lct Posted August 20, 2011 Share #21 Posted August 20, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Coué method? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted August 20, 2011 Posted August 20, 2011 Hi lct, Take a look here Will the M8s be collecting dust in 10 years?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Nick_S Posted August 20, 2011 Share #22 Posted August 20, 2011 ... I still have (and use) a HP calculator that is about 30 year old, I am sure I will retire with it in 15 years time. If only digital Leicas could have the longevity and continuing functionality of a classic HP calculator. I still have and use my HPs (a 21 year-old 28s and a 17-year old 48GX) regularly. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkP Posted August 20, 2011 Share #23 Posted August 20, 2011 If only digital Leicas could have the longevity and continuing functionality of a classic HP calculator. I still have and use my HPs (a 21 year-old 28s and a 17-year old 48GX) regularly.Nick ...and their battery life! My HP32S is also still going after 20 years with 3-5 year battery changes. I should add that the 41CX+ emulation app for the iPhone is quite convenient, but my iPhone will only survive one to three years if I'm lucky. A good analogy though, RPN is about as well understood by the punters as rangefinder focusing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clook Posted August 20, 2011 Share #24 Posted August 20, 2011 All things must pass. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenPatterson Posted August 21, 2011 Share #25 Posted August 21, 2011 The M8 in 10 years will be as the M5 is today, still relatively expensive and still being bought and used. The M8, just like the M5, was an imperfect trail blazer with an incredible lineage and lots of positive attributes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronan Posted August 21, 2011 Share #26 Posted August 21, 2011 I give it 5 years... and it's a paperweight (broken or not broken). Digital doesn't hold value... thats why i collect film camera's. My brand new D3 cost me around $5000 USD + taxes when it came out. I sold it for $2500 cash after a couple years (i think 3 years?). Something like 50k actuation's... in VERY good condition. M8 was something like $4800 when it came out. I can get a M8.2 with low wear for around $2300-2600 (friend paid $2500 for his almost brand new M8.2...). Give it another 2-3 years, you'll be grabbing M8's for around$1500. You want value? Buy Leica lenses. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenPatterson Posted August 21, 2011 Share #27 Posted August 21, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I can get a M8.2 with low wear for around $2300-2600 (friend paid $2500 for his almost brand new M8.2...). $2300-$2600 is a very good price for an genuine M8.2 (not M8u). A black M8.2 sold 2 days ago on ebay for $2975 and a dealer bought my chrome M8.2 for $3000 in June (which he instantly sold for just under $3500). I think M8.2s have done an excellent job of holding value. I agree that most digital cameras depreciate like meteorites, but I also believe that Leica digital M cameras are an exception and will outperform the used digital market. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted August 21, 2011 Share #28 Posted August 21, 2011 I give it 5 years... and it's a paperweight (broken or not broken). Digital doesn't hold value... thats why i collect film camera's. Well, that's the flaw in your reasoning; some of us own cameras to actually take pictures, not to collect or invest. My 2 M8.2s are 3 years old and barely broken in. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkP Posted August 21, 2011 Share #29 Posted August 21, 2011 Yes, but to some extent the argument is moot. However, I would apply the same logic to the M9 and future digital Leicas, as to the M8. If one wants to shoot M-Leica digital instead of film (to use or collect) one buys an M8 or M9, and the argument about camera longevity is irrelevant because there are no real options. Obviously, unlike their mechanical film predecessors, Forget about depreciation, I think that these digital Leicas need to be viewed as relatively disposable, and will not be used in 50 years time, probably not in 5 to 10 years. Someone argued in another thread that these cameras, despite their cost, are basically computers attached to a light sensor. We use our computers until it they can no longer do what we need, or newer technology makes an upgrade worthwhile, or they are not economical to service. Realistically, who expects to be using the same computer in 5, let alone 10 years. No-one really complains about this reality. Issues with in-camera electronics, sensors, software, data storage, and compatibility with computers, data transfer compatibility and technology, etc will all progress. Welcome to the modern age. As per Ronan, that's why we prizes our Leica lenses so:) Mark ps: I thin the comparison with the M5 is not valid as the basic technology of image production with film cameras has not changed. It is not a computer with a lens mount. The M5, like any other film camera with electronics, will be used until components for repair are no longer available. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bocaburger Posted August 21, 2011 Share #30 Posted August 21, 2011 What's the parts/repair situation with the DMR at this point? That might be one way to predict how Leica will support the M8 down the road. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StephenPatterson Posted August 21, 2011 Share #31 Posted August 21, 2011 I thin(k) the comparison with the M5 is not valid as the basic technology of image production with film cameras has not changed. It is not a computer with a lens mount. The M5, like any other film camera with electronics, will be used until components for repair are no longer available. An interesting point, but I would venture that in 20-30 years you are much more likely to be able to find and use SD cards than film, chemicals, or processing labs. The M8 is much more than just a computer, just as the M5 is more than just a light box. In the future I imagine that photographers will be challenged to use older digital Leica Ms to express their creativity in a world where focus, exposure and noise are fully adjustable and correctable. Film, incandescent light bulbs, and typewriters will all be distant memories when people are still shooting photos with M8s. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
niarfe Posted August 21, 2011 Share #32 Posted August 21, 2011 I still use my 11 years old Mac CUBE.... and works great For more speed an to serious work I have a MacPro Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronan Posted August 21, 2011 Share #33 Posted August 21, 2011 Well, that's the flaw in your reasoning; some of us own cameras to actually take pictures, not to collect or invest. My 2 M8.2s are 3 years old and barely broken in. Jeff What flaw? I take pictures daily with my camera's. The ONLY camera i never used is a old movie camera. My 1 terabyte external hdd is full of pictures taken, and my 500 gig x2 HDD are almost full (need to upgrade). So if you think i collect and don't shoot, you couldn't be more wrong. If anything, i have a very small collection for my own enjoyment, simply because i love to shoot different camera's for different shooting experience (and results). If you have 2 M8.2 that are 3 years old and are barely broken in. Maybe you should go shoot more... My gear is used a lot, and doesn't show sign of abuse because i take care of it. Nice try though. Now go shoot like i'm about to do. Rain or snow hasn't stop me yet Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff S Posted August 21, 2011 Share #34 Posted August 21, 2011 What flaw? I take pictures daily with my camera's. The ONLY camera i never used is a old movie camera. My 1 terabyte external hdd is full of pictures taken, and my 500 gig x2 HDD are almost full (need to upgrade). So if you think i collect and don't shoot, you couldn't be more wrong. If anything, i have a very small collection for my own enjoyment, simply because i love to shoot different camera's for different shooting experience (and results). If you have 2 M8.2 that are 3 years old and are barely broken in. Maybe you should go shoot more... My gear is used a lot, and doesn't show sign of abuse because i take care of it. Nice try though. Now go shoot like i'm about to do. Rain or snow hasn't stop me yet Perhaps you should read the two sentences I quoted from your own post. You say you collect film cameras because digital cameras (specifically the M8) will "become a paperweight in 5 years." The point about my cameras is that they get tons of use, thanks, and still show no sign of breaking down. Hardly a paperweight in 5 years. That's just wrong. Plus, I don't collect any cameras; I prefer to collect photographs and books, and just use cameras. Jeff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted August 21, 2011 Share #35 Posted August 21, 2011 What's the parts/repair situation with the DMR at this point? That might be one way to predict how Leica will support the M8 down the road. The DMR was made by a third party, who can't play with Leica any more. The digital Ms do not suffer in the same way. Their fate s entirely in Leica's hands. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted August 21, 2011 Share #36 Posted August 21, 2011 The digital Ms do not suffer in the same way. Their fate s entirely in Leica's hands. Only up to a point. The digital cameras are still made up of numerous components (most obviously the sensor) that Leica cannot make themselves and have to buy in from third parties. Leica will only be able to repair the M8 for as long a they have a stock of spare parts and/or other M8 bodies to cannibalise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted August 21, 2011 Share #37 Posted August 21, 2011 Yes, but at least they are assembled in Leica factories. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
glacierparkmagazine Posted August 21, 2011 Share #38 Posted August 21, 2011 In 2001 my newspaper was one of the first in Montana to go digital. We got a brand new Nikon D1. Guess where it is now? Stuck in my office drawer. But it still works! (If you like purplish trees). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted August 22, 2011 Share #39 Posted August 22, 2011 Only up to a point. The digital cameras are still made up of numerous components (most obviously the sensor) that Leica cannot make themselves and have to buy in from third parties. Leica will only be able to repair the M8 for as long a they have a stock of spare parts and/or other M8 bodies to cannibalise.Quite correct. And I am sure that Leica has calculated failure rate/ planned camera lifespan/stock needed for those parts. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bpalme Posted August 22, 2011 Author Share #40 Posted August 22, 2011 In 2001 my newspaper was one of the first in Montana to go digital. We got a brand new Nikon D1. Guess where it is now? Stuck in my office drawer. But it still works! (If you like purplish trees). Yeah but things have changed quite a bit.. similar to computers in the 90s. Every year or two they were advancing so fast... but it reached a point where you didn't need to buy a computer every two years. I have a 10 year old PC that can still do a pretty good job although I mostly us a newer Mac. There's a huge difference between a 1995 computer and a 2001 computer. My M8 with 5 year old technology does much better than a new Olympus EP-3. Ten years from now the new Leica M will certainly have better high ISO, general features and better this and that... but for most photography I don't see it being light years ahead. The glass and precision in the rangefinder itself is probably the most expensive part of the camera.. so as long as the sensor doesn't die it would be nice if any minor solder breaks or what have you can be repaired for a long long time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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