Name this car....

[Ivan Goriup]

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5 hours ago, NigelG said:

Looks like a Hotchkiss Grégoire?

I think the clues maybe allude to the flat 4 “boxer” engine. It also had aluminium elements in the chassis which reduced the weight of the car. 

We have a winner ! It is a 1953 Hotchkiss Gregoire Chapron Coupe. The company started building saloons in 1950, introduced coachbuilt coupes & cabriolets in '52, and a Chapron-built streamlined Coupe in '53, all at the Paris Salon de l'Automobile. Total production of Hotchkiss Gregoire cars amounted to 247 units.

Gregoire was a pioneer of frontwheel drive with the invention of constant velocity  ( CV ) joints.

An interesting item in this particular car's provenance, the first of just seven two-door Coupes, is that it was purchased in 1953 off the New York Auto Show display stand by Ed Cole, who eventually wound up as president of American car maker General Motors, and used it as his daily driver. The Board of directors of course was not pleased to see the CEO of the then world's largest company driving anything other than a Cadillac and strongly suggested he swap personal automobiles to show his loyalty to Detroit-produced iron. He claimed he had bought it essentially to learn more about frontwheel drive, which the Directors accepted, but insisted that it be kept in-house as part of the fleet of 'research vehicles' GM maintained for /  in its engineering department.

SL / 24-90 V.E.

Your turn, Nigel.

JZG

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[NigelG]

Ok I will try to find something relevant that I shot with a Leica (which narrows things down as I find myself often out and about with just an iPhone when an interesting vehicle hoves into view)...😕

[NigelG]

Re the Hotchkiss Grégoire 2-door coupé IMHO it seems like a potentially elegant longer streamlined body coachbuilt on a too-small, or maybe more exactly a too-short, chassis.

With its exaggerated rear quarters despite the longer doors it ends up with a kind of "balloon-animal" profile which doesn't quite hang together unlike the 4-door version which sort of works.

[stuny]

17 minutes ago, NigelG said:

Ok I will try to find something relevant that I shot with a Leica (which narrows things down as I find myself often out and about with just an iPhone when an interesting vehicle hoves into view)...😕

I encourage you to always have a leica with you.

[NigelG]

14 minutes ago, stuny said:

I encourage you to always have a leica with you.

Quite. But now I'm back mainly in London I'm finding it hard to focus an M whilst also holding up an umbrella 🧐

Edited November 30, 2023 by NigelG

[pippy]

OK: to keep things going until Nigel gets his Brolly-Hat delivered here's something to ponder;

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Philip.

[wlaidlaw]

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Citroen Ami 6 Break? 

Wilson

[NigelG]

Thanks Pippy - I’m struggling with a dead OWC 1Gb SSD that was my main laptop replacement drive. I have all the files (like setuporg I never delete SD cards but use them as “cheap film”) but need to access the cards to drag up some cars. My backups are in London and I’m in the snowy Cotswolds

 

Edited December 3, 2023 by NigelG

[NigelG]

Good call on the Ami but on reflection not so sure though the colour is right.

Saw a DS Safari tootling round Bourton-on-the-Water this afternoon when heading to the Coop which was a 👍🏻

[pippy]

On 12/3/2023 at 10:34 AM, wlaidlaw said:

Citroen Ami 6 Break?...

Good guess, Wilson, and I was about to type 'Correct Country of Origin; Correct Marque' but then I read this in Nigel's subsequent post...

15 hours ago, NigelG said:

...Saw a DS Safari tootling round Bourton-on-the-Water this afternoon...

...which is spot-on. It is a (rather down-at-heel) circa 1972/'73 Citroen DS 23 Safari / Break / Familiale (etc.). This one is slightly unusual for the type in that it is Right-Hand-Drive suggesting that it was assembled in Slough.

Larger view of the earlier pic;

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Rear shot;

Full thing;

I'm guessing that, once again, this throws the thread open to anyone with a Mystery Car to post!

Philip.

Edited December 4, 2023 by pippy

[NigelG]

Interestingly the one I saw was I think navy blue below that "Ton Pierre-ish" roof.

Used to run a 2CV fourgonette in that colour down in the Tarn in the early 90s

[wlaidlaw]

Philip, 

I am not sure Slough continued in existence as long as the DS23. My father had a Slough built Light 15 in the late 1940's, which he rather spoilt by having a Connaught engine conversion with a bronze 8 port cylinder head and twin SU carburettors. The front drive shaft joints were not up to the task and failed with monotonous regularity. This is the first car I remember being in and I was fascinated by the gear lever coming out of the middle of the dashboard. His Jaguar Mk.V arrived just in time in August 1950, as another drive shaft had broken leaving us isolated in the holiday cottage we had rented. My father very rarely swore but he certainly did when the Mk.V arrived, being driven by the delivery driver from the Jaguar dealer in Elgin. He had ordered it in Sherwood Forest Green in 1948 and it turned up two years later in Old English White. At that time you had to take a new car in the UK in the colour the manufacturer had available. 

Wilson

[pippy]

Thanks for the prompt regarding DS production, Wilson, and you are quite correct. According to the Wiki entry for the DS;

"The Slough factory closed on 18 February 1966 and thereafter cars for the British market were imported fully assembled from the company's French plant."

I really should do my homework before making a comment such as I did as it doesn't take up too much time!

Funny to hear about the 'Sherwood Green' Jaguar! Would the 'take it or leave it' situation have been due to immediate post-WW2 shortages?

Not quite in the same vein but I experienced a similar surprise once when I went along to collect a bicycle-frame which had been left with the manufacturer (Shorter-Rochford in North London) for it to receive a re-spray. I had chosen the desired colour - a beautiful shade of medium blue metallic - from the colour-chart in the company's own in-shop sales brochure. When I turned up to collect the frame my comment was "Oh! It's Green!!!" The assistant, clearly confused by my reaction asked me what had I expected. So we went through the catalogue and I showed him what I had ordered. "Ah!......(he said)......yes; I see what you mean. It seems that the colours in the brochure have faded quite a bit..."...

I was not a happy bunny but, as it had already been away for some six months I declined their offer to spray it again. In hindsight not a good decision...

Philip.

[wlaidlaw]

1950 was still in the "Export or die" era, so the buyer took whatever the maker deigned to offer them. My father tried to change his order in 1950 from the Mk.V to a Mk.VII, whose arrival at the London Motor of 1950, was heavily foretold. He was told "No" in no uncertain fashion. He eventually got his MkVII in late 1953 and it turned out he did not like it anything much as he did the MkV.

At one point just after the war, you had to get a government permit to buy a new car with a steel body. This was according to my father a system that was a hotbed of corruption. My father was a very upright personality, an elder of the presbyterian church and a Justice of the Peace (magistrate) and declined to get involved in bribing a local government employee to get his new car "ticket". However he was able to buy a new AC Buckland Saloon in 1947 as that had an aluminium body and aluminium engine. According to him this was a pretty dreadful car, with the electrics by Lucas, Prince of Darkness and all very poorly slung together. The two litre engine was a rather old design dating to 1922 and in spite of its three SU carburettors, was rather feeble. It was supposed to make 75BHP but my father estimated it was nearer 55 BHP on a good day. He said the Connaught Citroen was a rocket ship in comparison. 

Wilson

[stuny]

Who will step in with the next mystery car?

[Ivan Goriup]

4 hours ago, stuny said:

Who will step in with the next mystery car?

I would be happy to, but to keep this excersize from being too easy, I'm replacing the usual crop of a portion of the exterior with an 'open bonnet' engine compartment shot.

Let's see if anyone cares to takes a shot ta this. If additional clues are required, I will be happy to post them. The usual information please.

JZG

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[wlaidlaw]

A Lancia of some sort, maybe an Appia?

Wilson

[stuny]

I'm looking forward to seeing more of this late '50s, early '60s auto.  I suspect I'll like it's coachwork.

[Ivan Goriup]

Wilson - Lancia and the current mystery car were manufactured in the same country.........but it's not a Lancia.

Stuart - founded in the later half of the '40s, production ended in the '50s....never saw the '60s, but yes, very influential in matters of style for the global automobile business and you have seen at least one car by this manufacturer because you have posted images of it here.

For the sake of full disclosure, I need to tell you all that I have images of two cars made by this brand and am / will be using them in this post.

Here's the next clue, and as stated above, I think you'll see what I meant by suspecting this as being too easy.

JZG

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[stuny]

The grill seems to be from a Cisitalia. but I do not recognize the bumper.