DavidStone Posted May 8, 2011 Share #1 Posted May 8, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I finally got around to getting a 21mm Elmarit-M for my M8. Made in 1983, and virtually as-new. What surprised me, on doing a few tests, was the minimal degree of correction needed on the files. The lens is not coded. Used without an IR filter, there's no more than a trace of vignetting, and the faintest hint of cyan in the corners. So little, that on most shots, it's not worth correcting. Adding the IR filter brings in the cyan corners, but again so little that the Cornerfix profile that I'd made for correcting a 35mm lens produces a perfect result. I expected a far greater degree of correction for what is the equivalent of a 28mm angle of view. Not that I'm complaining. David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted May 8, 2011 Posted May 8, 2011 Hi DavidStone, Take a look here 21mm Elmarit-M. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Snakepottery Posted May 8, 2011 Share #2 Posted May 8, 2011 That's interesting as I am just looking into 21mm lenses. Alas I can't afford the latest 21mm asph, so have been researching the archives around the pre asph (like yours I guess) and the 21mm SA. And, I think I have concluded the following: 21mm SA fits M8 safely but metering around 2.5 stops out IQ from SA is good, possibly slightly better (or maybe just different) the the pre asph. The f3.4 IQ better than the f4 SA smaller and neater. Asph best of the lot! So until I read this post, I was thinking about buying an SA. What do others think, if the SA was the same price as a Pre asph, which would you choose? Having read your post David, it sounds like the pre asph is great too! Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidStone Posted May 8, 2011 Author Share #3 Posted May 8, 2011 Andy, I have a preference for the last generation of Leica's "spherical" lenses. Slightly unfashionable now in their lower-contrast, longer-scale images. My experience of the 21mm Elmarit-M is relatively limited, but very positive. I have some excellent 20"x16" B&W prints from one that was lent to me for a short time about ten years ago, so when I saw this near-mint one for sale, I could't resist it ("I can resist anything except temptation.", to quote Oscar Wilde). My two-day (so far) experience of this one on my M8 is entirely positive. I don't do test charts, I don't take shots of brick walls, and especially I don't read Mr. Puts' opinions, precise as these might be. Like all the pre-asph lenses, it's nice and sharp in the centre of the frame, even at full aperture. The so-called "soft" corners, if indeed they exist in real-world photography, are in any case cropped off by the M8. I shall use it very happily for the foreseeable future. And I read recently (I forget where) a comparison of this lens with its aspheric offspring, which was very complimentary towards the older design, and uncertain of the benefit of choosing the later model. I have no experience of the SA lenses on a Leica, so can't compare. I have used the Super Angulons on 5x4 and 10x8 sheet film, and very good they were, but that's hardly relevant. If you did decide to go for the Elmarit-M, I don't think that you'd be disappointed. The snag, of course, is that even at nearly 30 years old, they are still not exactly cheap David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted May 8, 2011 Share #4 Posted May 8, 2011 I would try the Skopar 21/4 P before spending a penny on any Super Angulon AFAIC. Compared to the Elmarit asph, the latter is sharper at f/4 but at f/5.6 and on i can hardly tell a difference. Also the Skopar does not block the VF of the M8 at all, even with its hood on. I prefer the larger rubber hood of the Summicron 40/2 personally but even with the latter on, the VF is not blocked any more than by the 28/2.8 asph with hood. For those interested my Skopar is coded like the Summicron 28. No vignetting problem at all with the M8.2. A best buy IMHO. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/151232-21mm-elmarit-m/?do=findComment&comment=1666722'>More sharing options...
Snakepottery Posted May 8, 2011 Share #5 Posted May 8, 2011 Hmmmmm, I have been wondering about that lens too. In terms of cost, it is a real bargain! You are obviously happy with the IQ? And then there's the Zeiss 21/f2.8! Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted May 8, 2011 Share #6 Posted May 8, 2011 Between the Super-Angulon and the pre-aspheric Elmarit, I'd take the Elmarit. Check Puts' comparison between the two in the book Leica M Lenses: Their Soul and Secrets. I've had both, and far prefer the Elmarit (which I still own). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted May 8, 2011 Share #7 Posted May 8, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) ..You are obviously happy with the IQ?... My first vignetting tests on the M8.2. Respectively f/8 (sea) and f/5.6. Beware that coding is necessary though, failing which you'll get more or less cyan drift on the sides and/or at the corners. (10 MB files) http://tinyurl.com/3bwhpse http://tinyurl.com/3qtd7ln Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickp13 Posted May 8, 2011 Share #8 Posted May 8, 2011 i really like the 21mm super angulon, and tried quite hard to make it work correctly on the m8. this included coding the flange, and modifying the flange to bring up the correct framelines for the coding chosen (WATE). BUT, i found that the photos needed a lot of work / correction / etc in color. black and white - great. film - great. but m8 or 9 color - difficult. if you look for threads on this subject, i think you'll read that the depth of the lens rear element into the camera, and the corresponding angle of light hitting the sensor causes more difficulty with the SA than with other 21mm lenses. i switched to a 21 elmarit ( pre asph), coded it, and liked the results very much. good luck with your quest rick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snakepottery Posted May 8, 2011 Share #9 Posted May 8, 2011 Thanks Gents for all your useful and informative thoughts. Ultimately it will depend on money (as always). I think given the comments, the SA is not so viable taking into account metering issues although I could easily use my rater lovely Weston Euromaster lightmeter! Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ho_co Posted May 8, 2011 Share #10 Posted May 8, 2011 Andy, also keep in mind that the 21 Elmarit aspherical has been discontinued. That may have an effect on the price of older lenses. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snakepottery Posted May 8, 2011 Share #11 Posted May 8, 2011 I didn't know that. Oh well, lets see whats about at a sensible price. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted May 8, 2011 Share #12 Posted May 8, 2011 That's interesting as I am just looking into 21mm lenses. Alas I can't afford the latest 21mm asph, so have been researching the archives around the pre asph (like yours I guess) and the 21mm SA. ... Andy, Another inexpensive option you might like to consider is the 21mm f/2.8 Kobalux, which is also marketted under the names "Avenon" and "Pasoptik" (same lens). It is LTM, the build quality is superb and it is nicely sharp wide open with little noticeable vignetting. I've used this lens for about 18 months and am very pleased with the results. I largely use it with an 093 black filter for infrared work on the M8 because it is one of the few lenses with no hot spot in IR but it is very good for visible light work too. The Kobalux's external finder is quite clear with a little barrel distortion but at 40mm in diameter is enormous and looks comical on an M camera - and even more so on my IIIf:D You might like consider another finder. The Kobaluxes were hand made in small quantities between 1994 and 2002 by Mr Abe from Yokohama who was the founder of the now defunct Komura Camera and Lens company. Allegedly the name "Kobalux" comes from Joseph Stalin whose nickname was 'Koba', and which translates to 'Man of Steel'. Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snakepottery Posted May 9, 2011 Share #13 Posted May 9, 2011 I had heard about them before, and have tried to hunt one down but seemed to be fairly rare. I will have another go though. As with a lot of these lenses, there not silly money and you can sell them almost for what you paid if you don't get on with them. f course you can do the same with Leica glass but with about 5 times as much initial outlay! Unfortunately, the current Mrs Snakepottery is baulking at £1000 worth of Leica glass unless I sell something else to cover it. Most unreasonable I think, especially after just having shelled out £3k on a new central heating boiler for her! I was happy with just putting another jumper on. Think of the Leica glass I could have bought....! Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
farnz Posted May 9, 2011 Share #14 Posted May 9, 2011 Andy, Yes they're not always easy to find but they typically sell in the 3-4-500 pound range (unless they're offered by a certain eBay seller from Hong Kong in which case the price doubles:cool:). Pete. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
roguewave Posted May 10, 2011 Share #15 Posted May 10, 2011 I have used the older Leica 21 Elmarit. A very lovely lens. I don't like the SA. Just not my taste. The best value and for me, the overall best rendering for a non ASPH 21 is the Zeiss Biogon ZM 2.8. The color rendering is amazing, It's plenty sharp and it a cool feature of stepping up or down in quarters between standard apertures. Build is excellent. The images I get are just what I hoped for. Here's a recent sample: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/151232-21mm-elmarit-m/?do=findComment&comment=1668849'>More sharing options...
Double Negative Posted May 11, 2011 Share #16 Posted May 11, 2011 ^ Ben, I think you mean "thirds" (not quarters) for the f-stop detents. But I would agree; the ZM lenses are phenomenal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snakepottery Posted May 17, 2011 Share #17 Posted May 17, 2011 Well, after all that, I ended up getting a Zeiss 18mm f4 lens! I will sell my CV 15mm as it is too close really focal length wise. It was a bargain too! Not yet tried it but we shall see. It certainly is a beautifully made lens, solid with a lovely focus feel. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snakepottery Posted May 17, 2011 Share #18 Posted May 17, 2011 Mind you, those Zeiss lens caps are awful! Spend most of your time picking it up off the floor! Will send it to Malcolm Taylor for 6 bit coding and will also need to buy a B+W 58mm UV/IR filter. Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.