enboe Posted October 25, 2009 Share #1 Posted October 25, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) Short bit of venting. I've checked 5 dealers in Los Angeles and Orange County, and they all want cash in advance with no commitment on delivery for the new M9. Reminds me of when the Saturn Sky came out. I am reluctant to hand over almost $8k, especially in these financial times. One OC dealer only has two Leicas in the whole store, and has eliminated their medium format department altogether. Would you want to hand them your cash? I also hear the argument of supporting your local dealer, but this is inconsistent with their service. Many of the out-of-state dealers have free wait lists. So, anyone else feeling unloved by their local dealers? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 25, 2009 Posted October 25, 2009 Hi enboe, Take a look here Why buying an M9 reminds me of buying a car. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
brt3 Posted October 25, 2009 Share #2 Posted October 25, 2009 Short bit of venting. I've checked 5 dealers in Los Angeles and Orange County, and they all want cash in advance with no commitment on delivery for the new M9. Reminds me of when the Saturn Sky came out. I am reluctant to hand over almost $8k, especially in these financial times. One OC dealer only has two Leicas in the whole store, and has eliminated their medium format department altogether. Would you want to hand them your cash? I also hear the argument of supporting your local dealer, but this is inconsistent with their service. Many of the out-of-state dealers have free wait lists. So, anyone else feeling unloved by their local dealers? I couldn't agree more -- you are preaching to the choir on this one! Brick & mortar dealers are shooting themselves in the foot by price-gouging potential customers whenever a hot product comes along. I have had a similar experience here in Northern California, which I've detailed here: http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m9-forum/102455-leica-newbie-has-3-questions.html I've written to Leica and received the following response from a Leica USA VP; if enough of us complain perhaps Leica will do something to enforce their policy on this: –––––––––––––––––––––––––––– From: "C.E." Date: October 18, 2009 Subject: RE: High deposits on M9 Dear Mr. T., Thank you so much for your email to our service team in Allendale. I am sorry that you had this experience with one of our dealers in the US. I totally understand your disappointment with their sales policy and ensure you that this is in no way Leica’s policy to do business. This said, we can certainly help you finding a different dealer, who will not charge you anything until your camera ships. Please let me know in which state you would like to buy and I can provide you with a particle list of dealers, who I know will not take a deposit to be on the pre order list. I have informed our President about this dealers policy. I am looking forward to hear from you. --- Best regards C.E. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilfredo Posted October 25, 2009 Share #3 Posted October 25, 2009 I had this issue come up with Samys Camera in OC when I was looking for a Canon 5D II so I went elsewhere, it was their loss. If memory serves me right, they wanted 10% down. In the end I was better off because I found a camera way before I could have on their paid waiting list. Good Luck in your quest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
canlogic Posted October 26, 2009 Share #4 Posted October 26, 2009 This is done mostly because people put themselves on multiple lists and I guess a dealer could get stuck with unsold cameras. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
noah_addis Posted October 26, 2009 Share #5 Posted October 26, 2009 I understand your frustration. I don't like to deal with the huge NYC megastores, but on the other hand I don't really have any good local dealers. There are a few leica dealers around here, but none that I know of have a good selection or knowledgeable staff. For all of my new Leica gear I've been dealing with David Farkas at Dale Photo and Digital. I guess I should state that I'm not affiliated with them in any way, just a happy customer. Along with advertising on the forum, Dale is a family-run business. It's a big enough Leica dealer to have the hard-to-get items but small enough that you get real personal attention. The first item I bought from Dale was a lens. I ordered it online and David actually called me to make sure that I was happy with the lens. We ended up talking for a while and I could tell he's a very knowledgeable dealer. He's given me some good advice since then and has really gone above and beyond in terms of customer service. I'm sure there are other dealers like Dale, my main point is that it's possible to find a middle ground between a tiny local shop and a megastore. While I wish I had a dealer like Dale around here, the advantage of it not being local is that I don't have to pay sales tax:D I would not put down a deposit with a store unless I trusted the store and unless I had a firm delivery date. Most dealers aren't requiring a deposit, so I'd definitely look elsewhere. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnoble Posted October 26, 2009 Share #6 Posted October 26, 2009 As said on another post, I got my M9 from Florham Village Camera in Florham Park, NJ, within a few days of placing my order a couple of weeks ago. I put down a few hundred dollars deposit. You might want to try them. The owner is Gary Stein. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riccis Posted October 26, 2009 Share #7 Posted October 26, 2009 Advertisement (gone after registration) As Noah states, call David and get on his list... He is the best dealer out there and a very knowledgeable and super nice guy. Cheers, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikkor AIS Posted October 26, 2009 Share #8 Posted October 26, 2009 My local camera store's wanted 20% deposit on the M9:o. No word on when I would get my camera or if the money was refundable if I got tired of waiting. So I bought a M3 and a 35 1.4 summilux and three bricks of film:D. from some one at rangefinder forum. For years I have tried to support my local camera store. However, now I just want a M9 and a old Noct. The bricks and mortar in my area have neither so I guess keh will get my more of my business for the Noct. As far as the M9 ill go every anywhere. Gregory Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
2Bébèrt Posted October 26, 2009 Share #9 Posted October 26, 2009 No complains with my dealer, he didn't ask for a deposit, kept me informed on delivery scheduale and gave me the B&W filter I ordered for free. That's like buying a new car and getting a tank full of petrol for free. (a dealer somewhere in the capital of Austria) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bernd Banken Posted October 26, 2009 Share #10 Posted October 26, 2009 Leica has two places in Europe where they are assembling - Portugal and Solms. The daily output is much to small for a company with around 1.000 employes, I think. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted October 26, 2009 Share #11 Posted October 26, 2009 Ah, but how many of the 1000 assemble digital Ms? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelico Posted October 26, 2009 Share #12 Posted October 26, 2009 Ah, but how many of the 1000 assemble digital Ms? It was reported on the net by somebody who visited factory that 16 (if I am not wrong) people worked on assembly line in Solms in M9 production line (when he visited Solms). How many works in Portugal I didn’t see the info. And that it takes 8 working hours (again Solms) to assembe and test one M9. So, one-shift 16 people (22 working days per month x16=352, 352 working days x 8 working hours / 8 hours for one camera), so basically one shift can assemble app. 350 cameras per month. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammam Posted October 26, 2009 Share #13 Posted October 26, 2009 I can be as harsh a critic of Leica AG or Leica dealers as anybody, as I am of BMW Motorrad and their dealers, or Subaru, or any other merchant, but why would ordering an expensive item be any different from ordering anything? In all other fields you HAVE to make a deposit when ordering an article. Heck, my photo store ask for a deposit of $11,25 for a $50 item. Why this whining for something perfectly normal? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jelico Posted October 26, 2009 Share #14 Posted October 26, 2009 Point is that everybody was waiting for this camera since first FF sensor was introduced, meaning years of waiting. Some went with M8 as temporary solution, but FF was a main aim. Now, when it looks like M9 is almost in our hands, Leica is delaying deliveries ….and everybody is getting upset … Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammam Posted October 26, 2009 Share #15 Posted October 26, 2009 Now, in another connection, could the M9 story be just a repeat of the M8's: fanfare upon launch, then back-ordered for months, unknown delivery date, and to top it all, a flawed camera? Send it back to Solms, wait another few weeks for fixing, and finally be offered a $2,000 «upgrade», like sapphire glass and top LCD? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
noah_addis Posted October 26, 2009 Share #16 Posted October 26, 2009 Now, in another connection, could the M9 story be just a repeat of the M8's: fanfare upon launch, then back-ordered for months, unknown delivery date, and to top it all, a flawed camera? Send it back to Solms, wait another few weeks for fixing, and finally be offered a $2,000 «upgrade», like sapphire glass and top LCD? I'll concede that all cameras have flaws and that there might be some hidden problem lurking inside the M9. But so far it's been an amazing camera to work with. A less scratch-prone lcd would be nice, but it's not a deal-breaker and if it added $500 to the cost I'd probably say no thanks. However, if we get an upgrade option in the future that also extends the warranty by another year or two, that might be a worthwhile deal. The waiting and unknown delivery times are frustrating. But it's worth the wait. I was hoping to have two M9s for my upcoming trip to Brazil, but I'm happy to at least have one in time for my trip:D Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
brt3 Posted October 26, 2009 Share #17 Posted October 26, 2009 I can be as harsh a critic of Leica AG or Leica dealers as anybody, as I am of BMW Motorrad and their dealers, or Subaru, or any other merchant, but why would ordering an expensive item be any different from ordering anything? In all other fields you HAVE to make a deposit when ordering an article. Heck, my photo store ask for a deposit of $11,25 for a $50 item. Why this whining for something perfectly normal? Re: "whining" I placed an order and then was notified (a few weeks later) that I would have to front a $2,000 non-refundable deposit. That, to me, is completely unreasonable. This was done by one of the most prominent Leica dealers in the US, a dealer that had been strongly recommended by others on this forum. This drove me to Keeble & Shuhchat, a local dealer; they required a $1,000 deposit which is 100% refundable. That, to me, is a far better way to treat a customer... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Åmund Posted October 26, 2009 Share #18 Posted October 26, 2009 What is the current practice i Europe? Any recommendations of dealers in Britain? Åmund Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHAG Posted October 26, 2009 Share #19 Posted October 26, 2009 I bought several Leica equipment from Leica dealers. If one of them asks me for deposit, I go elsewhere. One of them just closed business. If I had made a deposit, what about my money ? Very serious dealers like Ffordes or Robert White in the UK never asked me one £ of deposit. I bought 2 lenses and accessories from Ffordes and transaction has been perfect. The same with Leica bei Meister in Berlin or Hamburg. To me, ask for a deposit is XIX-th century practice. As for deposit, I did it once with a car dealer. Transaction has been OK, but I wouldn't do this again. Want a deposit ? Ask someone else, not me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulOD Posted October 26, 2009 Share #20 Posted October 26, 2009 I have an M9 on order at Calumet and no deposit was requested (I did ask if they wanted one). I have bought a fair amount of camera gear from both Calumet and B&H over the years,including preorders, and have never been asked for a deposit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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