hhanebeck Posted April 17, 2011 Share #1 Posted April 17, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) Hi Everyone, I am new to Leica film cameras (started with a digital M) and love the way the M7 renders images. Absolutely fantastic! There is one issue though that I do not understand. The last three rolls all had issues in that the film did not properly spool in the back. More specifically, I put a roll in, advanced the film (which works fine), closed the back and advanced more (which also works) and then, after a few shots the film does not move any further. When I open the back again, say after five shots, the film is no longer tightly wound around the back spool and it does not advance when you try to advance the film although the back spool does turn. The film is very loose and does not move along. I have read the threads on this topic here and watched half a dozen YouTube videos, but simply cannot make sense of it. I do exactly what everyone says I should do and have never had this issue before today. Does anyone know what I am doing wrong? Many thanks, Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted April 17, 2011 Posted April 17, 2011 Hi hhanebeck, Take a look here M7 Loading Issue. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Xmas Posted April 17, 2011 Share #2 Posted April 17, 2011 Hi Do not use the diagram on the bottom crate cover... that is only for -40C, read instructions again, carefully then.... Do not crimp the end on film Take the film through three prongs (not two) until it touches the inner case opposite from the sprocket shaft Do not wind on the film to check it is spooling, non no no... the petals only hold film securly when the beseplate is on Instead place thumb on the sprocket shaft to pin the film to the sprockets, and rewind the film gently until the film in the cassette is tight (ish). Put on the baseplate and lock. The rewding thing should turn immediately.you wind and fire the two blanks If you crimp you will need a new shutter sooner rathen later This will work every time with the thinnest PET base film, whcih you wont have access to normally... Noel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhanebeck Posted April 17, 2011 Author Share #3 Posted April 17, 2011 Hi Noel, Many thanks! I will try your suggestions with the next few rolls. Cheers, Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
budrichard Posted April 17, 2011 Share #4 Posted April 17, 2011 I always load with the back plate open to watch the sprocket/film engagement. After threading the film into the take up spool, verify sprocket alignment with film perforations by taking up tension by winding and using the rewind lever to take up tension. Install the bottom and make sure there is tension on the film with the rewind lever. As soon as you wind, they rewind should move ( I leave it extended so I can easily see it move. wind and shoot two frames, the rewind should move for each wind. If so, then you are OK to go. Fold the rewind lever. -Dick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmas Posted April 17, 2011 Share #5 Posted April 17, 2011 Does the battery not go flat before the SD card fills anyway? Noel Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted April 17, 2011 Share #6 Posted April 17, 2011 I've loaded hundreds of films into my M7. Just drop the film in, make sure 1 inch of film sits in the tulip and the sprockets are engaged, close the whole thing up and you're good to go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted April 17, 2011 Share #7 Posted April 17, 2011 Advertisement (gone after registration) I've loaded hundreds of films into my M7. Just drop the film in, make sure 1 inch of film sits in the tulip and the sprockets are engaged, close the whole thing up and you're good to go. I have to agree. I can't imagine where it goes wrong. I drop the film in, put the leader into the petals, line the sprocket holes up with the sprockets, very slowly wind the film advance lever guiding the film to engage the sprokets using my thumb, close the flap and attach the base, take up the slack with the rewind then advance the frame watching the rewind lever to ensure film is being drawn from the cassette. If I see the rewind move I might not advance a second frame but start the film there. Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted April 17, 2011 Share #8 Posted April 17, 2011 Changing an SD card is far easier And removing it to see why it's corrupt is quicker Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
too old to care Posted April 18, 2011 Share #9 Posted April 18, 2011 Changing an SD card is far easier SD, what is that? Simply Defective? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhanebeck Posted April 18, 2011 Author Share #10 Posted April 18, 2011 I've loaded hundreds of films into my M7. Just drop the film in, make sure 1 inch of film sits in the tulip and the sprockets are engaged, close the whole thing up and you're good to go. I have to agree. I can't imagine where it goes wrong. I drop the film in, put the leader into the petals, line the sprocket holes up with the sprockets, very slowly wind the film advance lever guiding the film to engage the sprokets using my thumb, close the flap and attach the base, take up the slack with the rewind then advance the frame watching the rewind lever to ensure film is being drawn from the cassette. If I see the rewind move I might not advance a second frame but start the film there.Pete Hi Pete and Andy, Thanks! I have never seen this issue before and have no idea what I am doing wrong. Have followed the instructions each time and not once had an issue prior to yesterday. It also isn't the film, since I have used a different one in each case. Noel's comments helped! Shot two more rolls today with partial success. The film does not stop winding after four to five exposures any longer, as it did yesterday, due to using all three prongs. However, immediately after loading I now have the issue that the winder to advance the film works and allows for another exposure, while the film does not actually advance inside (after gentle tightening, of course). On the last roll, I marked the film before closing the camera and it was still in the same position after two exposures. The rewinder also did not move. Once I opened it a second time, it worked just fine. Could be that the film gets stuck or that the winder itself is not working right ... I am clearly at the end of my wits and have sent a note to Leica as well. If they have seen the issue before, it might be mechanical. If not, it must be my fault. Cheers, Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhanebeck Posted April 18, 2011 Author Share #11 Posted April 18, 2011 Changing an SD card is far easier Hi Peter, Very true! Especially if you aren't fit to complete a simple task such as loading film. My girlfriend offered to get a simple PS for "me" and also suggested that I might want to switch to the paperbox one-time cameras that you can buy in tourist shops. : ))) Cheers, Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted April 18, 2011 Share #12 Posted April 18, 2011 On the last roll, I marked the film before closing the camera and it was still in the same position after two exposures. The rewinder also did not move. Once I opened it a second time, it worked just fine. Could be that the film gets stuck or that the winder itself is not working right ... I am clearly at the end of my wits and have sent a note to Leica as well. If they have seen the issue before, it might be mechanical. If not, it must be my fault. Cheers, Chris If you stick your thumb against the petals and action the advance lever do the petals rotate? Pete Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
andybarton Posted April 18, 2011 Share #13 Posted April 18, 2011 It could be a problem with the rewind clutch, but the actual winding on is done by the toothed gears, not the tulip. That just collects the spent film Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alun Posted April 18, 2011 Share #14 Posted April 18, 2011 As Andy says, it could be a problem with the actual rewind mechanics. My M6 slipped a rewind gear -- it was easily and swiftly fixed by Malcolm Taylor. However, on the question of film loading, are you sure that the film cassette is seated all the way into the film chamber? If it snags and sits too high it is possible for the film edge to be trapped between the guide rails and the backplate -- I have had that happen. I have to say, though, from what you describe it doesn't sound as if the problem is your loading of the film; it sounds as if there is a mechanical problem. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpattison Posted April 18, 2011 Share #15 Posted April 18, 2011 However, immediately after loading I now have the issue that the winder to advance the film works and allows for another exposure, while the film does not actually advance insideCheers, Chris Chris, Is the rewind lever on the front of the camera in it's upright position, not pointing to "R"? This would cause your problem, if it remains at "R". John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhanebeck Posted April 18, 2011 Author Share #16 Posted April 18, 2011 If you stick your thumb against the petals and action the advance lever do the petals rotate?Pete Hi Pete, Good idea! I will try it with the next roll. Due to work there won't be any chances to shoot again before the weekend. Cheers, Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhanebeck Posted April 18, 2011 Author Share #17 Posted April 18, 2011 It could be a problem with the rewind clutch, but the actual winding on is done by the toothed gears, not the tulip. That just collects the spent film Hi Andy, I had thought about that, too. It is a possibility along with film not perfectly aligning with the gears inside. I will have to try and maybe just need to sacrifice a cheap roll of film for multiple tries. Cheers, Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhanebeck Posted April 18, 2011 Author Share #18 Posted April 18, 2011 Ouch !!!On a serous note Back in my film days when I first had an M6 I just sat with a roll of film loading and rewinding it until I was perfect It's been a while since then Wonder if I could still load one ! Hi Peter, That is a very good suggestion. I will probably do that on one of the next evenings. Guess you have to watch closely when rewinding the film into its canister. Cheers, Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhanebeck Posted April 18, 2011 Author Share #19 Posted April 18, 2011 As Andy says, it could be a problem with the actual rewind mechanics. My M6 slipped a rewind gear -- it was easily and swiftly fixed by Malcolm Taylor. However, on the question of film loading, are you sure that the film cassette is seated all the way into the film chamber? If it snags and sits too high it is possible for the film edge to be trapped between the guide rails and the backplate -- I have had that happen. I have to say, though, from what you describe it doesn't sound as if the problem is your loading of the film; it sounds as if there is a mechanical problem. Hi Alun, May thanks for your ideas! Do you have a contact for Malcolm Taylor? Would love to get his perspective and see if he can help. Your comment about the film being too high is definitely a possibility. Had thought about that, too. It would lock the film in its place for sure. Maybe opening the back again shifted the film a bit when I did just that yesterday. I will give it a try. I sure hope this is an issue on my side rather than a mechanical one. The latter would leave the camera out of commission for weeks. Cheers, Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhanebeck Posted April 18, 2011 Author Share #20 Posted April 18, 2011 Chris,Is the rewind lever on the front of the camera in it's upright position, not pointing to "R"? This would cause your problem, if it remains at "R". John Hi John, Very good point! I looked to make sure the "R" lever is upright after the second failed attempt. It can certainly happen! Cheers, Chris Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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