new 50 Summicron close?

[Shootist]

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Close to launch, or close to actually being available? Two distinctly different questions in Leicaland

 

With the current Summicron having doubled in price over the last few years, I wonder how much a new one will cost, and how much better it can possibly be in real-world performance. The Noctilux and Summilux were both somewhat old designs with some readily apparent room for significant improvement (signature preferences aside---I'm a big fan of the pre-Lux and no desire to own the new one), whereas the Summicron is pretty close to the Summilux ASPH (some say better at some apertures) already.

 

Not sure where you are getting your info but the 50 Lux ASPH is not a older design. And although the Cron is a much older design and a very good lens it is not in the same class as the Lux.

[RobertJRB]

Not sure where you are getting your info but the 50 Lux ASPH is not a older design. And although the Cron is a much older design and a very good lens it is not in the same class as the Lux.

 

He doesn't say the lux asph is a older design, but says the pre asph was an old design.

[nggalai]

He doesn't say the lux asph is a older design, but says the pre asph was an old design.

 

… as was the Noctilux f/1.0, hence they launched the Summilux ASPH and Nocti f/0.95 as a revision of those designs made sense. I wonder how such a revision would make sense in the case of the current Summicron, though.

 

But then, the Summarit 50mm is pretty close, IQ-wise, from about f/4 onwards, and much less expensive. Others find performance comparable already at f/2.8. So in light of the Summarit-M and the Summilux ASPH, the current Summicron looks somewhat redundant – if you need faster speeds than f/2.5 the Cron won’t help all that much and you’re better served by the Lux. If you don’t, the Summarit is cheaper, lighter, and more compact than the Cron.

 

Leica might slightly update the Cron simply because it has a great legacy and many fans, yours truly included. Personally though I wouldn’t be surprised if the new 50/F2.0 will be much more compact and lighter than the current Cron. If Leica manages to also make it render similarly to the “Rigid” range, they might have a winner.

 

Suspense! I, for one, would welcome our new 2.0 overlord.

[lct]

The Summicron 50 is rather soft on edges and corners at f/2. The Summilux asph and all other Summicrons (current 28, 35, 75 & 90) are sharper there at f/2. Same for the Summarit at f/2.5. Such a discrepancy should not last much longer IMHO.

[bocaburger]

And although the Cron is a much older design and a very good lens it is not in the same class as the Lux.

 

Your definition and mine of "in the same class" are evidently quite different. I'll grant you that at it's current price of $2000 I wouldn't buy the Summicron though. Thankfully I've already got one, for which I paid $700 (mint, used) just a few years ago. Although the prices of all Leica lenses today is galling, it's doubly so IMHO for lenses that have been on the market for decades and perform the same as they did when they cost half or less.

[el.nino]

You guys know that there already was a beta 50 Summicron Asph.?

This was in the early 2000s. Leica decided that the production cost wouldn't justify the performance gain and the design resulted in the first 35 Summilux Asph.

[bbbonthemoon]

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Well, since summarit took the place of entry level cheap 50 lens,

I'm sure more expensive 50 summicron asph is on its way

[UliWer]

You didn't mention what your definition is of "far back" so I can't contradict you, but I can say that in mid-2007 my dealer had several new 50 Crons in stock for $1095 . Today the price is $2000, if you can find one in stock and the dealer is nice enough not to ask a premium. To me that's close enough to call it double.

 

I follow the geman price lists.

 

The present price of the 50 Summicron is 1595,- €. The price in mid 2007 was 1300,- €.

 

In 1995 it was 1578,- DM, which is approximately half the price it costs in Euro now.

[lct]

...Leica decided that the production cost wouldn't justify the performance gain...

Was about 10 years ago. Now the question is not if, but when IMHO.

[Shootist]

Your definition and mine of "in the same class" are evidently quite different. I'll grant you that at it's current price of $2000 I wouldn't buy the Summicron though. Thankfully I've already got one, for which I paid $700 (mint, used) just a few years ago. Although the prices of all Leica lenses today is galling, it's doubly so IMHO for lenses that have been on the market for decades and perform the same as they did when they cost half or less.

 

I got your original post, before you edited it, in a email and I can tell you from personal experience, having owned and used both lenses at the same time, the cron is no match for the Lux. I liked the images cron very much but when I got the Lux ASPH I stopped using the cron. So I sold it. I've also had the Elmarit f/2.8 and the Lux at the same time. I used the Elmarit more then I used the Cron but in the end I always went back to the Lux. So I sold the Elmarit.

[kemal_mumcu]

If Leica gives the new 50 cron something special like collapsibility or close up ability with goggles, plus an increase in performance I can see that there would be a spot in the lens catalog for a new 50 cron. Personally I'd love to see a collapsible cron harking back to the days of way back yonder - but with modern technology and imaging capability of course.

[Guest]

You guys know that there already was a beta 50 Summicron Asph.?

This was in the early 2000s. Leica decided that the production cost wouldn't justify the performance gain and the design resulted in the first 35 Summilux Asph.

 

It would be interesting to read here the source of your information.

 

If Leica gives the new 50 cron something special like... close up ability (with goggles?), plus an increase in performance I can see that there would be a spot in the lens catalog for a new 50 cron.

 

+1 if it came in the size of the Summarit 50mm

[lars_bergquist]

The move from the Collapsible Summicron to the Rigid was no fashion decision. The collapsible mount was not stable enough for a f/2 design. It did also limit the diameters of the rear lens elements, which was bad for performance. Also, with the M3, the Leica had ceased to be a pocketable camera, so the feature was not too meaningful. So you won't see a collapsible 50mm Summicron.

 

I think in fact that making the 90mm Macro-Elmar collapsible was a deplorable mistake. I would have bought that lens if in a reasonable mount.

 

The old man from the Collapsible Age

[k_g_wolf ✝]

It would be interesting to read here the source of your information.

 

 

This has been told by P. KARBE in a lecture for

LEICA Historica, Germany, app. in Oct. 2006.

 

But I wouldn´t be surprised at all, in fact quite the opposite,

if you would not find this info in the world of Mr. PUTS as well.

 

 

Best

GEORG

[bocaburger]

I can tell you from personal experience, having owned and used both lenses at the same time, the cron is no match for the Lux.

 

I hope what you actually mean is "In my opinion the cron is no match for the Lux." My opinion, which I phrase as such, and having also used both extensively together, is in disagreement with yours. I'll agree that with purposeful testing and scrutiny I could discern slight improvement in contrast farther out to the corners at f/2 with the Lux-ASPH, but not enough that, again in my opinion, I would place them in different leagues other than for the fact the Lux is one stop faster. As a scale of where I would put lenses in different leagues, or call them "no match" for one another, that would be comparing the Lux-ASPH to the pre-ASPH. And yet, the pre-ASPH has a certain rendering (perhaps due to all those uncorrected aberrations) I happen to prefer in those situations where I shoot at f/1.4. While I have no quarrel with Leica aspiring to perfection in terms of removing aberrations, there are times where in my opinion it isn't always in the best interest of the artistic/pictorial aspect of my photography. For others, optical perfection is the prime criterion, and I have no quarrel with that either.

[asmith]

The Macro Elmar doesn't have to be collapsed; I never collapse mine and it seems as stable as any non- collapsable lens.

Alwyn

[lct]

The Macro Elmar doesn't have to be collapsed; I never collapse mine and it seems as stable as any non- collapsable lens....

I collapse mine the same way as i've always done with my 50+ years old Elmar 90/4. Where is the problem if i may ask. Just curious.

[Shootist]

I hope what you actually mean is "In my opinion the cron is no match for the Lux." My opinion, which I phrase as such, and having also used both extensively together, is in disagreement with yours. I'll agree that with purposeful testing and scrutiny I could discern slight improvement in contrast farther out to the corners at f/2 with the Lux-ASPH, but not enough that, again in my opinion, I would place them in different leagues other than for the fact the Lux is one stop faster. As a scale of where I would put lenses in different leagues, or call them "no match" for one another, that would be comparing the Lux-ASPH to the pre-ASPH. And yet, the pre-ASPH has a certain rendering (perhaps due to all those uncorrected aberrations) I happen to prefer in those situations where I shoot at f/1.4. While I have no quarrel with Leica aspiring to perfection in terms of removing aberrations, there are times where in my opinion it isn't always in the best interest of the artistic/pictorial aspect of my photography. For others, optical perfection is the prime criterion, and I have no quarrel with that either.

 

 

Well then there is something wrong with your Lux ASPH.

[bocaburger]

 

Well then there is something wrong with your Lux ASPH.

 

Or your Summicron?

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Hallo,

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