jaapv Posted June 8, 2011 Share #21 Posted June 8, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Not sure what you mean by 'not be the case'? If I'm saying it looks like chrome underneath, and you are saying a good repaint needs to be de-chromed, an 'original' black Leica M3 with chrome underneath is presumably a fake? Steve I mean if it were painted over chrome (thus yes a fake) the paint would have flaked off by itself, so it cannot be painted over chrome. Even a fake is painted over brass. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 8, 2011 Posted June 8, 2011 Hi jaapv, Take a look here Leica M3 Black Paint. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
sabears Posted June 8, 2011 Share #22 Posted June 8, 2011 The silver linning is the reflection of flash used to take the photo. There are no brassing on the camera. I have brought it to Leica the technician under rnanification verified that the seal was "consistanly old". What about the internal serial number? It takes no more of 5 minutes to control and take a photo. Regarding the "L" seal may be is old...this not mean it's original. Post a better photo of it, so I can confirm to you in seconds. Also the paint is of very strange kind for the period. There are other particulars not convincing me, but I don't want to add more things than necessary. Hope this helps. Cheers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMLH Posted June 8, 2011 Author Share #23 Posted June 8, 2011 Not all M3 have internal serial number this is confirm by Leica Service agent i have more than one M3 only my early series 700xxx have internal my other 1155XX 1158XX have no internal serial. Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabears Posted June 8, 2011 Share #24 Posted June 8, 2011 Not all M3 have internal serial number this is confirm by Leica Service agent i have more than one M3 only my early series 700xxx have internal my other 1155XX 1158XX have no internal serial. Regards ...so you made a control and there is not a s.n. inside, good. Moreover in the 1558xxx range there is never a guard round the lens release, I have serviced a lot of these ....and what about the "L" seal and strange paint? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMLH Posted June 8, 2011 Author Share #25 Posted June 8, 2011 The paint look similar to my Leica MP Classical. The unusual paint might due to the flash Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/153654-leica-m3-black-paint/?do=findComment&comment=1696099'>More sharing options...
sabears Posted June 8, 2011 Share #26 Posted June 8, 2011 Very well done "L" seal, you need a lot of experience and you have to compare with originals to discover the defects. For example see these two original, photos tell more than words. http://www.kenrockwell.com/leica/m3/D3S_9536-l-seal-1200.jpg Leica M wax "L" seal | Flickr - Photo Sharing! Even if seems a little thing, you discover why it's not so easy to make an "original" mark. I have very little doubts about the fact that the camera is (at least) a restored one. See for example the bajonet ring, you see usage, but no signs on the body, strap lugs, etc. The paint has features of the spare parts of '70-'80 years (texture of paint, grain, and so), but I would need to see in person as you have told that there are reflections in photos, and it's always better to see in person these kind of things. Best regards. P.S.: I don't want to be misunderstood, the camera is nice for sure, but here we are not talking about aesthetics. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted June 8, 2011 Share #27 Posted June 8, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) It doesn't look like the same type of 'L' on the seal as the links posted by sabears. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.noctilux Posted June 9, 2011 Share #28 Posted June 9, 2011 On my M5 "L": Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/153654-leica-m3-black-paint/?do=findComment&comment=1697547'>More sharing options...
sabears Posted June 10, 2011 Share #29 Posted June 10, 2011 On my M5 "L": This is absolutely original! cheers Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted June 10, 2011 Share #30 Posted June 10, 2011 Here is a link to a discussion on RFF about the seals http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-42851.html Despite this one on TMLH's looking totally wrong anyway, if it was a factory refinish it appears it should have a recessed 'L', not the raised 'L' which indicates it has never been serviced. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabears Posted June 10, 2011 Share #31 Posted June 10, 2011 Here is a link to a discussion on RFF about the seals http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-42851.html Despite this one on TMLH's looking totally wrong anyway, if it was a factory refinish it appears it should have a recessed 'L', not the raised 'L' which indicates it has never been serviced. Steve That's right, this means only that someone somewhere wanted to make a faked " untouched original"... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmas Posted June 13, 2011 Share #32 Posted June 13, 2011 That's right, this means only that someone somewhere wanted to make a faked " untouched original"... But had not read the rule book, so it does not look like counterfeiting too much. Noel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMLH Posted June 14, 2011 Author Share #33 Posted June 14, 2011 Thank you for all the experts advise and opinion, The L seal was individually seal by hand, Hence, like all hand made products the quality varies. I will be very suspicious if all the seal are similar without any variation. By the way this camera was purchase in 1980"s from the Leitz Midland Canada , as part of inventory of many cameras, and leica parts, when the Leitz Canada was sold to the Hughes Corp Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted June 14, 2011 Share #34 Posted June 14, 2011 The L seal was individually seal by hand, Hence, like all hand made products the quality varies. I will be very suspicious if all the seal are similar without any variation. But the seal on your camera appears to be very different. Even if human error accounted for it not being as crisp as the other examples shown, the style of the typeface is wrong. The foot of the 'L' should end in a point (yours is blunt), the loop's of the 'L' should be oval (yours are round). And if the camera has ever been serviced the 'L' should be embossed, not raised (but maybe it has never been serviced). And I'm not sure how many cameras and parts Leica would have sold when Canada was shut down. All the last M4-P's were built at Wetzlar despite having 'Canada' on the top plate, which suggests Leica were shipping cameras and parts back to Germany and not just selling everything lock stock and barrel. Additionally even in the 1980's a black M3 did command a premium as a collectable camera, and Leica would have known this. And then there is the grey area concerning your serial number. I would ask for proof from Leica that it is genuine, get them to open it up and decide on paint and any other clues. If it turns out genuine fine, but otherwise you have proof that its a fake and you can try and get your money back. Steve Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabears Posted June 14, 2011 Share #35 Posted June 14, 2011 Thank you for all the experts advise and opinion, The L seal was individually seal by hand, Hence, like all hand made products the quality varies. I will be very suspicious if all the seal are similar without any variation. By the way this camera was purchase in 1980"s from the Leitz Midland Canada , as part of inventory of many cameras, and leica parts, when the Leitz Canada was sold to the Hughes Corp Don't waste your money. Even the kind of paint is totally wrong. If it belongs from Canada...well, then I know a lot of story behind, regarding this period. Moreover consider that you are in the worst condition: no number on the chassis...so everyone can buy some simple spares= top+baseplate and little more pieces from the kind lady from Canada and... Rien ne va plus, les jeux sont faits:). But there are at least 5 other parts that don't match, I don't want to suggest what they are. Regarding the seal: they are always almost the same, I had the chance to study hundreds of them. No chance to make a so different one. I hope it helps. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted June 17, 2011 Share #36 Posted June 17, 2011 ... Canada... indeed is probably once more "the Dark Lady" on stage.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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