simply a question of cost versus performance. The Summarit's are a "budget" range, by Leica standards, but still managing really good performance. Lenses get more expensive to make (a) with increasing aperture ( at the extreme ends of focal length (whether very long or very short). Hence the aperture and avaiable focal lengths of the Summarits. Adding © a further constraint on the physical dimensions of the lens would just make things worse. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyalf Posted May 28, 2012 Share #11  Posted May 28, 2012 Hi,  You could go for the Perar lenses. Please see a photo below. I have had the 28mm for a few months now and used on M9 and NEX-5-N. The IQ is very good, and if you can live with f/4 the performance will do. I have recently compared resolution with the Leica 28/2,8 ASPH, but not published any results yet. The most significant difference is that the Leica is sharper in edges at all apertures., and have a tad better contrast. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/180350-why-not-new-summarit-pancakes-from-leica/?do=findComment&comment=2025188'>More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted May 28, 2012 Share #12 Â Posted May 28, 2012 I'm a huge fan of tiny lenses. How about a new version of the Elmar 35mm f3.5? Â I wonder how many would actually buy it, in this speed-frenzy world?! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carduelis Posted May 28, 2012 Share #13  Posted May 28, 2012 As a lifelong film and digital SLR user, I have become interested in Leica lenses recently because some of them are so compact and light. I have recently acquired three second hand Leica M lenses for my Ricoh GXR with A12 mount and battery/EVF (total weight: 425 g)  35 mm Summarit (effective focal length = 52 mm) weight 192 g, length 34 mm 24 mm F3.8 Elmar (eff focal length = 36 mm) weight 263 g, length 41/57 mm 75 mm Summarit (eff focal length = 112 mm) weight 323 g, length 60 mm  As a keen traveller/hiker and photographer, I can discretely carry most (if not all) of this kit in the 4 pockets of either my fleece or waterproof Goretex jacket. It makes a pleasing change from lumping a Canon 5D (mk 1) and 24-105 mm lens around comprising 1.6 kg of concentrated bulk. I am also absolutely thrilled by the image quality of this new lightweight system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted May 28, 2012 Share #14 Â Posted May 28, 2012 Would be great to have tiny wides a la CV. The Elmars 21/3.4 & 24/3.8 are very good but still bulky. Â There you go with "bulky" again. Just talk to Carduelis and he can tell you about bulky. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted May 28, 2012 Share #15 Â Posted May 28, 2012 Hi, Â You could go for the Perar lenses. Please see a photo below. I have had the 28mm for a few months now and used on M9 and NEX-5-N. The IQ is very good, and if you can live with f/4 the performance will do. I have recently compared resolution with the Leica 28/2,8 ASPH, but not published any results yet. The most significant difference is that the Leica is sharper in edges at all apertures., and have a tad better contrast. Â Now that IS a tiny lens. It looks thinner than a Leica rear lens cap. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
algrove Posted May 28, 2012 Share #16 Â Posted May 28, 2012 Size, performance and cost have a trade-off relationship. Â You cannot do a small, cheap and superb lens. Â Leica thinks (I guest) cheaper lenses is the natural market for other companies. Â Well put Rosuna and how true, especially your last sentence. Sometimes we get mutually exclusive items. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruhayat Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share #17 Â Posted May 28, 2012 Hi, Â You could go for the Perar lenses. Please see a photo below. I have had the 28mm for a few months now and used on M9 and NEX-5-N. The IQ is very good, and if you can live with f/4 the performance will do. I have recently compared resolution with the Leica 28/2,8 ASPH, but not published any results yet. The most significant difference is that the Leica is sharper in edges at all apertures., and have a tad better contrast. Â Yes, I did consider that. But when I asked Rangefinder Forum (RFF) members, I was advised to stick to the Color Skopar instead, as they said compared to the Perar it has better IQ and does not stick out that much more after all (after taking into account the hood on the Perar). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruhayat Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share #18  Posted May 28, 2012 I'm a huge fan of tiny lenses. How about a new version of the Elmar 35mm f3.5? I wonder how many would actually buy it, in this speed-frenzy world?!  I am a big fan of keeping my M's as compact as possible. With the 35mm Color Skopar P-II my M7 fits in a pouch made for point and shoots, and this impresses the hell out of my DSLR toting friends. Haha.  I wonder if Leica could just rework the old 35mm Cron Type IV, Lux Type I and 40mm Cron into the modern Summarit casing. I have tried the 40mm Cron before and found it to be plenty sharp. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruhayat Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share #19  Posted May 28, 2012 As a lifelong film and digital SLR user, I have become interested in Leica lenses recently because some of them are so compact and light. I have recently acquired three second hand Leica M lenses for my Ricoh GXR with A12 mount and battery/EVF (total weight: 425 g)... As a keen traveller/hiker and photographer, I can discretely carry most (if not all) of this kit in the 4 pockets of either my fleece or waterproof Goretex jacket...  This is my goal, too. Except that my M7 + 35mm lens now fits in the pocket of my cargo pants! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruhayat Posted May 28, 2012 Author Share #20 Â Posted May 28, 2012 Size, performance and cost have a trade-off relationship. Â You cannot do a small, cheap and superb lens. Â Leica thinks (I guest) cheaper lenses is the natural market for other companies. Â That's why I said make the pancakes under the Summarit line. So what if they will end up with slower apertures? We buy pancakes not for speed or ultimate IQ, but for the sheer compactness of the package. Besides, the Cron Type IV, Lux Type I and Cron 40mm are all practically pancake sized. So how hard would it be to make an f2.5 or even f4 pancake today? Â I'm reasonably happy with the Color Skopar. But I'm a confirmed Leica snob - if Leica made pancakes, I'd trade in the Color Skopar in a heartbeat. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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