M9 on tripod - bottom part broken anyone else ?

[rob_x2004]

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or am I being blind ?

 

Sure. The body shell failure could be manufacturing metalurgy, casting or machining imperfection, bump that happens in assembly, the base cam being too tight or too loose, an owners bump. Its all just clutching at straws. Certainly the failure is not going to show under the weight of the baseplate, or when the camera is sitting on the table. It is going to evidence itself when you have the camera on a tripod with something heavy attached.

 

Theres little doubt that theoretically the body shell should not fail theres plenty of metal even with the biggest of lenses. You can swing and people have swung a volvo from a glass hook (20mm I think?) providing the hook is perfect. Sensible people realize there are sensible alternatives at a fraction of the cost and that do not fail as catastrophically when things cant always be perfect.

 

As with he magenta issue, Leica would have known the implications of their work prior to release, they just made a mistake in assessing the ramification, and were probably in a hurry, or on drugs. They probably figured no one would ever use the camera I dont know ask them.

[andybarton]

As with he magenta issue, Leica would have known the implications of their work prior to release, they just made a mistake in assessing the ramification, and were probably in a hurry, or on drugs. They probably figured no one would ever use the camera I dont know ask them.

 

For goodness sake...

[jaapv]

Sure. The body shell failure could be manufacturing metalurgy, casting or machining imperfection, bump that happens in assembly, the base cam being too tight or too loose, an owners bump. Its all just clutching at straws. Certainly the failure is not going to show under the weight of the baseplate, or when the camera is sitting on the table. It is going to evidence itself when you have the camera on a tripod with something heavy attached.

 

Theres little doubt that theoretically the body shell should not fail theres plenty of metal even with the biggest of lenses. You can swing and people have swung a volvo from a glass hook (20mm I think?) providing the hook is perfect. Sensible people realize there are sensible alternatives at a fraction of the cost and that do not fail as catastrophically when things cant always be perfect.

 

As with he magenta issue, Leica would have known the implications of their work prior to release, they just made a mistake in assessing the ramification, and were probably in a hurry, or on drugs. They probably figured no one would ever use the camera I dont know ask them.

 

Major Tom calling Ground Control.....

[Guest stnami]

Jaap you are stretching it a bit calling yourself Major Tom.................delusions

[rob_x2004]

So what you are saying then Andy, Jaap, they are just incompetent?

At least I only said they were caught out being lazy.

Anyway, its only a five thousand dollar camera, the space shuttle doesnt ride on it. Whats it matter.

[farnz]

... Whats it matter.

Who says it matters?

 

If you have number 1 or 2 or 3 out of some 20,000 M8s sold whose body shell fails then that's unfortunate but, as happened with Billh, Leica will replace it. Move on.

 

That means that there are 19.998 out of 20,000 whose body shells haven't failed, doesn't it? Let's keep a sense of proportion.

 

Pete.

[rob_x2004]

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Nahh...its only two or three out of the Leica forum demographic, who tend not to be tripod toters. Extend that out, then the stats are looking pretty sick. Plus the one that was cracked but not broken which kicked all this off with Bills original post, the one that was painted up (Leica or the dealer) and was sold purchased dealer new remember that?

This site should have more than just the four smilies per reply limit.

The sensible perspective is ... wear a seat belt.

[farnz]

... Extend that out, then the stats are looking pretty sick. ...

That's a large assumption and is similar to assuming that because:

1. there's life on earth (or so I'm reliably informed )

2. and we can see, say 10,000 stars in the night sky (insert accurate figure)

3. and we estimate that there are, I dunno, 10,000,000,000 stars in the known universe (again, insert accurate figure)

4. there must be 10,000.000.000/10,000 = 1,000,000 stars with life on them

 

Of course that might be right and they might all be reading this thread (Hi, guys!) but it seems unlikely.

 

... The sensible perspective is ... wear a seat belt.

Nah, Rob, cos then you end up on Plant Mighthappen, which is not a place I ever want to visit, because it's the start of the slippery slope. I'd end up not being able to cross roads because I might get run over, and then I'd read an article that says that 95% of people die away from their home so I'd never be able to leave my house and then I'd see a tv documentary that says that 80% of people who die in their homes die in their beds ... you see where this is going?

 

Pete.

[Guest stnami]

I'd read an article that says that

....yea that's it some of you guys read too many articles and your belief systems are gefooked

[Kasimir]

....yea that's it some of you guys read too many articles and your belief systems are gefooked

 

should be outgefooked, Yorrick

[AlanG]

Who says it matters?

 

If you have number 1 or 2 or 3 out of some 20,000 M8s sold whose body shell fails then that's unfortunate but, as happened with Billh, Leica will replace it. Move on.

 

That means that there are 19.998 out of 20,000 whose body shells haven't failed, doesn't it? Let's keep a sense of proportion.

 

Pete.

 

 

What are the odds that 4 body castings would fail and just happen to be exclusively among the readers of this M8 forum?

[farnz]

What are the odds that 4 body castings would fail and just happen to be exclusively among the readers of this M8 forum?

Alan,

 

Perhaps reasonable since this is where a high proportion of M8 users congregate. I'm not suggesting that there aren't others 'in the wild' but there's no evidence to suggest that this problem is endemic yet is there?

 

But if, for instance, Leica had said to me before I purchased my M8 that: "Out of every 20,000 M8s we make the castings on 4 of them will fail and we'll replace the camera." then I would have still bought the M8.

 

If they'd said 1,000 out of every 20,000 then I might not have bought it. Each of us will have a figure that we would deem acceptable but I'd guess that we're nowhere near that figure on the confirmed reports that have emerged so far.

 

Pete.

[leitz_not_leica]

As an engineer, I must admit the body looks pretty weak.

[farnz]

As an engineer, I must admit the body looks pretty weak.

As an engineer would you care to qualify what you mean please?

 

Pete.

[gfspencer]

Nahh...its only two or three out of the Leica forum demographic, who tend not to be tripod toters.

I'm one who does not use a tripod. Who is the other one?

 

I do use the Leica grip base plate.

[wlaidlaw]

As an engineer would you care to qualify what you mean please?

 

Pete.

 

Pete, as someone who also trained as an engineer and metallurgist, albeit many years ago but has in the intervening years spent a long time working and rebuilding various racing cars, I can see what Leitz not Leica might be getting at.

 

When you latch the base plate, the immediate load goes onto the brass rubbing plate, which is held with two small screws onto the crescent shaped extension of the lower left hand side of the front clamshell. The vertical load of the latching is transmitted to the open edge of the the front diecasting, especially if you have not correctly engaged the location lug at the opposite end of the base plate .

 

Now if they had made the the latch lock by turning anti-clockwise rather than clockwise as at present, the load would have been transmitted to the continuous front edge of the diecasting. I feel that this could have made for a stronger latch. If you look at Bill's photos, the front clamshell seems to have broken from the open edge. If they had done as I suggest, they could also had had a lug on the back half of the clamshell, to which a lengthened brass rubbing strip could have been fixed, to strengthen the whole mechanism further.

 

It is very easy for these sorts of thing to slip past in development, as testers often use a product in a particular, maybe knowledgeable way, which the general user will not emulate. We will all have come across howlers in cars, where we have said "how could that have got past the testers?" Years ago I had an Alfa Romeo 75, where the accelerator pedal was only comfortable when the pedal was to the the metal, because that was the way that all Alfa testers drove.

 

Wilson

[terrycioni]

I'm one who does not use a tripod. Who is the other one?

 

I do use the Leica grip base plate.

 

I have read this thread with interest only - I have not used a tripod on the M8 and I have been trying to recollect using a tripod on various film Ms. That said if this is an extensive problem for the M8 (so far I am not convinced) it needs to be addressed formally by Leica AG. I have noticed that this thread has taken off across the Internet - as - yet another black eye for the M8 and by extension Leica AG.

 

Best To All. Terry.

[farnz]

Wilson,

 

Thanks for your detailed explanation. I merely felt that the nebulous comment from Leitz not Leica deserved to be allowed to regain its self-respect with an expansion.

 

Pete.

[ho_co]

... if this is an extensive problem for the M8 (so far I am not convinced) it needs to be addressed formally by Leica AG. I have noticed that this thread has taken off across the Internet - as - yet another black eye for the M8 and by extension Leica AG.

Terry--

Very well said. But so far, I think we're aware of four or perhaps only three examples of this occurrence. Similarly, I think we're aware of four cases of M8 shutters self-destructing, though in one of those, Leica ruled that it was a user-caused event. These aren't big numbers.

 

Andreas has said he will let us know if and when Solms takes a stand on the matter. As long as cases are few, Leica can't take a position.

 

As for others citing this as a black eye for Leica, that's a pity, but it's not Leica's problem. There will always be uninformed people. It's up to us to set them straight where possible.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[offshore]

Most of my M8 photography is done using a dense IR filter necessitating long exposures so my M8 has been mounted on a tripod both the horizontal and vertical positions. I've been doing this for almost two years and at times with a very heavy Canon 55 mm F1.2 lens mounted. My tripod went over once with my 28 mm F2.8 Elmarit on it and my M8 still has no scratches, dents or base plate failures. It still works perfectly. It is too bad that this has happened to you but, although this same thread has taken off with the Leica M8 bashers on photo.net, I think it is a very isolated problem and I hope that Leica fixes it for you.