dhsimmonds Posted June 23, 2011 Share #61 Posted June 23, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Huh? The R system has never supported AF and R lenses have to be focused manually when using those lenses with an EVIL body; even Leica cannot change that. AF will require dedicated AF lenses. I think that Leica realised some time ago that to maximise their market opportunities, they needed to be in the AF game. Many of the top pro DSLR's with AF lenses are quite capable of manual focus as they have large and very good optical viewfinders with replaceable screens if necessary. Whether this is achievable with the very latest EVF designs will have to be seen next year at Photokina! My Fuji X100 (fixed lens) is quite capable of managing MF as well as a perfectly good AF, so the technology exists and will improve before the next Photokina! Leica have a lot to do before then, not least of which is a decent range of interchangeable AF/MF lenses. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 23, 2011 Posted June 23, 2011 Hi dhsimmonds, Take a look here Compact interchangeable lens camera coming 09/12. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
phancj Posted June 23, 2011 Share #62 Posted June 23, 2011 Huh? The R system has never supported AF and R lenses have to be focused manually when using those lenses with an EVIL body; even Leica cannot change that. AF will require dedicated AF lenses. Exactly. So the system must be designed from ground up and adaptors used for R lenses or M lenses(with manual focus only, hence my statement). Apart from existing R and M lens owners new adopters of the system will likely just buy the new AF lenses. Anyone care to wager on pricing? I am thinking US$3500 for the body, given leica's current pricing of other lines. CJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveleo Posted June 23, 2011 Share #63 Posted June 23, 2011 Andreas . . . . you are going to need more server space to support this thread until Photokina 2012 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted June 23, 2011 Share #64 Posted June 23, 2011 Didn't he say 'at least' aps-c? So it could be aps-c after all. It could be. There are excellent APS-C sensors available so if everything else fails they could fall back on that. APS-C is the lower and 36 x 24 mm the upper limit – Leica didn’t mention the latter but it seems likely. Between those lower and upper bounds pretty much anything is possible. I'd guess made by panasonic on behalf of Leica. Panasonic doesn’t manufacture APS-C sensors and has no need for larger sensors (larger than FourThirds). This would be a huge R&D effort for Panasonic for no obvious benefit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted June 23, 2011 Author Share #65 Posted June 23, 2011 I don't recall reading anywhere that this future camera would accept R lenses Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phancj Posted June 23, 2011 Share #66 Posted June 23, 2011 Seems leica just needs to look at the X1 and tweak it for interchangeable lens. I am thinking still an APS-C sensor from sony. Andy, there will be third party makers who will likely make a mount that allow for M/R lenses to be mounted. CJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted June 23, 2011 Share #67 Posted June 23, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) So the system must be designed from ground up and adaptors used for R lenses or M lenses(with manual focus only, hence my statement). Apart from existing R and M lens owners new adopters of the system will likely just buy the new AF lenses. Yep. But that is what I had always envisoned the solution for R lenses to be. Leica may offer better support for R lenses than the currently available adapters for other systems provide, but R (and M) lenses will never autofocus (with a movable sensor, say, Contax-style). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phancj Posted June 23, 2011 Share #68 Posted June 23, 2011 Yep. But that is what I had always envisoned the solution for R lenses to be. Leica may offer better support for R lenses than the currently available adapters for other systems provide, but R (and M) lenses will never autofocus (with a movable sensor, say, Contax-style). Michael, but R lenses are comparatively huge and has no possibility of AF, so leica has to build a new system but then make or let 3rd party make a mount so existing R lens owners can be satisfied. Remember that this camera has to be compact has announced so I would imagine it to be smaller than an M system (M9) since it is APS-C, not FF. I would think leica MUST make the new system one with AF, or the camera cannot take off in the mainstream market, which appears to be what leica is aiming at with this cam. So any compatibility with R lenses must be done as an afterthought. CJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted June 23, 2011 Share #69 Posted June 23, 2011 I don't recall reading anywhere that this future camera would accept R lenses It’s only conjecture – if this new system isn’t the suggested solution for R lenses then nothing will be; it is just not conceivable that Leica would develop two different EVIL systems. I have always said that the solution for R lenses couldn’t very well be just that; as such it wouldn’t be any more viable than the R10 was. Compatibility with R lenses would have to be a bonus, something R photographers would fancy but that could easily be ignored by other photographers who would still be attracted by other features of the new system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted June 23, 2011 Share #70 Posted June 23, 2011 Remember that this camera has to be compact has announced so I would imagine it to be smaller than an M system (M9) since it is APS-C, not FF. It could be smaller than the M9 even with a FF sensor. These days the main factors limiting miniaturization are the display size and usability considerations – you can design rather small bodies if you do away with dials and buttons and rely on a touch screen alone. The question, of course, is whether one finds that attractive. Battery size is also a factor, especially when a live-view camera is more power-hungry than a traditional rangefinder or DSLR. I would think leica MUST make the new system one with AF, or the camera cannot take off in the mainstream market, which appears to be what leica is aiming at with this cam. So any compatibility with R lenses must be done as an afterthought. Exactly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted June 23, 2011 Share #71 Posted June 23, 2011 Making it with a CMOS sensor of M8 size would be imho a smart choice... a way to "make something different" as thay say... a way to avoid strict comparision with Sony Fuij Samsung etc... a way to "blink" to M users and convincing them to buy. I think the main issue is to have a GOOD EVF... Yes a (very) good EVF and fast focus capabilities for AF, M & R lenses would be interesting indeed. Not sure if APS-H is a must though. I prefer APS-C personally. With APS-H, 50mm lenses are either too wide or too long to me and whilst i can do most of my pics with 2 focal lengths on APS-C (28/50) i find myself compelled to bring 3 of them with APS-H (28/35/75 or 28/40/75) and my superb 50s remain on the shelf or APS-C bodies. APS-H is probably more bling though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
phancj Posted June 23, 2011 Share #72 Posted June 23, 2011 If it is smaller than the M9 even with an APS-C it will be an extremely attractive proposition if FF, wow! though I suppose pricing will be a major consideration so I am thinking it must be somewhere nested between an X1 and the M9 for it to have more mainstream appeal. Some have said that the X1 lens is built in Asia and leica just needs to develop a range of lenses built to that quality, not quite the M-lenses quality but pretty good enough for many. And priced right Meaning low enough to attract, but still profitable since not made in solms). CJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted June 23, 2011 Share #73 Posted June 23, 2011 Panasonic doesn’t manufacture APS-C sensors and has no need for larger sensors (larger than FourThirds). This would be a huge R&D effort for Panasonic for no obvious benefit. Sorry, I was thinking more of assembly by Panasonic. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsrockit Posted June 23, 2011 Share #74 Posted June 23, 2011 Does anyone think this will have manual focus properly implemented? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhsimmonds Posted June 23, 2011 Share #75 Posted June 23, 2011 Well Steve, Panasonic didn't make the X1 which also uses an older spec. APS-c sensor. I was also under the impression that Leica employed an ex-Panasonic designer to develop the X1 and this perhaps will be his second mainstream Leica product? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted June 23, 2011 Author Share #76 Posted June 23, 2011 Sorry, I was thinking more of assembly by Panasonic. I would expect it to be made in the same place as the X1. Lenses too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 23, 2011 Share #77 Posted June 23, 2011 Yes a (very) good EVF and fast focus capabilities for AF, M & R lenses would be interesting indeed. Not sure if APS-H is a must though. I prefer APS-C personally. With APS-H, 50mm lenses are either too wide or too long to me and whilst i can do most of my pics with 2 focal lengths on APS-C (28/50) i find myself compelled to bring 3 of them with APS-H (28/35/75 or 28/40/75) and my superb 50s remain on the shelf or APS-C bodies. APS-H is probably more bling though. True... me too leave 50 on the shelf from the very first times of M8 usage... but I think it must be considered that the envisioned camera we are speaking of would surely will be equipped with a (some ?) proprietary AF lens(es ? zoom ?)... the capability to use M lenses being a nice addon just for appealing Leica users... and they tipically have a number of focals, and many of them are "accustomed" to the M8 format Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjh Posted June 23, 2011 Share #78 Posted June 23, 2011 I was also under the impression that Leica employed an ex-Panasonic designer to develop the X1 and this perhaps will be his second mainstream Leica product? The X1 was the brain-child of Kaoru Mokunaka who was with Panasonic before he joined Leica in 2006. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted June 23, 2011 Share #79 Posted June 23, 2011 ... I think it must be considered that the envisioned camera we are speaking of would surely will be equipped with a (some ?) proprietary AF lens(es ? zoom ?)... the capability to use M lenses being a nice addon just for appealing Leica users... R users as well. Using my R lenses on a digi Leica would be my only reason to buy the X2 or whatever name the new evil will have as i own plenty of AF Nikkors already. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rosuna Posted June 23, 2011 Share #80 Posted June 23, 2011 This is about Panasonic, Epson and Sony... and electronic viewfinders... GH3 to have emphasis on low light performance, new EVF technologies | EOSHD.com Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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