Printer calibration at home - recommendations?

[LocalHero1953]

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Can anyone recommend equipment for calibrating an inkjet printer?

 

I use an Epson R3000 with third party inks, and a mix of Canson, Hahnemuhle, Epson and Permajet paper, so calibration is a necessity - I can't use off-the-shelf ICC profiles.

I use an Xrite I1 Display Pro for monitor profiling.

I have been using Permajet's paper profiling service, which is free for their own paper, but a smallish cost for other papers. But sometimes I am dissatisfied with the profiles I get, and would like to try again; this may be because the printer happened to be playing up when I printed the test sheet, or it could be that the profiling process was not done well - I don't know. Whatever the cause, the costs add up and it takes a few days to get a new profile made, usually when I need a new profile in a hurry. 

 

Any recommendations?

 

[Jeff S]

I'd recommend the service I used to use for custom profiles (Chromix), but they're in the US.  

 

In any case, I'm now spoiled by ImagePrint 10 and will never go back.  It's an expensive bit of software (equal to a printer), but it takes away every concern over printer settings (you never set one again), paper profiles (includes virtually all, even for different lighting conditions), accurate soft-proofing (always in that mode....WYSIWYG), proper output sharpening, and more.  And no more screw-ups resulting from the Apple-Adobe-Epson chain.  I use IP with a P800.  [The R3000 is known to have some issues, but I don't know if those relate to your problems....the P600 was Epson's replacement.]

 

Jeff

Edited December 11, 2016 by Jeff S

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[LocalHero1953]

It's the third party inks that demand custom calibration. Other than that, I don't have a problem with printing from LR.

 

Epson ICC profiles just don't work for third party inks: how does Imageprint deal with them? It must have some sort of information about how they behave on the paper?

 

I should have added that I use Windows 10 - so no Apple to screw up the workflow (yes, Adobe and Epson can manage that without Apple's help).

Edited December 11, 2016 by LocalHero1953

[Jeff S]

I use Epson inks, but have a friend who has used IP with Cone color inks developed for Epson machines.  

 

IP is good about answering questions...

 

https://www.colorbytesoftware.com/Ver10/customer_service.shtml

 

FWIW, I really like LR as well and have used it for years.  I now use IP in conjunction with it, set up as an external editor to LR.  Once I complete picture edits in LR, I just click over to IP.  I then merely choose a paper, size and profile (grayscale is an option), then lay out print.  I can tweak if needed for color, toning, sharpening, etc....or not.  IP does the rest.....no need to fiddle with any machine settings or color management, etc.  The soft-proofing function is much better than the LR approach.

 

IP also runs on Windows platform.

 

Their site has some videos, and LuLa recently conducted interviews with its top exec who described some of the benefits.

 

Jeff

[LocalHero1953]

I use Epson inks, but have a friend who has used IP with Cone color inks developed for Epson machines.  

 

IP is good about answering questions...

 

https://www.colorbytesoftware.com/Ver10/customer_service.shtml

 

FWIW, I really like LR as well and have used it for years.  I now use IP in conjunction with it, set up as an external editor to LR.  Once I complete picture edits in LR, I just click over to IP.  I then merely choose a paper, size and profile (grayscale is an option), then lay out print.  I can tweak if needed for color, toning, sharpening, etc....or not.  IP does the rest.....no need to fiddle with any machine settings or color management, etc.  The soft-proofing function is much better than the LR approach.

 

IP also runs on Windows platform.

 

Their site has some videos, and LuLa recently conducted interviews with its top exec who described some of the benefits.

 

Jeff

I have all my papers set up with my own presets in LR that match the ICC profile, the layout, the paper and the Epson settings.

Once set up, there is no fiddling, just choose one of my presets e.g. "A4 Rag Photographique Colour" or "A4 Greetings Card 2-up Epson Matte Colour".

I do the same for B&W, though in this case I use Epson's Advanced Black & White management rather than ICC profiles. Again, I have created presets within the Epson driver for each paper (which are linked to my LR presets, so I don't have to make choices after picking the LR preset).

 

But it's good to hear that IP can handle 3rd party inks. Mine are Permajet inks (I have no idea if IP has heard of Permajet!).

And I agree LR softproofing is poor.

 

Thanks for the info.

[Jeff S]

Sure, I had many presets, too.  But weird things tend to happen to settings, or color management, or print results (or color charts) in general, particularly when dealing with operating system and/or driver updates.  

 

And with new papers, I don't need to experiment and figure out any settings (including things like platen gap, etc....ink is laid down optimally).  And same if I upgrade printers, like I recently did from the 3800 to the P800.  Or, perhaps, if I switch to 3rd party inks (but I would use Cone, which are proven reliable).

 

Anyway, you started the thread because something is amiss....profiles or whatever.  I stopped dealing with mysteries.

 

Whatever works....just sharing my experience.

 

Jeff

Edited December 11, 2016 by Jeff S

[LocalHero1953]

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Thanks, Jeff, but I'll keep looking for advice on equipment for calibration at home 

[Jeff S]

i1 Profiler gear, offered in various models.  I've used one of the higher end kits effectively, borrowed from a friend.

 

http://www.xrite.com/categories/calibration-profiling/i1-solutions

 

But those higher end models are much more expensive than IP, with no better results, and more time consuming to boot.  

 

Jeff

 

 

[Guest]

Can anyone recommend equipment for calibrating an inkjet printer?

 

I use an Epson R3000 with third party inks, and a mix of Canson, Hahnemuhle, Epson and Permajet paper, so calibration is a necessity - I can't use off-the-shelf ICC profiles.

I use an Xrite I1 Display Pro for monitor profiling.

I have been using Permajet's paper profiling service, which is free for their own paper, but a smallish cost for other papers. But sometimes I am dissatisfied with the profiles I get, and would like to try again; this may be because the printer happened to be playing up when I printed the test sheet, or it could be that the profiling process was not done well - I don't know. Whatever the cause, the costs add up and it takes a few days to get a new profile made, usually when I need a new profile in a hurry.

 

Any recommendations?

I was in a similar position early this year. I had just upgraded my printer to the Epson P800 and was not really getting the results I wanted at a regular consistency. To cut a long story short I bought Image Print 10 after getting a lot of good advice from Jeff S ,

problem solved. The paper profiles in IP 10 are probably better than I can make with the I1 pro 2 , but as a piece of kit IP10 delivers.

The software is expensive when looked at in isolation, but when I looked at the cost as a % of how much my hobby costs me it has proven to be worth the investment. I have always been happy with Epson ink quality and 80 ml cartridges make a massive contribution to reduce my ink cost.

Edited December 11, 2016 by Guest

[LocalHero1953]

I'm looking at IP for background information, and have downloaded the manual.

It looks like they don't do a version for my Epson R3000, and the cost for a similar sized printer would be US$900 (shipped to UK).

Most discussions I have seen seem to be about B&W printing, whereas most of mine would be colour.

 

Jeff, do you use third party colour inks with IP?

Edited December 11, 2016 by LocalHero1953

[Jeff S]

No, I use the standard ink set with the P800.  The P series inks are improved (richer blacks, etc) than the prior set in your printer (and in my 3800).  

 

As I mentioned, IP has many profiles for each paper choice, including a grayscale for b/w, as well as color profiles for different lighting conditions (e.g., daylight, tungsten, etc), which helps if one has different display needs such as for an exhibition.

 

Not that it helps, but the cost of a P800 together with IP would probably be close to what you'd spend on an i1 system, and you'd get all the other benefits I discussed in addition to the profiles.  And you wouldn't have to fuss with learning to make great profiles.....lots of room for user input....and error.

 

Epson has a $300 rebate on the P800, I think until year end, and may still have an additional $50 rebate for trading up older Epson machines.  The profits are in the inks, so rebates (and dealer discounts) are frequent.

 

IP does have a free demo mode (includes unavoidable watermarks on prints), but of course you'd need a compatible printer to try.

 

Jeff

Edited December 12, 2016 by Jeff S

[Jeff S]

A bit more regarding costs... my perspective is similar to Brian's.  Printing is my end product for all this photography stuff, and I like to control all elements from camera to print and display.  Once I've committed to spend a few thousand bucks (or more) just on a lens, and lots more on a camera like an M, why wouldn't I spend under two grand on pretty much a state-of-the-art print set-up? In my darkroom days, money went into things like enlargers and sinks and such. The cost of inks is likely no more than I used to spend on film and chemicals, and the costs for other materials...paper, frames, etc...remain similar.  Moreover, the back end of the workflow is where I often get the most bang for my buck when it comes to print improvements.  Pretty simple decision for me.  YMMV.

 

Jeff

Edited December 12, 2016 by Jeff S

[Guest]

I'm looking at IP for background information, and have downloaded the manual.

It looks like they don't do a version for my Epson R3000, and the cost for a similar sized printer would be US$900 (shipped to UK).

Most discussions I have seen seem to be about B&W printing, whereas most of mine would be colour.

 

Jeff, do you use third party colour inks with IP?

I have found the results in Colour are just as good an improvement as for B&W . There may be little difference if I was using third party inks but all the pre prepared profiles that come with IP 10 would have been made with the Epson Ink set,so I am not going to try and reinvent the wheel . I can not imagine the results would improve with differant inks but that's a chance I am happy to take.

From my own perspective,photography has gone back 50 years to when I first became interested. The aim then was to put a 20x16 print on the wall or as a contestant in a "print battle" in a photo club competition. I now have lots of pictures of the English Lake District up to A2 on various walls in the house in colour and B&W. Sure I don't need IP10 to do this but it certainly makes things a lot easier. I waste less paper which is a definite consideration with A2 running at £5 to £7 per sheet.

[Wyck]

I also use IP10 and can not speak highly enough of it. 

 

Several months ago I was asked to produce 40 A3+ prints for an exhibition, yes I could have made this work without IP, however, I don't think I would have agreed to it without IP.  Perhaps this may have been due to confidence and lack of experience, but at least I could guarantee I would be producing the best possible prints I could on my Epson 3880.

 

I also had to have the dongle shipped to the UK.  It wasn't cheap, but as Brian P mentions there is a lot less waste and this is a big consideration when you look at the cost of the paper.

 

I have a ColorMunki Photo that I used to use to calibrate paper and screen, however, since buying an Eizo screen and IP it hasn't been used. 

[Jeff S]

Indeed, that's what soft-proofing is all about....seeing what you'll get and avoiding waste, both time and money.  The quality of the print is still (mostly) up to the user.

 

Jeff

[tobey bilek]

X rite makes one I would buy.      You print around 6  strips of colors on an 8x10.   Then read it with the device and repeat with different colors to fine tune.  There are around 100 colors is uses.

 

Not cheap, but nothing good in photography is cheap. 

[Jeff S]

X rite makes one I would buy.      You print around 6  strips of colors on an 8x10.   Then read it with the device and repeat with different colors to fine tune.  There are around 100 colors is uses.

 

Not cheap, but nothing good in photography is cheap. 

 

Linked in post #8.

 

Jeff

[LocalHero1953]

For info, current UK prices are:

Epson P800: £950-1000 

X-Rite I1 Pro: £1050-1300 depending on package

IP10: say £900-1100 depending on how you deal with import duties.

[Jeff S]

Is that with all Epson rebates (and maybe a dealer discount if carefully searched)?

 

I suggest you email IP (ColorByte) for info on best approach/deal internationally.  Without any taxes, fees, etc, the straight dollar to pound conversion is roughly £700 for IP10 using a 17" printer.

 

Have you added similar import fees to the profiling gear?

 

Jeff

Edited December 12, 2016 by Jeff S

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[LocalHero1953]

It is from a quick google search- I dare say I could get a discount with patience (e.g. the next Photography Show).

Brian has already been in touch with his experience of buying IP in the UK. My cost figure was based on the cheapest option ($695) + the quoted $100 shipping cost, plus VAT (20%) + any duties, and current exchange rates. 

I suspect most of these costs can be reduced with patience and ingenuity (X-Rite I1Pro is occasionally available on ebay).